Texas A&M: To rush or not to rush?

[ASTlady]

NPC does not have a policy stating you must be a full time student. They just say you have to be enrolled.

Each NPC organization however has differing policies on whether they accept part time students or not.

ETA: I noticed the College Panhellenic says they have to be full time, which is interesting. Again, because that is not an NPC policy. But they clearly are considering Blinn students to be full time due to the dual enrollment.

[Titchou]

"To be eligible to participate in Panhellenic recruitment and pledge an NPC fraternity, a woman shall:
A. Not be simultaneously enrolled in high school and attending college.
B. Be regularly matriculated according to the definition of matriculation established by that institution."

I stand partially corrected. The above is from the NPC MOI (aka Green Book), 19th edition, pulled from the NPC web site. The onus would seem to fall on the institution's back to determine this.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Titchou

First of all, you can't spit in Texas and not hit an alum of all the groups arA & M. So getting recs in Texas is not that difficult. Second, there are always groups who can't take a segment of the PNMs who are allowed to participate(GPA - remember?).

Do you purposely take the negative side just to stir things up or do you just see the glass half empty? Maybe you just like to play devil's advocate. At least you're consistent.

I'm consistently negative? Seriously?? I hope it works, it just sounds like some things weren't thought through and that's not fair to the rushees or the chapters or the alumnae who spend their time writing recs.

ETA: I completely agree with carnation's post.

[CMDelta]

I just heard from our local panhellenic president that A&M has revised their bylaws or policies to clear up any confusion on whether BlinnTeam students are considered fully part of A&M's student body. It appears A&M fully supports this change to allow Blinn girls to rush and it was due, in part, from the sororities requesting it since so many girls were having to wait until sophomore year to go through recruitment. However, the sororities will know which girls are A&M freshman and which are Blinn so how each sorority chooses to handle it during voting (and if Blinn students will have heavier cuts) remains to be seen.

[SWTXBelle]

Here's some of an e-mail I received clarifying everything:
This morning I received a note from a confused mom. This led me to email Texas A&M’s Panhellenic to ask some questions about Recruitment for Blinn Team students. That resulted in a conference call this afternoon with Melissa Williams, CPC Advisor/Risk Management Specialist, Office of Fraternity & Sorority Life, Department of Student Activities, Texas A&M University. (That’s a long title!) Jennifer Ginn joined me on the call, and we want to share a few highlights with you. Please feel free to pass along to your alumnae as you wish, and let us know if you have additional questions about this.



First, to ensure we are all on the same page, I want to highlight this statement from NPC’s (thesororitylife.com) website: “To join a sorority, you must be a fully matriculated undergraduate student, as defined by the college or university you attend.”



In our conference call, we learned the following from Melissa:

·A&M Blinn Team (BT) students, although still currently called part-time students on the Blinn Team website, are now defined as “fully matriculated” by A&M’s Office of Fraternity & Sorority Life.

·A&M’s bylaws weren’t in accordance with NPC so A&M made changes to their bylaws to comply with NPC requirements. Including the “fully matriculated” language was one of the changes.

·The NPC Area Advisor, Donna, is okay with A&M’s BT recruitment plans. Julie Johnson of NPC gave her blessing as well.

·Melissa said Blinn Team program will show on a student’s permanent ICS record, so sororities will know who is in the program.

·NPC has asked A&M to identify BT women throughout the process so they will be identified.

·Everyone will visit all houses for first round; then they will be released as normal after that.

·According to Melissa, 250 sophomores went through recruitment last year and 1/3 were from Blinn Team. One of their goals is to get more freshmen to go through recruitment. Melissa hopes to be able to gauge success toward meeting this goal by year 2 of adding Blinn Team to recruitment.

·The Blinn Team program has about 250 new freshmen students each year, and Melissa expect about 50 to go through recruitment this year.

·Melissa noted that A&M is only the third campus to navigate through a program like this. (I presume that makes UT the second. Wonder who the first was?)

I hope this information is helpful. Please let me know if you hear any other information regarding this program from your respective sororities.

[Just interested]

Thanks, for clarifying the issue directly from Texas A&M Panhellenic. The only comment I think may be misleading a bit from CMDelta is that some chapters requested this to take place. I know, I can only speak for my own, but I think this is more hearsay. I do believe this came as a result from a "request" of the University than from the chapters themselves. Again, this is just from those I know in the know on that campus.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

What is retention like for Blinn team students, as compared to traditional freshmen? I would think that would factor into an NPC's decision.

[als463]

Originally Posted by Low D Flat

Yes. Don't forget OU, LSU, and Ole Miss.

The schools have more or less invented a new category of student here. Are they full-time enrolled undergraduates? Kinda. At least, there's an argument for treating them that way.

What Texas is doing is unique AFAIK. Montana State also allows students enrolled in its junior college to live in MSU housing, use student services, etc., but I don't think they've made a path to Greek life.

Actually the University of South Carolina has a program just like this called Gamecock Gateway. Students are accepted provisionally and they live in dorms on campus but, attend the local community college. After a year, if they have made the grade, they are eligible to be full-time South Carolina students. They even get South Carolina ID cards. I would really like to see them allow the students in that program to go through recruitment but, that is set by the school and it has never, to my knowledge, been brought to the attention of the campus Panhellenic. I think it helps lessen the stigma of being in one of these special programs.

[clemsongirl]

Originally Posted by als463

Actually the University of South Carolina has a program just like this called Gamecock Gateway. Students are accepted provisionally and they live in dorms on campus but, attend the local community college. After a year, if they have made the grade, they are eligible to be full-time South Carolina students. They even get South Carolina ID cards. I would really like to see them allow the students in that program to go through recruitment but, that is set by the school and it has never, to my knowledge, been brought to the attention of the campus Panhellenic. I think it helps lessen the stigma of being in one of these special programs.

Clemson has the same concept program, called Bridge To Clemson or something like that. There are currently on-campus dorms being built to house students in this program but as of right now we have a good deal of girls go through recruitment as sophomores facing a much tougher GPA requirement because they weren't allowed to go through recruitment as freshmen. I'm not sure if fraternities can recruit or choose to recruit these students on the down low but I know that sororities can't. There's also a lot of friction between students in this program and full-time Clemson students re: whether they truly go to Clemson or not, which allowing Bridge students to join Greek life might ease.

[HQWest]

Originally Posted by clemsongirl

Clemson has the same concept program, called Bridge To Clemson or something like that. There are currently on-campus dorms being built to house students in this program but as of right now we have a good deal of girls go through recruitment as sophomores facing a much tougher GPA requirement because they weren't allowed to go through recruitment as freshmen. I'm not sure if fraternities can recruit or choose to recruit these students on the down low but I know that sororities can't. There's also a lot of friction between students in this program and full-time Clemson students re: whether they truly go to Clemson or not, which allowing Bridge students to join Greek life might ease.

Soooo... let me see if I have this right. The 250 or so Blinn Team freshmen take some or most classes at A&M but count as Blinn students. Clemson is even building dorms on campus for the their version of these students. How many of their classes do they take at the CC, and how many at the main campus?

Seems like the university is playing games with the numbers? They get to say they are staying more selective and not growing the overall size of the university by keeping within a certain range of acceptances, but then they have this waitlist of students who will go through the Blinn program in the hopes of getting into A&M next year. (Die hard Aggies one would assume.) At that point, they can replace other previously higher ranked students who transfer or drop out or fail out or if they fail out of Blinn they don't count against the university's 4 or 6 year graduation rates?

[Just interested]

HQWest hit the nail on the head. So, here we are. Every Greek system on a campus with this type of program will have to deal with this situation at some point. A&M and Texas just happen to be among the 1st to test the waters.

[clemsongirl]

Originally Posted by HQWest

Soooo... let me see if I have this right. The 250 or so Blinn Team freshmen take some or most classes at A&M but count as Blinn students. Clemson is even building dorms on campus for the their version of these students. How many of their classes do they take at the CC, and how many at the main campus?

Seems like the university is playing games with the numbers? They get to say they are staying more selective and not growing the overall size of the university by keeping within a certain range of acceptances, but then they have this waitlist of students who will go through the Blinn program in the hopes of getting into A&M next year. (Die hard Aggies one would assume.) At that point, they can replace other previously higher ranked students who transfer or drop out or fail out or if they fail out of Blinn they don't count against the university's 4 or 6 year graduation rates?

I had to look it up since I didn't know these numbers off the top of my head, but the Bridge To Clemson page says that students in this program are enrolled at Tri-County Technical College for a year and are required to complete 30 credits there before automatically being enrolled at Clemson. This phrasing makes it sound like they're not Clemson students since they take no classes at Clemson and are required to reapply for admission to Clemson if they don't meet the 30 credit requirement. In this regard I suppose Clemson's program is different from the Blinn Team program.

ETA: Found this on the Bridge Program FAQ:

Can Bridge students pledge a Clemson fraternity or sorority?
No. Due to policies governing national social fraternities and sororities, Bridge students may not join one of these organizations until after they enroll at Clemson.

I think the reason the Blinn program and others like it in the state of Texas exist is because there's state laws on the books saying that they can only accept the top X percentage of high schoolers from any high school, thus forcing still-qualified students who didn't make that percentage for whatever reason to gain acceptance through these Texas programs. I think it's a better alternative than not letting qualified applicants in to the school at all, but it probably does make their overall graduation numbers look better if they calculate them a certain way.

[33girl]

It seems like it's a little bit different in Texas as the main reason many of these students end up in Blinn and similar programs are because of the top 10% rule, not because their academics aren't quite up to snuff.

[carnation]

Oh, the Top 10% Rule has everything to do with it! Here are these outstanding kids who want to be part of one of the big Texas universities and they can't get in, while some of the Top 10% grads who did get in are hugely unprepared for even community college. Does the state of Texas win with this program? No, they lose massive numbers of outstanding grads to nearby state universities--and they may not come back to Texas after they graduate.

Georgia Southern University has a program in which prospective students who don't quite qualify for admission attend East Georgia College but their classes are on the Southern campus. Last I knew, they couldn't live on campus, pledge a social fraternity or sorority, or play varsity athletics but they can join anything else. The high school grade factor would probably keep them from pledging anyway.

With a certain GPA after 30 hours, they can become regular Southern students.

[irishpipes]

And if I'm a very good student in the top 15% of my competitive HS class, I could pay in-state tuition at a school like Arkansas, and fully participate as a "real" university student without any stigma or being treated as a second-class citizen.