Things you want to say

[amycat412]

Originally posted by justamom
.

I hope I'm more like amycat's Mom...yes I GET ON THEIR NERVES, but they know I love them and support them...

justamom-

something tells me you ARE more like my mom. But, also, when I was 19-20-21 I did not have the perspective that I do now, in my 30s, and, quite frankly -- the fact that my mom and I are SOOOO much alike was a constant thorn in my side that I rebelled against and that she rebelled against. It was a period of growth for both of us and we were at each other's throats. A venting post about my mom 10 years ago would have sounded like a lot of the others on this board. I think that is part of maturing and finding your own way, finding out who you are -- I mean this from the point of view of both the child who has left the nest and the mom who has to let the child go and grow and find their own way. We must find our own way, we must make our own mistakes -- its the only way we will become truly self-sufficient, mature, well-adjusted adults.

I am so thankful my mom and I found our way back to one another. It took a lot of growth on both our parts, but she is truly my best friend, there is nothing I can't tell her, nothing I don't tell her, and I don't know what I would do without her.


Amy

[James]

A word of caution: Psychoanlytic theory supposes that the women will relate to her mate the way she relates to her mom (adding sex of course . .. for some).

Basically that is the model the woman is taught, she seeks some of the same emotional security/relationship with her mate that she would expect from her mother, the primary care-giver.

And so interacts with him accordingly.


Something to think about.

[AXOLiz]

Ok, for all you who were following my previous rants, I need advice (but not about the assclown and his stuck-in-the-80's girlfriend).

About my two friends, we'll call one X and one Y because you never know who ends up reading these things. This is kind of the more detailed version of the "you're my bestest friend, don't make fun of me for making out in the hallway" story, for those who remember. So I went out with both of them and another one of my sisters this past weekend and it was hell. For the record, X is the one I'm pretty close to, and Y is the annoying one who is trying to get on some guy with a girlfriend and always goes on and on about how X is her "bestest friend ever" (whether X actually feels this way, I don't know, that'd be for her to say). We were planning on all going to a club after I got back from work, but when I got back to the house, the other sister who went with us told me that Y told her that she was too tired to go. I had to go home regardless, but I told the girl at the house I'd call her if anything ends up happening.

So I get home and my 16 year old sister is having a party and I thought I was going to die, so I call X on her cell phone out of sheer desperation to get out of my house. She's out at a restaurant with her older sister, her husband, and their friends, but told me if I wanted I could meet them there. So I drive out there even though it's 30 minutes away and when I get there I call the girl at the house to tell her we're just getting dinner. She wanted to still go out though, so I told her if she wanted to call Y, maybe we could meet them somewhere in the middle later. So Y calls my cell phone all pissy and asks to speak to X (who has her own cell phone, but whatever). She's all annoyed that we went out without her (even though she also called X during the day and told her that the reason she didn't want to go out is because the girl at the house didn't want to go, not that she was tired) so she was talking and talking and talking to X. We ended up having to drive to the house (an hour away) to pick up the girl there, drive out to Y's apartment (a half hour away from the house) so we could go to this club downtown. Later that night I'd have to drive from the apartment to the house (there's a half hour), then to X's house to drop her off (45 more minutes), then 20 to my house. Keep in mind I also have an 84 Chevy Celebrity that chugs gas, and I've been sick with the flu or a cold or something for a week. Plus I haven't been sleeping well because I've been stressed about other stuff. But to make a long story a little shorter, I ask X why we're doing this and she says "so Y doesn't get pissed off."

So we get to Y's apartment eventually (after she calls because we're not there fast enough...hello, we did all this crap for her) and then we go out. I knew I had to drive later so I had a few drinks at her apartment but that was it. We get to the club and Y and the girl from the house proceed to get drunk. The 4 of us are in this super-crowded room where it was so smoky and I had like 20 asses rubbing on me from all directions. Normally I wouldn't care, but like I said, I've been sick all week, so the smoke's making me cough. To make matters worse, Y keeps standing in front of me talking to the two other girls all night. Now the girl from the house knows about my issues with them, so she drags Y's drunk ass away for a while and X stays with me, but she could tell I wasn't having fun. And she didn't want to just leave me, but she seemed kind of annoyed that I was in a foul mood, which I can't really blame her for, but at that point she could've gone off with them and I wouldn't have cared. The two drinks hit me pretty hard and it just made me super-depressed. Anyway, eventually we leave, it sucked the whole time, and during the ride home I said maybe 4 words to X because I was trying to keep from crying. I was just so frustrated with stuff in general, so that didn't help. And now Y wants to do this again next weekend, except she wants everyone and their mother to come over to her apartment, ger super-drunk, and then find some way to get downtown. Considering how I haven't been a happy drunk for months, you can see how much I'm jumping for joy at this idea, but apparently X is all about going and getting wasted this time. Nothing says fun like being the only sober one in the room.

Now for all that babbling, here's my point. Everytime I go out with them, I feel like the thrid wheel, and it's only because of Y. X and I have a tendency to talk to each other a lot since we have a similar sense of humor, and it used to bother Y so I tried to tone it down for her sake, but since then she's just made a point to talk about things that I'm completely excluded from, like the apartment they're going to get, how she wants X in her wedding (hello, she's not even dating anyone), how she's her "bestest friend ever," etc. And it happens all the time. Plus she gets super-mad if X and I do anything without her, even though they've both gone out without me a bunch of times. At one point she threw a fit because X and I carpool sometimes. We live pretty close to each other, why should we both drive? I always end up feeling dragged into a competition for X's friendship and I hate it.

I've kept my mouth shut to this point because I figured I'd be close to X no matter what Y did, but it's starting to affect our friendship, mostly because it's gotten to the point where I can't see X unless Y comes too since she seriously calls X every freakin day on weekends to schedule something to do. I think X figures I won't care about coming along since we usually don't have concrete plans anyway, and she always makes a point of inviting me which I appreciate, but I'm so sick of Y that I don't want anything to do with either of them at this point.

It just upsets me that X and I used to be so close, and now it's like I can't even talk to her when we're out anywhere because I'm so frustrated and upset with the situation to the point where I'm fuming, and maybe I'm the only one with this problem, but when I'm pissed that's all I want to talk about. At the same time I'd feel bad for putting X in the middle of this (even though apparently Y bitches about me to her all the time). I really want to say something to the effect of "I'm not going out with you two anymore, if you want to see me it has to be just you." but I don't want to be a big bitch and make her choose between us even though I'm really making the choice for her. I don't want to hang out with Y, so if she wants to go out with her, that's cool. I just don't want any part of it. But part of me knows if I say that I'll probably never see X because Y throws a fit if she doesn't get to hang out with her when she calls (which is seriously every day over a weekend), and then she bitches even more if we go somewhere without her, even if it's just to Wal-mart.

I can't help wondering how it's going to be when they move into an apartment together - Y gets mad if X and I talk about anything and she can't completely hear because she assumes we're talking about her. How can I call their phone - what's she gonna do, listen in on the conversation? And how will I ever be able to plan on doing anything with X if she lives with Y? Y will invite herself along all the time, and X isn't the type to stop her since, in the end, she's the one who'll have to live with her every day and doesn't want to cause huge problems. And it's super-frustrating because I can't tell if X doesn't notice how upset this all makes me or just doesn't want to get in the middle. Considering other people have noticed how Y has been super-possessive, I can't believe X hasn't seen it too, but it kind of hurts that I'm going through all this and it seems like she doesn't really care, even though it's probably because she's friends with both of us and is the type to stay out of other peoples' arguments.

I'm so frustrated with all of this and I really want to say something, but I don't want to lose X as a friend, and it's to the point where everyone who knows all of us has just been telling me to ignore them and get new friends. I honestly wouldn't care if I never talked to Y again at this point, but if I say anything to her, she'll twist it around like she always does and make me sound like this massive bitch. Any advice on how I can deal with this? Sorry for the long post and thanks for reading it.

Liz

[AggieDZ]

Girl, just take that last post of yours, write in the real names and send it straight to X with an intro like:

X, I value your judgement so, I'd like to talk this over with with you and see what you think. I am sure you've noticed that personality differences between Y and myself are making group outings really uncomfortable for me......


In cases like this, honesty really is the best policy.

Usually, I'd recommend talking to Y too, but from the way you say she behaves, it doesn't seem like she'd take it very rationally.

Best of luck!

[deltaphi94]

In cases like this, honesty really is the best policy.

Usually, I'd recommend talking to Y too, but from the way you say she behaves, it doesn't seem like she'd take it very rationally.


I agree. Friends value your opinions and feelings, and a healthy friendship does not mean holding your frustrations in. Take a deep breath and talk to X about the situation.

[justamom]

Four months is a long time to be unhappy.
Your post shows you are nearing a breaking point-getting ready to explode.
Honestly, if I were in the middle of this, I'd get a little ticked off... It's like having TWO people trying to tell me who I can and can not hang out with.
You need a new circle of friends. Over simplified? Maybe, but you don't have to make a statement, "I'm finding new friends!" Just DO it. I'll bet you end up much happier. Wean yourself from the threesome and let the chips (your friend) fall where they may.

[Peaches-n-Cream]

I think that when I was in college, I was X and I had Y in my life. I felt like she wanted every part of me. I hated being the object of her neurotic insecurities so I stopped indulging her. She then turned her hostility on me. My best friend told me that the movie "Single White Female" was about my Y. On the plus side, I haven't seen Y since she graduated.
I agree with the previous advice. Talk to your friend and also expand your horizons to include a new circle of friends. Avoid that Y because she seems to be poison to you. You don't need that crap in your life. BTW, your friend will get sick of her soon enough. When they live together, she will see the full picture and probably dump her. That's what happened to me.

[SigkapAlumWSU]

I know I'm a little behind in the ranting, but I just have to get it out.

Mom- I love you, but you annoy the hell out of me. Don't fight with me everytime I see you. Just because you made mistakes and married the wrong guys before dad doesn't mean I will. I am an adult and I am capable of using my best judgment. And I don't care what pills you are taking for your back, get off them. And get something for the depression I know you have.

Friend #1-Yes you have money. Yes you can pay for everthing. So don't complain when you can't put anything else on the credit card cause you've already charged too much. You and I and everyone else knows that you NEED to marry rich, you would be unhappy doing anything else, so realize it! I know you love him, but he's not going to move for your career, and you will be so unhappy. I like him too, but I you already know how you really feel about it. You are my best friend and I do love you, but can we please stop this whole telephone-2nd grade thing where I say something and it goes around the entire group and when it comes back is all twisted around and not at all what I said??

J-I love you. I love everything about you. You make me feel wonderful and loved and all the things I've ever wanted. But Yes I hate her, and yes I still think about what happened, and every time we fight I still picture the two of you in my head. I hated that you hurt me like that, and I hated that you said that when it happened you weren't sure about us at the time. I know you hated that I went back to school when I did, but it was my decision. Yes, I could have decided earlier, and we could be better off now, but it's my life, and this is what I want to do with it. I hate that you weren't sure about us when it happened, but if I even talk to a guy when I'm with my sisters at a bar, you get all "I can't trust you, and why didn't you think about how I felt?" at me. I'm in college! There are guys here, and I do want to talk to them. It doesn't mean I'm gonna shack up with them, and not every guy who talks to me wants to sleep with me. And if they still talk to me after I say I'm engaged, it doesn't mean that they are scum who wanna shack, it means that some of them actually do want to talk to me just because. No my parents don't like you right now, but I can't do a damn thing about it. I can't change the way they feel. But no matter how many times my dad says he just want's me to be happy, no matter what I do, you still think that they are never going to accept you. You are right, I haven't dated much, and I never did have the college experience my first year. And I do want it. What happened to the "I want to you date and go out there and make sure that I'm the one for you. You haven't dated as much as I have. I've seen what's out there and I'm sure, but you still need to see." Now You don't want me to talk to any guy! Maybe I do want to date. Maybe I do want to see what happened if I brought a guy home that my parents liked. Maybe I do want to see a guy who understands why I'm greek and is ok with it instead of swearing that our kids will never be. I don't want to have kids right now, I'm in college and I want to finish and not be like my parents, 40 with 2 kids in college. I want to get it right this time. Remember, that's why I went back.

To J's Mom- I know you think that I'm taking your little boy and only son away, and I'm this evil woman for doing that, but what do you want me to do?? And I'm sure that his ex never missed a family birthday of anything, but I'm human. I like you, and I consider you all my family, but don't keep comparing me to someone else. And no, I'll never be as good a cook as you, does that make you feel better?

The Group- Stop talking about each other. Don't think that you know more about my relationship than I do. If you are mad at someone, TELL THEM. If you want to say something to me, tell me rather than telling 3 other people and wait for it to get all f-ed up when I finally hear it.

Dave-He's my fiance. I'm gonna stay with him on weekends no matter what you think. Just because you were there first doesn't make it your apt. He pays the rent too.

Dad-I love you. I want you to be proud of everthing I do. Thank you for telling me I'm wonderful no matter what. And I will be happy, it might just take a little time.

Sorry so long, but Ohhhhh.. that feels so much better.

[shopgirl]

Originally posted by James
A word of caution: Psychoanlytic theory supposes that the women will relate to her mate the way she relates to her mom (adding sex of course . .. for some).

Basically that is the model the woman is taught, she seeks some of the same emotional security/relationship with her mate that she would expect from her mother, the primary care-giver.

And so interacts with him accordingly.


Something to think about.

I find this very interesting, considering I was a Psychology major. Actually, I've never heard this theory before. Can you provide any other information. Whose theory is it?

[justamom]

Sometimes, information is hard to find links for or when you have read a lot in an area, continuing to learn, one can't always put a name with a theory. For instance, the recent discussion on the death penalty-I have stored my links and will post if the discussion resumes, but for the life of me, I can't find a link to a theory specifically associating the expiramentor's expectatons in a double blind study that has a direct influence on the outcome of the study. Yes, there are lots of links, but none to the affect on ions. Does this mean it doesn't exist? Heck I read it SOMEWHERE!!! It was once a useless piece of knowledge that I never thought would come in handy so I didn't "take notes".

I guess I'm getting old and "senior moments" are rearing their ugly heads. I have read and learned a LOT in my life since leaving college. MOST of my real education has come after graduation because I love to read. I wish I could post a link to everything stored in my brain, but sometimes you have to consider that the internet search isn't always productive and you may have donated that old book to the library. Or, perhaps you sold it so many times during the semester you can't readily locate it. I would hate to see all our exchanges and dialogue limited to information that could only be supported by readily available research. That would be too limiting. On theother hand, I have read that it is the father that is the physical model for the attraction a female has to her mate. For instance, if her father bore a bead, the girl would most likely be attracted to hairier men.
Now where can I find a link to show I actually read that? You got me!

[hocnsoc81]

Originally posted by justamom

On theother hand, I have read that it is the father that is the physical model for the attraction a female has to her mate.

Me too.
And, it is the mother that is the physical model for the attraction a male has to his mate.

[dzrose93]

Reading your story, I was constantly amazed at how similar it is to my own situation. I also have a very good friend who I used to hang out with all the time. Then another girl (Y) who we knew from college moved to the area, just a couple of miles from my friend, and now they are attached at the hip. Y is very jealous of any time that my friend and I spend together, and makes it very unpleasant whenever we all go out as a group. A few months ago, I finally just quit going out with them altogether, and when my friend asked why, I told her that Y and I are just two very different types of people, and that it's very hard for me to get a word in edgewise whenever she's around. My friend either couldn't or didn't want to understand that explanation, because she still plans girls' nights out, wanting the 3 of us to go out together and gets upset when I turn her down. However, anytime that I try to plan something just the 2 of us, she never has the time.

Finally, I just gave up. I don't call my friend and I don't e-mail her. If she wants to see me, then she has to make the effort from now on, because I'm through playing high school games. I've found that hanging out with other girlfriends is more fun and offers much less drama than hanging out with X and Y.

I suggest that you do what I have done: hang out with your other friends, meet new people, and let the two of them just entertain each other.

[shopgirl]

Originally posted by justamom
On theother hand, I have read that it is the father that is the physical model for the attraction a female has to her mate. For instance, if her father bore a bead, the girl would most likely be attracted to hairier men.
Now where can I find a link to show I actually read that? You got me!

Hello justamom

That's what I remember learning, that it's the father who is the model for the daughter. So, what James wrote threw me for a loop. I did not mean for it to seem like, "and where did you hear THAT one from?" I'm genuinely interested in the source of this theory. I just thought I'd ask. Perhaps he does know. That's all. But thanks for the reply.

shopgirl

[justamom]

shopgirl, this is a kissy, kissy, huggy, huggy reply to you. As soon as I signed off on that reply, I thought "Oh, I hope I didn't sound like I as lecturng shopgirl!' LOL You are so missed as a poster-You haven't spoken up much since I ran the boards last summer-and then to give a long windy response... (I know I ramble!)
I didn't take what you said in any negative way(knowing your posting style, who could???). I had just fnished a search earlier this week looking for some backup to a post I had made. It took such a DANG long time and I still didn't find that one little piece that could have slam dunked a good point. I felt sorry for James thinking he would have to go through the same thing.

I SO SORRY!

[shopgirl]

Originally posted by justamom
shopgirl, this is a kissy, kissy, huggy, huggy reply to you. As soon as I signed off on that reply, I thought "Oh, I hope I didn't sound like I as lecturng shopgirl!' LOL You are so missed as a poster-You haven't spoken up much since I ran the boards last summer-and then to give a long windy response... (I know I ramble!)
I didn't take what you said in any negative way(knowing your posting style, who could???). I had just fnished a search earlier this week looking for some backup to a post I had made. It took such a DANG long time and I still didn't find that one little piece that could have slam dunked a good point. I felt sorry for James thinking he would have to go through the same thing.

I SO SORRY!

Thanks justamom! I didn't take it in a bad way at all. I was hoping that I didn't seem like I was being rude. I think we're both on the same page.

I do need to post more. I'm so reluctant to put down my opinions lately. I used to be very opinionated. Now that I'm older things are not so black and white...there's so much gray. Since I realize this, I find it difficult to put down what I feel b/c I tend to ramble and to see things on both sides. I exhaust myself.

I'm trying to put forth more of an effort to be involved around the boards.

Thank you for your kind words.

Always,
Shopgirl