Obama tackles race anger in major speech

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by skylark

FWIW, I think in true Obama-style you're more of a uniter than a fighter, Senusret.

Thanks, toots. Even though I wouldn't necessarily label myself that way, it's very flattering.

I just think political discourse on GC is just silly most of the time. Smugness, arrogance, long-windedness -- these things are not earmarks of a sound, well-researched argument. They are just as dumb as hysterical liberals who resort to calling something racist or sexist just because.

I have lots of opinions that are on either side of the proverbial aisle. I am a gay black man who is pro-choice, pro-marriage equality, pro-peace, pro-2nd amendment (as interpreted favorably to legal gun owners), pro-homeschooling, etc.

It took a long time for me to decide which candidate to support, so I respect those who are still undecided, or those who even decided on a different candidate than me.

I have a lesbian AKA friend who is pro-Hillary and she seems to be the only person with whom I can sit down with and discuss the pros and cons of both Hillary and Obama. I know she's not calling me a sheep because I support Obama and she knows I'm not calling her a sellout for supporting Hillary. But it's tough finding people like that who you can talk politics with rationally.

So I keep it light on GC and/or look to specific posters for their comments, DSTCHAOS being one of them because I know our thought processes are similar even though our experiences, values, and final decisions might be different.

In other words, I don't have to have one-liners in political discussions because I can't think of anything substantive to say -- I live substantively. GC is where I play.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

Does your mother?

LOL.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

So I keep it light on GC and/or look to specific posters for their comments, DSTCHAOS being one of them because I know our thought processes are similar even though our experiences, values, and final decisions might be different.

You and I are holding hands and strolling into the sunset.

[jon1856]

Originally Posted by SECdomination

I might want to kill myself over it, but I agree with EE-BO on this one.

His comment about Obama being 20 yrs too late was suggesting this:
If Barack really doesn't agree with what that nutjob was saying, why wouldn't he have already severed ties?
Did this reverend all of a sudden decide to have this point of view or has he (most likely) been living with these ideals for a long while.

Co-sign---across the board.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by EE-BO

I heard the speech and it did sound great and it did have some substance to it- but it also had a lot of excuses and at the end of the day I do not think it will matter to many voters who supported Hillary or for swing voters who are undecided- the people he needs to win a general election.

I avoided getting into the specifics of the speech since I knew a handful of morons like you (and you are the king race baiter on this forum in case you didn't know it) would not be able to have a rational discussion about it.

so,,,,,uuuhh...without the 'moron' portion...what did YOU get out of this speech today.....care to talk about that with out 3rd grade namecalling?

[pinkies up]

"We are the world, we are the GCers, it's true, we make a better day, just you and meeee".

Sorry, I had I moment. Wait, I've got another one, "Reach and and touuuuuch, somebody's haaaaand, make this world a better place, if you can...." FYI: To those who are unfamiliar with some southern black churches, this is our benediction song on 4th Sunday.

[nittanyalum]

"It only takes a spark, to get a fire going. And soon all those around, can warm up in its glowing..." Pinkies inspired me!

So, who's gonna break out a good round of "Kumbayah" for us??

[Thetagirl218]

Did anyone else get this Presidential vibe during the speech? I did....

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by EE-BO

Anyone- like me and many of us here- who has ever spent a significant period of time affiliated with a church knows full well that you become intimately familiar with the preacher's general position and tone.

This is Obama's "Swift Boat".

Obama has made this worse for himself by promoting himself as very, very close to this church and Wright. When you add in the fact he STILL has yet to offer much substance in his speeches- Wright's rhetoric is all the more damaging because it is something people can understand real fast and associate with a candidate who has yet to really lay out his general philosophy in a realistic and pragmatic way.

I am breaking up your discussion to handle my thoughts on the matter. Any quote not included means I have no comment.

IMO, this is not a "swift boat" of Obama. Yes, I can concede that he attempted to portray himself as a religious Christian person, but knew his Reverend was a loose cannon. However would Rev. Wright be outed like he was by the media.

Most African Americans shrug when they hear Rev. Wrights comments. Pretty much "And, your point is what--how is that going to get me paid?" Those Af Ams that are shocked and appalled by Rev Wright's comments are very few...

Originally Posted by EE-BO

Obama is not responsible for the racist lunacy of Rev. Wright- but today's speech sounded a few decades out of place. And all the pundits on the news comparing Obama to Dr. King are being terribly disrespectful to the very REAL courage Dr. King had and the very REAL danger he and his followers faced daily. People like me look at that and are turned off because we feel Obama is being shoved down our throats even more than before. Noone is talking about what he can actually accomplish- but are rather making excuses for him.

Obama is responsible for not having started off his campaign being more open, pragmatic and substantive in his presentation to the voters. And this is what will cost him the election- as well it should.

I think that is another hurdle placed in front of someone like Obama that he has consistently shown to surpass. This man is not a dummy, he graduated from the Ivy League. He will have strong counselors when it comes to how to handle a particular position. The United States has NEVER gotten this far in politicized race relations before and notably everyone is scared, because where will it put us? That is what causing people to be so enamored with Obama at this time. Can I hate Black people when they rob my house (like they are doing right now) but still be confident in voting for Obama to I don't seem like a racist pig? I that is a simpleton's mind on a very complex issue...

Originally Posted by EE-BO

Obama is caught between appeasing the African-America power structure who feel you defend your own at all times and at all costs (NOT the African-American community at large since I still believe most African-Americans are just as appalled at Wright as I am), and the rest of the party. And a big new demographic in this party is the Hispanic vote who are not going to be sympathetic to Wright or the association with Obama.

Rev. Sharpton himself in the last election made a big issue of how Democrats have taken the black vote for granted and worked to court Hispanics and swing voters.

We are now at a point where many issues, immigration the big one, create an enormous conflict between major voting groups within the Democratic Party- and this spells disaster as long as the CBC and other African-American power structure groups continue to play the game of "give us what we want all the time or we will turn on you in a heartbeat".

That may have worked 10-20 years ago, but the demographics of the US have changed and it won't play anymore.

And that is a shame for everyone since it creates division that is totally unnecessary.

The irony of the African American "power structure"--there is no structure... If you want to put one out there, then hey, it's the Crips and the Bloods--or with some level of Bracketology... There are African Americans INVOLVED in several levels of a power structure that is a part of the American structure--but one person of the "Head Kneegrows In Charge" No--that is just in Blaxplotation films and rap music videos. Hayle, the Bourgeousie does not respect BET anymore and they have let money than Puffy Diddy or whatever he's calling himself these days...

If anyone wants anything to go down in the 'Hood--you have to go to the state pen for that...

Demographics have changed, but not THAT much... And there are a LARGE contingent of folks totally overlooked on their opinions that are realizing their voting rights and power and it is NOT Blacks nor Hispanics--but various ethnic groups of Asia... They wield ALOT of leverage that their vote once not considered... NO ONE is really catering to them to the level that I think they ought to...

The other issue an ethnic group that use to taunt African Americans until 9-11 has realized the blind bigotry that American wields. And that is of folks who are of Middle Eastern descent. Some are American citizens who can vote. Most are not. But I cannot tell you how many Middle Easterners, some Muslims, who have told me the pains they have suffered to ignorance and bigotry.

What I want to know is do we WANT racism and bigotry to be directly placed where it ought to be, in psychiatric care? Or do we want to fight these things politically and legislate out hatred based on looks? Is it that simple?

Personally, I think this place is the ONLY place where we can have a discussion, sometimes not being civil, but for the most part being instructive.

[pinkies up]

Originally Posted by nittanyalum

"It only takes a spark, to get a fire going. And soon all those around, can warm up in its glowing..." Pinkies inspired me!

So, who's gonna break out a good round of "Kumbayah" for us??

LOL

Seriously-
I do think that we can all agree that racisim still exists today. The problem is that racisim still exists today. We all talk about it and we end up getting angry with one another without understanding the anger or where it's really coming from. Sometimes it's coming from the same place and we don't sit down and discuss it. That's what I got from the speech.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

You and I are holding hands and strolling into the sunset.

*flatline* lol

Originally Posted by SECdomination

ETA: I know you're all avid Fox News watchers so you probably already knew this: Even JUAN WILLIAMS said the speech sucked! That's when you know it didn't get the job done.

SEC, I don't get it....Juan Williams is conservative.... isn't he expected to say it sucked?

[EE-BO]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

so,,,,,uuuhh...without the 'moron' portion...what did YOU get out of this speech today.....care to talk about that with out 3rd grade namecalling?

I think he did what he had to do, and he did it extraordinarily well. And that was to make it clear he does not agree with Wright's comments to create a separation to appease the majority of voters while also not abandoning his church and risking the support of many who at one time thought he was "not black enough".

On a personal level, I will admit it all rang a bit hollow for me however. I am just tired and weary of race being such an issue in this campaign- just as I am a bit weary of race being dragged out so often at every perceived injustice. I accept and understand racism against African-Americans is still very real, but I also understand that much of the leadership in that community has very self-oriented viewpoints and have no trouble using the race card in a very imbalanced way to promote goals that are largely politically and economically based.

In Obama's defense, it was the media that started the race business and not him. This nation is ready to elect a qualified President without taking race into account, and the media is where the guilt trip started whereby anyone who questioned him would be criticized on the grounds it was racially based. It is the same thing as when the media made a big scene about Joe Lieberman and whether the country was ready for a Jewish Vice President. And it is unfortunate since it puts such candidates at an automatic disadvantage when people of other races get automatically defensive about the assumption that their lack of support means they are potentially "racist".

This is not fair for Obama, but each candidate has things to overcome and they need- by expressing their own personal vision in a practical manner- to do that effectively.

Hillary has done a great job of establishing herself in her own right even though the media wants to play up the Bill Clinton factor.

John McCain has done a decent job of getting past the fact that early in the campaign he spoke at Bob Jones University- which is just as bad as what Obama is mired in right now and the reason I thought McCain was dead in the water early on.

Obama needs to get beyond this in a very clear break- and it is unfortunate that many of the allies he needs most will not let him do this. His speech today was a tremendous effort in that direction, but it was an impossible task to begin with.

I would not vote for Obama on lack of substance and on disagreement with him on his general stances which I think will lead to a more socialist form of government- but I do find him and his wife both to be very eloquent and intelligent people.

In fact his high level of intelligence makes me question all the more why he tied himself so closely to that church to begin with. Maybe the answer is that he had to get over the "not black enough" issue and this was how to do it.

Either way, my earlier posts were intended to be cold analysis of the facts as I see them- and not reflect any personal feeling about Obama as I have never met him and so don't have anything to offer.

As for the "moron" comment- that has been a long time in coming and it was well-earned. Someone talking about my Mom needs no reply- it speaks for itself.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by EE-BO

As for the "moron" comment- that has been a long time in coming and it was well-earned. Someone talking about my Mom needs no reply- it speaks for itself.

Haaaaaaaaa you so replied

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by pinkies up

LOL

Seriously-
I do think that we can all agree that racisim still exists today. The problem is that racisim still exists today. We all talk about it and we end up getting angry with one another without understanding the anger or where it's really coming from. Sometimes it's coming from the same place and we don't sit down and discuss it. That's what I got from the speech.

Not everyone agrees that racism still exists today.

Even still, it is kind of annoying that Obama's speech has everyone in such an awe as if he's introducing some really new concepts or even accurately addressing the relevant concepts.

I take his speech for what it is: a response to his association with his pastor. I'm not high-fiving Obama for bringing issues of race to the forefront and bringing better awareness. This is just another passing fad.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

Not everyone agrees that racism still exists today.

Even still, it is kind of annoying that Obama's speech has everyone in such an awe as if he's introducing some really new concepts or even accurately addressing the relevant concepts.

I take his speech for what it is: a response to his association with his pastor. I'm not high-fiving Obama for bringing issues of race to the forefront and bringing better awareness. This is just another passing fad.

I agree with you--amazingly... And it is sadly so...