Man Held in Slaying of JonBenet Ramsay

[honeychile]

Originally Posted by DeltAlum

As I recall, there was an open window to the basement where the body was discovered -- on the second search of the house.

The Boulder DA is really doing a dance about making an arrest before an investigation is completed and going out of her way to point out that the case isn't closed yet.

In addition, the suspects ex-wife claims to have been with him in Alabama or somewhere when the crime was committed.

Methinks we've not heard the last of this.

Or, to put it another way -- something smells.

ETA -- I just have to say it. The Ramseys acted very strangely in the months after the crime. They at first wouldn't cooperate with the police by not taking a lie dectector test (which they later did, and passed to be fair), and refused to be interviewed by police separately (which they finally did, again, to be fair).

While I'm sure this will open a hornet's nest, anyone who dressed their little girl up to look like a woman -- and all of the other outfits -- and were seemingly obscessed with these kiddy pageant things worry me to begin with.

In my mind, the parents aren't off the hook yet.

It's smelling halfway around the world!

Did anyone else catch the one news conference where the DA (I assume of Boulder, but I'm not sure) said that, "at this time, neither John Karr or John Ramsey has been indicted." I found that phrasing very interesting - obviously, the thought of the Ramseys being involved hasn't gone out the window.

Dr. Cyril Wecht had some interesting things to say, too. While he (and most of us, I presume) hopes that the parents were not involved, it does seem strange that a man would travel so far to see the child he "loved" on Christmas, instead of being with his own children, as his ex-wife says. Also, Karr claims to have had some sort of sexual contact with JonBenet, yet no semen was found. Karr would have had to break into this house (which had an alarm system), find her bedroom, wait while everyone came home, knew the amount of the bonus (the $118,000 "ransom"), purportedly had some sexual contact with JonBenet, and left her in a room so hard to find that a maid who had worked there for three years didn't know it existed. Karr then would have written the infamous ransom note, practicing it first and using or excellently faking Patsy Ramsey's handwriting on a notepad when he knew he was leaving a body, and not part of a kidnapping. It just doesn't add up.

And on another note, isn't it a pity that this child's death gets SO much publicity, while so many other children die in anonymity? Granted, the whole childhood beauty pagent thing made this a "sexy" news story (no pun intended), but the parents of those other children must feel terrible about the lack of concern on behalf of their kids.

[SoCalGirl]

Originally Posted by DeltAlum

No proof, but I don't think this guy did it.

I saw footage earlier of him be escorted from Thailand and he was answering reporters questions. He admitted he was "playing" with JonBenet and her death was an "accident". If the footage was real and in context, he is totally guilty.

[KSUViolet06]

I'm just catching up on this.

I was originally really excited that they'd arrested this guy, but the more I listened, the less I thought he actually did it.

John Ramsey has never heard of him.

The only time he lived anywhere near the family, JonBenet was a baby.

He says he drugged her, but her autopsy showed no drugs.

His ex-wife says he was in AL on Xmas eve.

My initial opinion is that this guy is just a psycho obsessed with child murders and porn. I think he's just so mentally ill that he started saying all this stuff and got himself caught up.

THe only thing that would change my mind is if the DNA from the scene matched his. That would mean that there is much more to this than the media knows.

The DA is probably going to do alot more investigating. So we shall see. I would like for them to find out who killed her, but of course I'd want it to be someone who is rightfully guilty, not some rambling psycho.

[James]

I am sure they did help the authorities as much as possible . .. but I am sure that on the advice of counsel they declined to put themselves in a situation where the authorities could build a case against them . . . which the police may have done regardless of whether the parents killed the little girl.

Generally if there is know obvious suspect the people closest to the victim are usually thought to have done it.

How would a lie detector test have helped the police catch the killer when the parents weren't the killers?

Would anyone have appreciated the police asking them to take a lie detector test because they thought you killed your daughter?

I would have been absolutely enraged that the police asked me and told them to take a flying leap, if I didn't deck the person making the suggestion.

Originally Posted by DeltAlum

Of course. I was thinking (talking) of things a little more down the road.

If one of my children were killed anytime, though, I think I would want to do everything in my power to help the authorities.

I'm not sure exactly how to explain it, but something was just strange about the way they acted.

Living this close to Boulder, we got bombarded (even more than nationally, believe it or not) by this story and all of its little intricacies.

Then again, there are a lot of strange things and people in The Peoples Republic of Boulder -- sometimes known as "23 square miles surrounded by reality."

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by ariesrising

Unless he's lying.

Or crazy.

[PsychTau2]

Originally Posted by honeychile

Did anyone else catch the one news conference where the DA (I assume of Boulder, but I'm not sure) said that, "at this time, neither John Karr or John Ramsey has been indicted." I found that phrasing very interesting - obviously, the thought of the Ramseys being involved hasn't gone out the window.

What if John Ramsey and John Karr were in cahoots to commit this crime, and Patsy truely didn't know anything about it? She could have had some tiny suspicion of her husband, but not enough to get her to talk to anyone about it. That could explain some of her odd behavior.


(I should write for Lifetime!)
PsychTau

[DeltAlum]

Originally Posted by James

How would a lie detector test have helped the police catch the killer when the parents weren't the killers?

Would anyone have appreciated the police asking them to take a lie detector test because they thought you killed your daughter?

I would have been absolutely enraged that the police asked me and told them to take a flying leap, if I didn't deck the person making the suggestion.

Your points certainly have merit -- especially the part about the lawyers advice.

How taking the test would have helped, it seems to me, would be to take some of the suspicion off of the Ramseys.

On the other hand, while not being an expert, I've heard that Lie Detectors can be "beaten" and aren't always conclusive.

All I can say is that with all of the media coverage -- local and national -- there is just something about the way the Ramseys acted that made (makes) me uneasy.

As I said about Mr. Karr, I have no proof. Just a bad feeling.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by DeltAlum

On the other hand, while not being an expert, I've heard that Lie Detectors can be "beaten" and aren't always conclusive.

That's an understatement. That's one reason why the results of lie detector tests are rarely admissible as evidence in court.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by honeychile

Dr. Cyril Wecht had some interesting things to say, too.

I think I'm going to make "STFU Cyril Wecht" t-shirts and sell them in the middle of Downtown Pittsburgh. I could make enough money to quit my job.

Of course I'd be freaking out if I was a parent and asked to take a ld test, but you have to realize it's police procedure when there aren't any suspects - the closest people to the victim are the ones they look at.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by 33girl

. . . but you have to realize it's police procedure when there aren't any suspects - the closest people to the victim are the ones they look at.

Very true. And with good reason -- more often than not, the killer turns out to be someone close to the victim.

[DeltAlum]

"JonBenet, my love, my life. I love you and shall forever love you. I pray that you can hear my voice calling out to you from my darkness - this darkness that now separates us," read one of the e-mails, which the newspaper said Friday it obtained from a source close to the investigation."
-from wire service reports quoting the Rocky Mountain News

Reportedly this was sent to the University of Colorado J-School professor who was corresponding with Karr for a couple of years. He (Karr) allegedly asked the Prof. to go the the former Ramsey house and read it out loud.

This guy seems to be seriously messed up.

Either that, or as someone above speculated, the guy doesn't want to go to jail in Tailand (One night in Bankok makes a hard man humble -- From the musical Chess) and figures he can plead insanity here.

[valkyrie]

Originally Posted by DeltAlum

How taking the test would have helped, it seems to me, would be to take some of the suspicion off of the Ramseys.

On the other hand, while not being an expert, I've heard that Lie Detectors can be "beaten" and aren't always conclusive.

Lie detector tests are a piece of crap and unreliable. We learned how to "beat" them in a college psychology class. I wouldn't take one, ever -- especially not if it had anything to do with incompetent police who were trying to put something I didn't do on me.

[RU OX Alum]

Originally Posted by valkyrie

Lie detector tests are a piece of crap and unreliable. We learned how to "beat" them in a college psychology class. I wouldn't take one, ever -- especially not if it had anything to do with incompetent police who were trying to put something I didn't do on me.

I thought they failed more often the other way. Like, I mean, if I wasn't guilty, and was nervous about the polygraph, it would make me look guilty.

LD tests should be done away with. They seem like such a waste of time, and I think that time would be of the essence, what with statutes of limitations,etc.

[Kevin]

Val -- polygraphs are even admissible in Colorado?

[valkyrie]

Originally Posted by ktsnake

Val -- polygraphs are even admissible in Colorado?

I didn't think they were admissible anywhere...but I haven't looked it up here.