The Murder of Trayvon Martin

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

LMAOOOOO!!!!!! Throwback!

LOL. It was a perplexing back and forth.

I just finished watching Joe Oliver on Piers Morgan. I respect everyone's insight and respect the desire of those who love Zimmerman to speak out. However, it is no coincidence that Zimmerman's bestfriend who is appearing on all of these shows is a Black man. "Some of my bestfriends are Black."

Oliver discussed a number of things including how Zimmerman is not white as the news reported; that Zimmerman now has PTSD; and that Trayvon Martin was bigger than Zimmerman. I respect hearing every side of the story. I also look forward to this getting out of the court of public opinion and getting to an actual court.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

If k_s walks past you on the street at night with a business suit and a briefcase, you will probably react differently than if k_s walked past you on the street in Timbs, a beater, and XXXL pants that are sagging. Does this mean that one k_s is better than the other? No, but it does mean that one k_s will be PERCEIVED a different way.

I have a fear of Black men in dark streets PERIOD so I will be terrified of you even with the business suit. That business suit does not keep you from whooping my ass. In fact, where in the hell did you get your business suit, from a work release program or did you steal it from a white man?

Argggghhhh...I'm calling the po-po just in case!!!

[agzg]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

If k_s walks past you on the street at night with a business suit and a briefcase, you will probably react differently than if k_s walked past you on the street in Timbs, a beater, and XXXL pants that are sagging. Does this mean that one k_s is better than the other? No, but it does mean that one k_s will be PERCEIVED a different way.

Sure, perceived, fine. But shouldn't perceptions be challenged? Changing your appearance to fit what you think would make a white man more comfortable (keeping in mind that white Justin Bieber is not perceived the same in the exact same outfit) strikes me as counter intuitive - why not go about your business being a k_ass while wearing whatever you want to wear in your off time?

Clearly it's complicated. I just don't think it can be boiled down to "don't wear hoodies or you'll be perceived to be threatening/suspicious." If no black men wore hoodies, and they all wore suits, how long until it becomes "don't wear suits or you'll be perceived to be threatening/suspicious." Maybe it's an oversimplification on my part, but part of the message of "don't wear hoodies" is "don't be any color but white."

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by agzg

Sure, perceived, fine. But shouldn't perceptions be challenged? Changing your appearance to fit what you think would make a white man more comfortable (keeping in mind that white Justin Bieber is not perceived the same in the exact same outfit) strikes me as counter intuitive - why not go about your business being a k_ass while wearing whatever you want to wear in your off time?

Clearly it's complicated. I just don't think it can be boiled down to "don't wear hoodies or you'll be perceived to be threatening/suspicious." If no black men wore hoodies, and they all wore suits, how long until it becomes "don't wear suits or you'll be perceived to be threatening/suspicious." Maybe it's an oversimplification on my part, but part of the message of "don't wear hoodies" is "don't be any color but white."

Well, when I see white young men with the hood of their hoodie up (when it isn't cold or raining) and sagging pants, I always think "He looks like a police artist sketch of a wanted guy" It really doesn't matter what color he is when he's dressed like that to me. It's a "thug" look and anybody wearing it is going to be assumed to be a thug to me. Is that right? Probably not. I have noticed a difference in how I'm treated by salespeople in a store based on what I'm wearing. If I'm in jeans and a sweatshirt or t-shirt, they ignore me. If I'm shopping after work in a suit, I get lots of attention.

Not that anybody ever deserves to be killed over what they're wearing.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by agzg

Sure, perceived, fine. But shouldn't perceptions be challenged?

Challenging stereotypes/power structures/etc. often results in things like "dead kids" though ... I think, in that regard, we're speaking past each other.

[I2K Beta Mu]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

Let's try this again.

1. NO, Trayvon did not deserve to die because of his outfit.

2. YES, Geraldo was an idiot for saying that the outfit resulted in his death.

BUT

1. Taking Trayvon out of the picture, we all know that if you dress a certain way, people will perceive you a certain way.

If k_s walks past you on the street at night with a business suit and a briefcase, you will probably react differently than if k_s walked past you on the street in Timbs, a beater, and XXXL pants that are sagging. Does this mean that one k_s is better than the other? No, but it does mean that one k_s will be PERCEIVED a different way.

2. Geraldo is a media personality. He doesn't make money if nobody cares about what he has to say. To all the people who say "HOW DARE HE!? WHO DOES HE THINK HE IS!?" -- it's giving him headlines. It's making him relevant again.

Geraldo is a journalist and his job is to talk about the story. He's voicing his opinion and saying shit he doesn't need to.

With the other part of your post, you can walk down the street with whatever, but does that give me the right to follow you, chase you as you're trying to get away, shoot you, and then turn around and call self defense? I feel what you're saying about how folks would react or think, but to be the aggressor like Zimmerman was, and then still to this very day NOT be charged? That's bullshit.

[I2K Beta Mu]

Originally Posted by CrashTestPelosi

\

What do you think about a black kid is walking down the street wearing a new pair of limited edition kicks and another black kid walks up behind him and shoots him in the head and then takes his shoes. Is that ok? That is a real story. Why no outrage? Was the shooter the wrong color?

There is no wrong or right color. But black on black crimes are not handled like they should be handled. White on black crimes or the other way around are handled differently, I believe. This shit has been going on for centuries, which is why I have issues with folks saying the race issues in this country has come a long way, and then turning around using Obama as an excuse as of how far this country has come. It hasn't. It's still the same shit different day. But you sound kind of racist. Some of the shit you're saying like "whitey" "black neighborhoods being fucked up", shit like that. What's up with that?

[I2K Beta Mu]

Originally Posted by CrashTestPelosi

I will let you pick any justice system you want. THe only kicker is that same system will apply to everyone. The problem is you will backtrack as soon as a brother gets arrested.

This is what makes you so fucking stupid. The system doesn't apply to everybody the same way.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by I2K Beta Mu

This is what makes you so fucking stupid. The system doesn't apply to everybody the same way.

Lol. He's going to get banned soon. Same shit, different day.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by I2K Beta Mu

Geraldo is a journalist and his job is to talk about the story. He's voicing his opinion and saying shit he doesn't need to.

Do you really think Geraldo is the only journalist who spins stories for the sake of increased ratings?

With the other part of your post, you can walk down the street with whatever, but does that give me the right to follow you, chase you as you're trying to get away, shoot you, and then turn around and call self defense? I feel what you're saying about how folks would react or think, but to be the aggressor like Zimmerman was, and then still to this very day NOT be charged? That's bullshit.

I've said multiple times that I was looking at this outside of the Trayvon Martin context.

[I2K Beta Mu]

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

Do you really think Geraldo is the only journalist who spins stories for the sake of increased ratings?

Did I say that he was?

Originally Posted by knight_shadow

I've said multiple times that I was looking at this outside of the Trayvon Martin context.

And what I am saying to you is that you are just as wrong as Geraldo.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by I2K Beta Mu

Did I say that he was?

You insinuated that he was the only TV journalist to "make" a news story for ratings. There are PLENTY of anchors who pick minuscule things and blow them up for the sake of ratings.

And what I am saying to you is that you are just as wrong as Geraldo.

I reiterated that part because you and others continue to say "folks don't need to get shot based on what they wear." I have said multiple times that I agree with that. I don't know why it keeps getting brought up, though.

[DaemonSeid]

NEW YORK (AP) — Fox News Channel commentator Geraldo Rivera said Tuesday that he's sorry for suggesting that a hoodie worn by unarmed Florida teenager Trayvon Martin was as much responsible for his death as the neighborhood watch captain who shot him.

Rivera said a conversation with his oldest son on Monday convinced him he was wrong. Rivera said it was the first time 32-year-old Gabriel Rivera had said he was ashamed of something his dad had said — and it caused the dad a sleepless night.

"He had never, ever used language like that," Rivera said. "It was like, 'Whoa, what have I done that would make my son say that?'"

Rivera's comments last week triggered an angry response among people concerned about the case involving the 17-year-old Martin, who was carrying a bag of candy and a can of iced tea while returning to the Sanford, Fla., home of his father's fiancée when he was shot last month.

Martin, who was black, was shot by George Zimmerman, who has a white father and a Hispanic mother and has said he was acting in self-defense. The lack of legal action taken against Zimmerman has stoked racial tensions and led to protests around the country and debate about self-defense legislation.

Rivera said he was apologizing "for offending anyone."

"I apologize for the language," he said. "I don't apologize at all for the substance of my advice. I was trying to save lives."

Rivera said his oldest son was witness to tension between his father and brother, 24-year-old Cruz Rivera, over the young man's clothing. Rivera said he wanted urban parents to realize that clothing their children wear — such as hooded T-shirts or low-slung pants — could appear menacing to people who don't know them and could put them unnecessarily in danger.

http://news.yahoo.com/foxs-geraldo-r...221726122.html

[knight_shadow]

^^^ Ditto. I thought it was a jumpsuit.

[DaemonSeid]

Rep. Bobby Rush gets kicked off the floor for wearing a hoodie.

I salute you sir...

And make sure you listen to the end of the video