too broke to bury their dead

[UGAalum94]

There's a lesson in Detroit, but it is kind of interesting and important to realize how hard it would be to prevent, even if people were inclined to sort through and assign responsibility, which I don't think the parties responsible and their brethren other places are all that inclined to do. Expecting people to act against their immediate self-interest can be a hard sell, particularly when there's little reason to have long term trust.

I agree that the rest of us can look at it and try to act according to our interpretations of its lessons. There's a value in understanding it absolutely, but when you said "to keep it from happening in other places/industries" I think you're being too optimistic. I think the best we can hope for is to keep it from happening at such a grand scale, which of course, is still important.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Sort of.

You do have to admit that single-party rule of certain parts of the state has had its consequences.

But single party rule by the other party probably isn't the answer.

Republicans have been screwing up Georgia for probably the last five years. It's even more frustrating because I voted for the incompetence.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Get the state to realize that ultimately, for it to succeed, businesses and wealth producing engines which produce something have to succeed. The state shouldn't get involved in propping up the various entities which hinder business, they should support business (of course at the same time, making sure business isn't out there actively hurting people or the environment).

In short, if everyone had voted Republican, Michigan wouldn't be in this mess.

You do realize that we had a Republican governor for 12 years, right? From 1990-2002, when the auto industry began to lose market share? And that 7 of our 15 Congressmen are Republicans? We are considered a swing state for a reason.

[Kevin]

Reread what I said before making non-responsive replies. I know damn well that Michigan has been a key swing state, but Detroit-proper is anything but up for grabs with respect to its political allegiance.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by gamma

Shouldn't the state of Michigan have elected someone from the Communist party? China has most of the manufacturing jobs right?
Where are all the manufacturing jobs in Republican dominated states?

Honda just opened up a new plant in Indiana in Dec. 2008. In fact, almost all the new major manufacturing operations right now are locating in 'red' states, primarily due to the less expensive worker's compensation regimes, lower salary requirements for workers, and better protections in tort law.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Reread what I said before making non-responsive replies. I know damn well that Michigan has been a key swing state, but Detroit-proper is anything but up for grabs with respect to its political allegiance.

But, two of the Big Three are not headquartered in Detroit proper. Chrysler's Headquarters are in a solidly Republican county. Ford is in a swing city. Most of the auto plants are not actually in Detroit proper nor are the hundreds of suppliers. I didn't realize that people didn't know this. It's an interesting misconception. The Detroit Zoo isn't even in Detroit proper. The Detroit Pistons don't play in Detroit either. It's crazy, I know. I have often wondered why no Republicans even attempt to run for Mayor in the city of Detroit, but they don't. It's the only place I've ever seen a ticket be Democrat vs Democrat. Maybe if they ran, they'd win. If they don't run, there's no chance. I'm not sure they're willing to take on the city's issues...lol.

ETA: I don't see any reason for the domestic auto companies to open new factories when they have the option of re-tooling existing ones. The foreign auto companies didn't have factories here until the last couple decades so obviously they have to build them and open them. However, Chrysler did just build a new Trenton Engine building to replace their aging one and it will be opening next summer. That's one that I know of for sure.

[Kevin]

Manufacturing is still ~13% of the U.S. economy. That's a rather hefty contraction but it's still a big part of the overall makeup of our economy. No doubt that Asia fares pretty well with respect to the growth of the sector. You have to admit though, unless you're GM and you have most of your operations consolidated in Michigan (which no doubt is a big cost savings), it just makes better business sense to locate a facility in a right to work state.

[Kevin]

By locating in the U.S., you avoid import tariffs and have reasonable assurances of a stable business environment -- something you don't get in places like Asia.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by Kevin

By locating in the U.S., you avoid import tariffs and have reasonable assurances of a stable business environment -- something you don't get in places like Asia.

Does this offset the incredible decrease in labor and materials costs?

Perhaps it does for cars (although the "goodwill" accrued by Toyota etc. may actually have reasonable offset value beyond the basic cost), but it undoubtedly does not for other products, if we assume the business world operates at least somewhat rationally.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Does this offset the incredible decrease in labor and materials costs?

I imagine the answer for that would be "it depends."