|
» GC Stats |
Members: 329,759
Threads: 115,670
Posts: 2,205,206
|
| Welcome to our newest member, zryanusasd8848 |
|
 |
|
07-07-2010, 07:25 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: cobb
Posts: 5,367
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by knight_shadow
Because it won't only affect illegal immigrants.
Sure, a citizen should be able to easily produce identification, but s/he shouldn't have to just because a cop thinks s/he has the look of an immigrant.
|
you don't think you're producing identification once you're stopped because of a moving violation?
__________________
my signature sucks
|
07-07-2010, 07:30 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: cobb
Posts: 5,367
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin
Not speaking English can be a factor leading up to that. Other factors could be manner of dress, lack of identification, forged identification, etc.
|
this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin
Assuming before the fact that race is going to be the controlling factor in these arrests betrays your own preconceived notions about illegal immigration, not Arizona's.
|
and this.
__________________
my signature sucks
|
07-07-2010, 07:30 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: cobb
Posts: 5,367
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psi U MC Vito
How is that probable cause? I know plenty of citizens or perm residents with issues with the English language if they speak it at all.
|
do those permanent residents have valid id?
__________________
my signature sucks
|
07-07-2010, 07:33 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: cobb
Posts: 5,367
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Animate
Wait, so if I'm understanding this correctly, if I, being from AL, visit AZ, and get pulled over they wouldn't accept my AL license?
|
they'll accept it. unless you can get a driver's license anywhere in this country as an illegal alien.
__________________
my signature sucks
|
07-07-2010, 07:38 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Santa Monica/Beverly Hills
Posts: 8,634
|
|
|
I don't know if I believe you can't get an AZ license as an illegal immigrant. There were some suspicious looking people getting licenses when I got mine. All I had to do was show my MD license (which incidentally gave out licenses to illegal immigrants) and a copy of my insurance card to get my AZ license. I didn't even have to show proof of my current address. Crazy! AND, my license doesn't expire until 2040!
__________________
AOII
One Motto, One Badge, One Bond and Singleness of Heart!
|
07-07-2010, 07:56 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,578
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by starang21
they'll accept it. unless you can get a driver's license anywhere in this country as an illegal alien.
|
You can. Multiple jurisdictions have decided that licensing all drivers is preferable to illegal immigrants driving without licenses. It varies based on where they're from, that's why AZ won't accept all licenses as proof of citizenship.
__________________
From the SigmaTo the K!
Polyamorous, Pansexual and Proud of it!
It Gets Better
|
07-07-2010, 08:33 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: TX
Posts: 3,760
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by knight_shadow
Uhh...California doesn't have issues with illegal immigration?
|
I'm talking about people from other states going to protest in AZ against 1070 then driving their fat happy asses home. AFAIK the majority of people of AZ still support this bill and they are the ones that will have to live with it, not you in Dallas or me in EP or some dude in NJ.
Last edited by PiKA2001; 07-07-2010 at 08:47 PM.
|
07-07-2010, 08:43 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: TX
Posts: 3,760
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by AOII Angel
And you know good and well that is not what I am saying, but the rhetoric that is being used to support this law is ridiculous. This will not save the Arizona economy. It will not stop the drug cartels. It will not decrease illegal immigration at the borders. Pretending otherwise that it does anything other than waste Arizona tax payer money is stupid.
|
I'm going to disagree with you on the bolded. There is a reason why more immigrants and smugglers choose to go through the treacherous Arizona smuggling route as opposed to crossing the "easier" California or Texas borders. Arizona does the catch and release. You cross in TX you are looking at 3 weeks to 3 months in jail THEN deported.
|
07-07-2010, 09:01 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Texas
Posts: 14,146
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by starang21
you don't think you're producing identification once you're stopped because of a moving violation?
|
Where did I say that?
And the operative phrase here is "moving violation." I won't produce identification because I'm "too black."
Quote:
Originally Posted by PiKA2001
I'm talking about people from other states going to protest in AZ against 1070 then driving their fat happy asses home. AFAIK the majority of people of AZ still support this bill and they are the ones that will have to live with it, not you in Dallas or me in EP or some dude in NJ.
|
That's not what you said, though. You essentially said they can't support the bill because they don't see the effects of illegal immigration firsthand. I was just making a point that California does, indeed, see the effects of it.
__________________
*does side bends and sit-ups*
*doesn't lose butt*
Last edited by knight_shadow; 07-07-2010 at 09:05 PM.
|
07-07-2010, 09:34 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: cobb
Posts: 5,367
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by knight_shadow
Where did I say that?
And the operative phrase here is "moving violation." I won't produce identification because I'm "too black."
|
have you read the hb2162?
__________________
my signature sucks
|
07-07-2010, 09:44 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Texas
Posts: 14,146
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by starang21
have you read the hb2162?
|
I had not seen that. Thanks for letting me know about it.
The question still remains, though: How do you determine someone's status by means other than race? I saw style of dress and language spoken posted earlier. I don't think that's acceptable.
__________________
*does side bends and sit-ups*
*doesn't lose butt*
|
07-07-2010, 09:53 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: cobb
Posts: 5,367
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by knight_shadow
How do you determine someone's status by means other than race?
|
lack of valid id, inability or unwillingness to communicate in english. whether or not they're in some sort of identification database.
you're not making a determination based on race. you're asking a question to the proper authorities in order to make an informed determination.
__________________
my signature sucks
|
07-07-2010, 09:56 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,578
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by starang21
lack of valid id, inability or unwillingness to communicate in english. whether or not they're in some sort of identification database.
you're not making a determination based on race. you're asking a question to the proper authorities in order to make an informed determination.
|
No, you investigate based on a "reasonable suspicion" of illegal status. That's the questionable bit.
__________________
From the SigmaTo the K!
Polyamorous, Pansexual and Proud of it!
It Gets Better
|
07-07-2010, 09:59 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: cobb
Posts: 5,367
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drolefille
No, you investigate based on a "reasonable suspicion" of illegal status. That's the questionable bit.
|
so what i've listed couldn't fall under reasonable suspicion?
particularly the lack of valid id and inability or unwillingness to communicate in english?
in addition, they're not required to verify the status on all arrests.
"a reasonable attempt shall be made, when practicable"
__________________
my signature sucks
|
07-07-2010, 10:34 PM
|
|
GreekChat Member
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: TX
Posts: 3,760
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by knight_shadow
That's not what you said, though. You essentially said they can't support the bill because they don't see the effects of illegal immigration firsthand. I was just making a point that California does, indeed, see the effects of it.
|
No, what I'M SAYING is they should butt out of Arizona's politics and if the people of Arizona want and support this bill let them pass it.
And by the way, Arizona has it a lot worse than California in regards to crime associated with smuggling.
Last edited by PiKA2001; 07-07-2010 at 10:38 PM.
|
|
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
Linear Mode
