Debunking the "Brothel Law" Myth

[Tom Earp]

Kool and Right!

Oh, do not spit on the sidewalk!

When are some of these Kids get over the question of being Whore or not being a Whore?

It just isnt there anymore!

[AlexMack]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

While we're on the subject of debunking myths, the Puritans founded Massachusetts Bay Colony, and as a result, were influential in New England. There was also some emmigration to the Chesapeake Bay region, but the Puritans never had the influence there that they did in New England. Puritan dominance of politics in New England had waned by the early 1700s.

Undoubtedly, Puritanism influenced the founding of the American Republic, but America is not "Puritan-founded."

While we're at it...America is not founded upon judeo-christian principles. It's founded upon the principles of freedom of religion and separation of church and state. OMG it pisses me off when people play that card. Or the fact that In God We Trust wasn't added to money or the pledge of allegiance until the 50s I believe.
I'm not even American and I know this!

[Dionysus]

LMAO at the username change! I first saw it, I thought you were a troll or alter ego, lol.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by porkfriedrice

While we're at it...America is not founded upon judeo-christian principles. It's founded upon the principles of freedom of religion and separation of church and state.

Just FYI, it wasn't until the ratification of the Fourteenth Amendment, after the Civil War, that the "establishment clause" of the First Amendment was applicable to the states. Prior to that time, while the Federal government was constitutionally forbidden from establishing a particular church as the state church, state governments were not so forbidden, unless their own constitutions contained a similar provision.

The Congregational Church was not disestablished in Connecticut until 1818, and although Massachusetts de jure disestablished the Congregational Church in 1780, it was not de facto disestablished until 1833, when the laws requiring every man to belong to a church and giving churches the power of taxation over members were repealed.

At the time the US Constitution was adopted, the overriding concern was not the complete disestablishment of any church. Rather, the overriding concern was that decisions regarding establishment or disestablishment should be made by the states, not by the federal government.

Or the fact that In God We Trust wasn't added to money or the pledge of allegiance until the 50s I believe. I'm not even American and I know this!

"In God We Trust" was not made the official national motto until 1956. However as far as money goes, the motto first appeared on the two-cent coin in 1864, under general authority given by Congress for the Mint Director and the Secretary of the Treasury to develop and approve of designs for coins. (There had been a fair amount of sentiment expressed that the motto be placed on the coin as the Civil War progressed.) It was in 1873 that Congress specifically said that the Secretary of the Treasury "may cause the motto IN GOD WE TRUST to be inscribed on such coins as shall admit of such motto."

It was used off and on on various coins for a while after that, but every penny since 1909, every dime since 1916, every gold coin or silver dollar coin, half-dollar coin, and quarter-dollar coins since 1908, and every nickel since 1938 has had it. It was not added to paper money until 1957.

Just trying to keep the info straight.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by porkfriedrice

While we're at it...America is not founded upon judeo-christian principles. It's founded upon the principles of freedom of religion and separation of church and state. OMG it pisses me off when people play that card. Or the fact that In God We Trust wasn't added to money or the pledge of allegiance until the 50s I believe.
I'm not even American and I know this!

Well, it also depends on what you mean by "America" and "founded."

The formation of the United States as a separate and independent political entity or the actual settlement and survival of the early colonies?

The influence of the Puritans in New England really was pretty darn important for a long time in US history, and Georgia's colonial success depended a lot on the Methodists.

And to be honest, even the Deism of the Revolutionary documents probably wouldn't have been possible without the contributions of the Judeo-Christian Western tradition. It's not like the Enlightenment happened in a cultural vacuum or under Confucianism or Islam.

[Corsulian]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Undoubtedly, Puritanism influenced the founding of the American Republic, but America is not "Puritan-founded."

I misspoke when I suggested that actual Puritans founded the whole of America. America was founded by many distinct groups, sects, organizations, corporations, and more. We're a great big ridiculous melting pot.

Nevertheless, I do not believe so many brothels were appearing that every township/county (and generally only those containing or that would one day contain a college or university) felt that anti-brothel laws were necessary but that instead of saying 'no brothels' they referred to it vaguely in terms of number of women in a household.

Given that this is a "stickied" thread regarding the brothel law, try and focus on that rather than the philosophical reasoning behind the founding of the country which is extremely loosely tied to local zoning laws. The only thing relevant about the influence of religion or whether many aspects of our society are too conservative is that these are probably the reasons (or perceptions) that lead to people believing in a stupid reason for the lack of Greek Housing.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Corsulian

Given that this is a "stickied" thread regarding the brothel law, try and focus on that rather than the philosophical reasoning behind the founding of the country which is extremely loosely tied to local zoning laws. The only thing relevant about the influence of religion or whether many aspects of our society are too conservative is that these are probably the reasons (or perceptions) that lead to people believing in a stupid reason for the lack of Greek Housing.

Hey, you're the one who brought the Puritan influence up.

But you're right in that in the 1800s, unless one was going to school in New York City, Philadelphia, Chicago, Washington or New Orleans, keeping brothels from being established near campuses probably wasn't high on any municipality's list of things to worry about. (And I'm doubting that they worried in New Orleans.)

[BlueBeast1914]

I know for a fact that in Detroit Mi, the law stands. There are no Sorority houses but there are several Frat houses. It is a law that is actually on the books here.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by BlueBeast1914

I know for a fact that in Detroit Mi, the law stands. It is a law that is actually on the books here.

Can you actually cite to the ordinance? 'Cause otherwise, I'm not buying that it's "actually on the books."

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Can you actually cite to the ordinance? 'Cause otherwise, I'm not buying that it's "actually on the books."

I'm sure his brother's girlfriend's aunt's third cousin's husband's dog told him. So of course it's true. Disregard the rest of the thread and everyone else who ACTUALLY knows what they're talking about. The Brothel Law is absolutely true.

BTW, MC - love the new sig.

[BlueBeast1914]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Can you actually cite to the ordinance? 'Cause otherwise, I'm not buying that it's "actually on the books."

I really don't care what you buy or don't. I know for certain that at the several universities in this city, none of them have houses that are inhabited.

I can assure you that the law exist

Originally Posted by BlueBeast1914

I can assure you that the law exist

Too bad no one believes you. Your assurances don't mean squat.

Again, cite your source. Oh that's right, you can't.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by BlueBeast1914

I really don't care what you buy or don't. I know for certain that at the several universities in this city, none of them have houses that are inhabited.

Oh, my bad. I didn't stop to think that if no sororities in Detroit have houses, the reason can only be a brothel law. I have certainly been put in my place.

I can assure you that the law exist

Then it ought to be a simple matter for you to cite and/or quote the ordinance. But like OTW, I'm betting you can't.

[AngieWashU]

My alma mater (Washington University in St. Louis) regularly fed this myth to incoming freshmen, but a Theta who graduated the year before I did debunked this myth to the Panhellenic community and revealed the real reason: an alumna had donated money to the university with the stipulation that while it was being used to build/maintain the building named in her memory, sororities could only have suites in her building and no residential houses. At that time the sororities discussed building houses but found there wasn't enough interest in our chapters to pursue it.

[gphibxdiamond]

This is the exact reason I've been told my sorority cannot have a house... I wonder if there's anyway to truly turn it around and establish one...