gpa required for the following chapters?

[SoCalGirl]

Yes it's possible. The lower your gpa is compared to other incoming freshman the more likely it can hurt you.

[JennyG]

That's exactly what I was worried about. I guess I'll just have to charm their pants off. Thanks so much for the advice though! I really appreciate it. I'll keep you girls posted.

[DoubleRose]

What about the opposite? The PNM that has high grades and low SAT/ACT. I would assume if given a choice, you would not list them. What is considered good on the SAT/ACT today? When I took the SAT with my stone tablet and the no abacus rule my 1350 was considered excellent. But I noticed scores seemed to be going up even before they added the extra 800 points. SO if a 30 is good on the ACT where does it become not so good 25, 28? And what about the SAT is 2100 good and below 1800 not so good?
I hope that makes sense.

DoubleRose

I realize it depends on the school, but I thinking about places where everyone has 3.8 or above GPA. Would you use test scores to help decide who gets the grades brownie points?

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by DoubleRose

What about the opposite? The PNM that has high grades and low SAT/ACT. I would assume if given a choice, you would not list them. What is considered good on the SAT/ACT today? When I took the SAT with my stone tablet and the no abacus rule my 1350 was considered excellent. But I noticed scores seemed to be going up even before they added the extra 800 points. SO if a 30 is good on the ACT where does it become not so good 25, 28? And what about the SAT is 2100 good and below 1800 not so good?
I hope that makes sense.

DoubleRose

I realize it depends on the school, but I thinking about places where everyone has 3.8 or above GPA. Would you use test scores to help decide who gets the grades brownie points?

The highest score possible on the ACT is a 36, and it really depends on the person you're asking, but I've always considered below a 23 to be nothing to write home about. Last time I checked, the national average was a 22 or something. The average for HS grads around here is about a 25 or 26. To be honest, the sororities where I went to school really only looked at the GPAs. Our recruitment apps weren't set up to include HS test scores.

[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by DoubleRose

I realize it depends on the school, but I thinking about places where everyone has 3.8 or above GPA. Would you use test scores to help decide who gets the grades brownie points?

This applied to my school (everyone has a 3.8 and above), but it was kind of a moot point since we had deferred recruitment and took first semester grades. But at the same time, we didn't even get test scores. I don't think that's a common thing to even get on a rush application.

[Benzgirl]

Originally Posted by DoubleRose

What about the opposite? The PNM that has high grades and low SAT/ACT. I would assume if given a choice, you would not list them. What is considered good on the SAT/ACT today? When I took the SAT with my stone tablet and the no abacus rule my 1350 was considered excellent. But I noticed scores seemed to be going up even before they added the extra 800 points. SO if a 30 is good on the ACT where does it become not so good 25, 28? And what about the SAT is 2100 good and below 1800 not so good?
I hope that makes sense.

DoubleRose

I realize it depends on the school, but I thinking about places where everyone has 3.8 or above GPA. Would you use test scores to help decide who gets the grades brownie points?

Welcome back, DoubleRose,

The Alpha Gam RIF doesn't include space for ACT or SAT. That doesn't mean that the PNM cant include the information on a resume, if the school recommends one.

Hindsight: My High School GPA was good, my test scores were ok, but my college grades were great. So, I can't agree with those who say that test scores are a good prediction. Point blank....I am a bad test taker. But I'll blow someone away on an project or a paper.

[DoubleRose]

Originally Posted by Benzgirl

Welcome back, DoubleRose,

The Alpha Gam RIF doesn't include space for ACT or SAT. That doesn't mean that the PNM cant include the information on a resume, if the school recommends one.

Hindsight: My High School GPA was good, my test scores were ok, but my college grades were great. So, I can't agree with those who say that test scores are a good prediction. Point blank....I am a bad test taker. But I'll blow someone away on an project or a paper.

Thanks I've been lurking, but decided not to comment much until my daughter is done with rush. I wasn't concerned about my daughter her grades and tests are fine. But I have noticed other groups have Test scores and Class rank on their rec forms. I was wondering if people looked at them as mch as GPA, but that might be touching on MS. It just seems like GPA is the only thing that everyone worries about.

Hope everyone had a great Fourth weekend.

[gee_ess]

Actually, at the University of Arkansas, for example, an ACT or SAT score is part of the rush application. All academic info for PNMs is confirmed/verified/gpa's converted to 4.0 scale by university before their rush application info is made available to the houses.

In my experience, the test score carries less weight when compared to a high gpa. Girls are more apt to think, "Here is a smart girl who just really didn't test well." But, that is certainly not set in stone.

[wildcatfan]

Originally Posted by DoubleRose

What about the opposite? The PNM that has high grades and low SAT/ACT. I would assume if given a choice, you would not list them. What is considered good on the SAT/ACT today? When I took the SAT with my stone tablet and the no abacus rule my 1350 was considered excellent. But I noticed scores seemed to be going up even before they added the extra 800 points. SO if a 30 is good on the ACT where does it become not so good 25, 28? And what about the SAT is 2100 good and below 1800 not so good?
I hope that makes sense.

DoubleRose

I realize it depends on the school, but I thinking about places where everyone has 3.8 or above GPA. Would you use test scores to help decide who gets the grades brownie points?

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

The highest score possible on the ACT is a 36, and it really depends on the person you're asking, but I've always considered below a 23 to be nothing to write home about. Last time I checked, the national average was a 22 or something. The average for HS grads around here is about a 25 or 26. To be honest, the sororities where I went to school really only looked at the GPAs. Our recruitment apps weren't set up to include HS test scores.

Here is the website that details ACT scores and their corresponding percentiles:

http://www.actstudent.org/scores/norms1.html

The average ACT composite score is 20-21. I would assume the average PNM's score is somewhat higher. To see an average HS score of 25-26, though, would be impressive. Those scores compare nationally with percentiles of 81-85%. Private or competitive prep school, perhaps?

I am not familiar with SAT scores, but I don't think ACT scores have seen significant score inflation. We had some old 1970's test reports on file; a 27 in 1977 was at the 93rd percentile, now it is 89th. A 32 was at the 99th percentile both in the 70's and now.

Originally Posted by gee_ess

Actually, at the University of Arkansas, for example, an ACT or SAT score is part of the rush application. All academic info for PNMs is confirmed/verified/gpa's converted to 4.0 scale by university before their rush application info is made available to the houses.

In my experience, the test score carries less weight when compared to a high GPA. Girls are more apt to think, "Here is a smart girl who just really didn't test well." But, that is certainly not set in stone.

I agree with this post and KSUViolet06 in stating that most sororities look mostly at GPAs. IMHO, however, test scores should be looked at more closely to predict success in college. It is easier to "fake" a good HS GPA with easy classes, grade inflation, and good reputation than it is to fake a good ACT or SAT score.

[breathesgelatin]

I believe the SAT was experiencing grade inflation, and in the mid-to-late 90s the test was reworked to account for this and make it harder. I don't know exactly when but sometime before I took the SAT for the first time... in... 1999 I think?

[SoCalGirl]

I don't know if they made the test harder but I remember that they "reset" the scores. You could now get a "perfect" score with out being "perfect".

[Low C Sharp]

the test was reworked to account for this and make it harder.

The test got easier, not harder, by most accounts due to the 1996 changes. The antonym verbal section and quantitative comparison math section were dropped. Calculators were permitted for the first time.

Independent of the substantive changes, the recentering also made scores, especially verbal scores, go up. The test was originally designed to have a score of 500 reflect the 50th percentile, but the 50th percentile had fallen to the low 400's. (This was probably due to a larger group of students taking the test, rather than a more select/elite group, as had been the case in the 1960's.) Recentering put the 50th percentile back in the 500s.
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[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by Low C Sharp

The test got easier, not harder, by most accounts due to the 1996 changes. The antonym verbal section and quantitative comparison math section were dropped. Calculators were permitted for the first time.

Independent of the substantive changes, the recentering also made scores, especially verbal scores, go up. The test was originally designed to have a score of 500 reflect the 50th percentile, but the 50th percentile had fallen to the low 400's. (This was probably due to a larger group of students taking the test, rather than a more select/elite group, as had been the case in the 1960's.) Recentering put the 50th percentile back in the 500s.

Ah. Clearly my memory was totally wrong!

[Zillini]

I think the reason most people/chapters focus more on GPA as opposed to test scores is that it is a reflection of years of work, not just the outcome of an afternoon taking a test.

If I see a PNM with a less then desirable GPA and outstanding ACT/SAT scores it makes me wonder what happened to harm her grades. Was there some personal issue? Was there a bad experience with a class or two or a semester that negatively affected her GPA? Same thing with the reverse, a solid GPA with low test scores. Is she just a really bad test taker? Was she was sick that day? Or did she spend every waking hour studying to pull those grades and if so, would she have time to commit to a sorority without harming her studies? These questions are worth investigating before making a decision IMO.