African American women in CPC, opinions, please?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Gusteau

Exactly, didn't anyone at the school think that the action would highlight the issue even more?

I agree. I know an older NPHCer (she wasn't a student) who worked for Greek Life and advised the NPC. She wasn't a recruitment counselor but her experience highlights what we're talking about.

She absolutely LOVED working with the NPC and it was a breath of fresh air from working with the NPHC, which was too familiar for her. One thing that she always noticed was that she was either the only nonwhite woman everywhere she went for the NPC; or she was one of only a few nonwhite women. And these were pretty big chapters. That's not bad in and of itself because I firmly believe that most of our GLOs have the racial and ethnic composition that we were formally and informally intended to have. Plus, we don't have a whole lot of "other race" interestees and applicants, therefore, it is usually not an issue of people being discriminated against.

But, it was funny because her presence highlighted the lack thereof. The nonwhite NPCers definitely latched onto her. The white NPCers loved her but everyone knew that there weren't any or many women in their chapters who "looked" like her. It became a topic quite often.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by Gusteau

Exactly, didn't anyone at the school think that the action would highlight the issue even more?

Furthermore, how does having women from a vastly different council as recruitment counselors benefit the PNM?

This is what I was thinking. It's one thing for us (as NPC groups) to require our own members to learn our formal recruitment rules and serve as advisors to PNMs - first off I feel like that's a lot to ask of someone that's from a different council. NPC members *should* know that stuff anyway (and I know they don't).

Second, I'd like to know if the NPHC women disaffiliated like an NPC member would - I don't know how I would feel if I loved my Rho Gamma and thought MAYBE I would end up in her chapter and then found out that not only is she not in the chapter I joined, she's not even in the same council.

For what it's worth, I don't like the idea of NIC members recruiting for NPC sororities or NPC women attending NPHC interest meetings either. When it's something that's oh-so-specific to a certain council, it should be done by members of that council only, particularly with things as important as recruitment.

[BluPhire]

Brettany Payne, president of Phi Beta Sigma Sorority, Inc., also an NPHC chapter, became a Gamma Chi with Martin for recruitment. She was very pleased with the outcome of the black women who went through CPC recruitment.

Ummm Huh?

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by agzg

NPC women attending NPHC interest meetings

I don't see the point of them attending these events.

Originally Posted by BluPhire

Ummm Huh?

Clearly, this reporter did research

ETA: I want to know how the woman who received a bid "broke the mold"

[agzg]

I do believe that sometimes NPHC sorority members participate in CPC - but after looking at this school's greek life website, that doesn't seem to be the case. In fact, I kindof don't like thier website, now that I'm griping about it - there's a "sororities" section, an "NPHC" section, and a "fraternities section."

Wow.

[knight_shadow]

Originally Posted by agzg

I do believe that sometimes NPHC sorority members participate in CPC - but after looking at this school's greek life website, that doesn't seem to be the case. In fact, I kindof don't like thier website, now that I'm griping about it - there's a "sororities" section, an "NPHC" section, and a "fraternities section."

Wow.

I see that a lot.

Fraternity Rush, Sorority Recruitment, and Other Greek Organizations

[ellebud]

.........gosh am I happy I live on the west coast. We may live in LaLa land but at least this issue doesn't come up in my daughter's school as far as I know. Looking through this year's bid day celebration pictures at my daughters house I know that I am correct. (And if you remember, back in the day when I went through recruitment Jewish girls could only join one house.)

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by ellebud

.........gosh am I happy I live on the west coast. We may live in LaLa land but at least this issue doesn't come up in my daughter's school as far as I know. Looking through this year's bid day celebration pictures at my daughters house I know that I am correct. (And if you remember, back in the day when I went through recruitment Jewish girls could only join one house.)

Yessss, some people's accounts of the west coast have an awesome way of making people confuse "tokenism" with real cohesion; or confuse seeing browner faces (not tan) in bid day pictures with the issue never coming up.

That's why it is no surprise when people learn "you can pledge my chapter but we can't be 'friends' or you can't really know me outside of this GLO and campus context" or "let's get some Hispanic, Asian, and/or Black members...but then let's pretend that we don't notice race and ethnicity and pretend we're in some dumb melting pot...although I wouldn't do this outside of my GLO context."

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Yessss, some people's accounts of the west coast have an awesome way of making people confuse "tokenism" with real cohesion; or confuse seeing browner faces (not tan) in bid day pictures with the issue never coming up.

That's why it is no surprise when people learn "you can pledge my chapter but we can't be 'friends' or you can't really know me outside of this GLO and campus context" or "let's get some Hispanic, Asian, and/or Black members...but then let's pretend that we don't notice race and ethnicity and pretend we're in some dumb melting pot...although I wouldn't do this outside of my GLO context."

Yeah, it's not as easy as some people make it out to be. It's not just the West Coast,either--look at composites at the NPC sororities at the Ivies, MIT, and other schools. I think people like to be like all, "we're liberal and/or 'smart'--we can handle friends of other races as long as they are just like us!" But maybe I'm jaded...or I just need a nap.

I'm kind of bored over the NPC minority thing, but I'm not 18 either. I think I cared more then.

[sigmadiva]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Yessss, some people's accounts of the west coast have an awesome way of making people confuse "tokenism" with real cohesion; or confuse seeing browner faces (not tan) in bid day pictures with the issue never coming up.

That's why it is no surprise when people learn "you can pledge my chapter but we can't be 'friends' or you can't really know me outside of this GLO and campus context" or "let's get some Hispanic, Asian, and/or Black members...but then let's pretend that we don't notice race and ethnicity and pretend we're in some dumb melting pot...although I wouldn't do this outside of my GLO context."

See, this right here is why I question AfAm women who join NPCs. I think that in theory any woman should join any sisterhood that she feels is right/best for her. But, in all reality, issues like you mentioned occur.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by sigmadiva

See, this right here is why I question AfAm women who join NPCs. I think that in theory any woman should join any sisterhood that she feels is right/best for her. But, in all reality, issues like you mentioned occur.

Those issues may occur--BUT, you have to realize that many, many Black women who join NPC sororities are used to being the "Only" in their social contexts, in their schools, neighborhoods, what have you. Even if NPHC Greek Life is part of their family or social context, it may not be something they'll think of doing. Some of them might not feel completely comfortable around large groups of unrelated black people. Whether or not that's right or wrong isn't for me to say--I can't judge teenagers I don't know.

So, many go to college wanting to do the same thing their non-Black friends are doing. In that case, they are joining the sisterhood that feels right to them. You'll see that there are a good number of Black NPC members here who have remained active as alumnae, and had good experiences. Others might "discover" their blackness in college and regret their decision.

So, I can't "question" those young women, because they're just doing what they know best at the time.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

So, many go to college wanting to do the same thing their non-Black friends are doing. In that case, they are joining the sisterhood that feels right to them. You'll see that there are a good number of Black NPC members here who have remained active as alumnae, and had good experiences. Others might "discover" their blackness in college and regret their decision.

That's one good thing about black NPC girls who are NPHC-aware. There's this family/internalized pressure that's like "I don't care if you joined a white sorority, you BETTER be in it for life."

If that didn't come out right, shut up. You know what I mean.

[sigmadiva]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

Those issues may occur--BUT, you have to realize that many, many Black women who join NPC sororities are used to being the "Only" in their social contexts, in their schools, neighborhoods, what have you. Even if NPHC Greek Life is part of their family or social context, it may not be something they'll think of doing. Some of them might not feel completely comfortable around large groups of unrelated black people. Whether or not that's right or wrong isn't for me to say--I can't judge teenagers I don't know.

So, many go to college wanting to do the same thing their non-Black friends are doing. In that case, they are joining the sisterhood that feels right to them. You'll see that there are a good number of Black NPC members here who have remained active as alumnae, and had good experiences. Others might "discover" their blackness in college and regret their decision.

So, I can't "question" those young women, because they're just doing what they know best at the time.

So my "question" is why would an AfAm woman want to join an org where she MAY be shunned outside certain contexts of her GLO (based on the implied reason of her race). I don't question to judge. I question to try to understand the reason.

Why would she purposely put herself through that? It seems that she would be cheated out of the full experience of sisterhood.

And btw, I too have been the "only one" in certain situations, so I understand what you mean.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

Those issues may occur--BUT, you have to realize that many, many Black women who join NPC sororities are used to being the "Only" in their social contexts, in their schools, neighborhoods, what have you. Even if NPHC Greek Life is part of their family or social context, it may not be something they'll think of doing. Some of them might not feel completely comfortable around large groups of unrelated black people. Whether or not that's right or wrong isn't for me to say--I can't judge teenagers I don't know.

So, many go to college wanting to do the same thing their non-Black friends are doing. In that case, they are joining the sisterhood that feels right to them. You'll see that there are a good number of Black NPC members here who have remained active as alumnae, and had good experiences. Others might "discover" their blackness in college and regret their decision.

So, I can't "question" those young women, because they're just doing what they know best at the time.

Thank you. You are awesome. You already knew that.

I remember the Black men and Black women in NPC and NIC organizations that I have interacted with in undergrad and taught when I got older. Except for one of them, all of these Black men and women were obviously and admittedly "mimicking" what they think "white GLOers" should dress like (which includes a young Black woman who was in denial about her hair texture), act like, and talk like. It even extended to things like "mimicking" the facial expressions of their white counterparts which sounds strange but a lot of things we do are based on socialization--those who know what "dual identity" and "double consciousness" are will know what I mean.

I recall being told by an older Black student who was an NPCer that she wishes she had learned about the NPHC before joining an NPC. That annoyed the hell out of me because I don't believe in being apologetic and explaining yourself when it comes to such life choices. Sure, you can never be NPHC but all is not lost if you're looking for "the Black experience" and philanthropy that focuses on the African diaspora. Afterall, she could still hang with the other Black students (some of whom weren't in any sorority or fraternity) instead of relegating herself to the "cool Black girl who is unlike other Black people we've met" in most of her NPC and NIC interactions.

Originally Posted by Senusret I

That's one good thing about black NPC girls who are NPHC-aware. There's this family/internalized pressure that's like "I don't care if you joined a white sorority, you BETTER be in it for life."

If that didn't come out right, shut up. You know what I mean.

LOL. I hate you in the most loving way possible.

[FSUZeta]

which i find interesting, because i would venture to say that we are probably around the same age, and we and many of the other sororities at fsu had jewish members.

i would have thought california would have been more progressive.