Stolen KKG pins! Please help! Pass this along....

[AZTheta]

Here's the KKG historian's polite message to the seller, just to clear up any misperceptions or misunderstandings that might arise from using the word "donate" in quotes.

I am the staff archivist and museum curator for Kappa Kappa Gamma. I recently learned of your auction and was immediately intrigued by the badges and their connection to a Civil War veteran. Is there a chance you would be willing to sell the badges directly to our organization? Their historical significance to Kappa Kappa Gamma is great as we work to interpret the history of our organization in the context of the women's movement. We have two Victorian house museums in which we display pieces like these badges to share the history of women and how traditional roles in society began to shift at the close of the Civil War. As a nonprofit organization we are unable to devote great resources to acquire objects for our exhibits and rely heavily on donations. But as we prepare to celebrate our 150th Anniversary in 2020, we do have some resources that can be put towards the purchase of objects intended for display and interpretation. Thanks for considering, Kylie Towers Smith, Archivist/Cura


The insurance company will definitely be interested in recovering stolen property. Why haven't they been contacted to get involved?

[badgeguy]

Originally Posted by AZTheta

Here's the KKG historian's polite message to the seller, just to clear up any misperceptions or misunderstandings that might arise from using the word "donate" in quotes.

I am the staff archivist and museum curator for Kappa Kappa Gamma. I recently learned of your auction and was immediately intrigued by the badges and their connection to a Civil War veteran. Is there a chance you would be willing to sell the badges directly to our organization? Their historical significance to Kappa Kappa Gamma is great as we work to interpret the history of our organization in the context of the women's movement. We have two Victorian house museums in which we display pieces like these badges to share the history of women and how traditional roles in society began to shift at the close of the Civil War. As a nonprofit organization we are unable to devote great resources to acquire objects for our exhibits and rely heavily on donations. But as we prepare to celebrate our 150th Anniversary in 2020, we do have some resources that can be put towards the purchase of objects intended for display and interpretation. Thanks for considering, Kylie Towers Smith, Archivist/Cura


The insurance company will definitely be interested in recovering stolen property. Why haven't they been contacted to get involved?

Because insurance companies cannot deal with eBay, only the police can....if they get to it in time or better, if eBay gets the message in time to do something about it.

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by badgeguy

Because insurance companies cannot deal with eBay, only the police can....if they get to it in time or better, if eBay gets the message in time to do something about it.

Oh, you do understand ebay policies? Good. Regardless, the insurance company will want their property, which they now own as they paid the owners for it. They will definitely bring pressure to bear on ebay. Then it is a matter between your "friends" and their insurance company.

ebay does not want to get shut down for selling stolen property.

This is not rocket science.

[AZTheta]

And so that you can draw your own conclusions, here is the seller's equally courteous and polite response:

Thanks for you email Kylie, As you can see from the bidding several collectors have interest in these pieces. Some may be looking to add these unusual pieces to their own collection. I was glad that an Internet search turned up their father's Civil War connection. He must have been proud to have his daughters achieve a high degree of education around the turn of that century. I have to be fair to all so I must continue the auction. If you are not the high bidder on these pieces I can certainly pass your Ebay name onto the winning bidder. I am sure they will be glad to contribute information, photos, etc. of scarce or unusual pieces from their own collection to assist you in keeping the history of Kappa Kappa Gamma alive and open to all of those interested in the wonderful achievements of that fine organization. Best of luck, Brian from Estateauction

[FloridaTish]

So in other words, the seller isn't a the total douche canoe like BadgeGuy is making him out to appear.

[AZTheta]

^^^ winner winner chicken dinner!

[SWTXBelle]

If the insurance company paid out, they are in fact now the owners of the badges, so they should indeed contact e-bay. They will also have a copy of the police report as part of their file. A few strokes of the computer keyboard and all is taken care of - ta da!

[UVA17]

Not sure how a simple question led to two pages of interrogation. Badgeguy, I hope your friend contacts the police and gets her badges back. I know people often insure their badges, but a replacement doesn't have that sentimental value. Good luck!

[FloridaTish]

Interrogation? Oh please...it was just people pointing out the obvious.

And yes, I truly hope the badges are returned to the rightful owners, who in my eyes...are the sisters of KAPPA KAPPA GAMMA.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by FloridaTish

Interrogation? Oh please...it was just people pointing out the obvious.

And yes, I truly hope the badges are returned to the rightful owners, who in my eyes...are the sisters of KAPPA KAPPA GAMMA.

Yes, badges of this significance belong in one of our museums.

[SWTXBelle]

Possible silver lining - if the top bidder refuses to pay, there is no requirement for them to be offered to auction again. Perhaps the seller would then just sell to Kappa IHQ.

[badgeguy]

You are focusing on the wrong thing. The point I am making is that several people including the archivist of KKG AND my friends to have the auction stopped. The point is that the seller graciously denied all those who emailed about ending the auction in order to let it run it's course, even thoughy friend tried to give the details of how they originally got the pins being handed down through the family....

Yes a police report would resolve it all....and the police are trying to locate that report, but being in a small town, and it being from over 10 years ago, it's not that quick to get it.....

The seller stated that he bought these pins from the direct blood line of the family, but that would mean my friends family sold this guy the badges which isn't the case.

I fear that those on here seem to be confusing me with someone else, and that I am hiding something, which I'm not. That I'm a liar, which I'm not, and really take offense to those accusations.

Regardless of how the auction ends, my friends luckily have a police report somewhere in the files that will be able to get these pins back.

Again, thanks to those who did supply info on the eBay thing. My friend was hoping to not have to get the police involved.....I guess in this day and age, people aren't able to work out the issues without running to authorities. That's sort of a bummer.

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by badgeguy

You are focusing on the wrong thing. The point I am making is that several people including the archivist of KKG AND my friends to have the auction stopped. The point is that the seller graciously denied all those who emailed about ending the auction in order to let it run it's course, even thoughy friend tried to give the details of how they originally got the pins being handed down through the family....

Yes a police report would resolve it all....and the police are trying to locate that report, but being in a small town, and it being from over 10 years ago, it's not that quick to get it.....

The seller stated that he bought these pins from the direct blood line of the family, but that would mean my friends family sold this guy the badges which isn't the case.

I fear that those on here seem to be confusing me with someone else, and that I am hiding something, which I'm not. That I'm a liar, which I'm not, and really take offense to those accusations.

Regardless of how the auction ends, my friends luckily have a police report somewhere in the files that will be able to get these pins back.

Again, thanks to those who did supply info on the eBay thing. My friend was hoping to not have to get the police involved.....I guess in this day and age, people aren't able to work out the issues without running to authorities. That's sort of a bummer.

QFP

[Estateauction]

Let me introduce myself. My name is Brian from Estateauction on Ebay. I am the person who is selling these pins on Ebay. I have been trying to post this update on Ebay but Ebay does not allow additions to be added within 12 hours of the ending of an auction. I was notified of this board by a fine Ebay member who told me my name was being trashed by some posters. I thanked him and started my own investigation. I can say that GxxU (named hidden) has emailed me twice looking for rare pins and over an hour ago I informed him of my troubles trying to get my message out. I told him I can link the Blood Line of the Spaulding sisters to my other items. I believe GxxU (name hidden) may be the badge guy. If I am wrong please forgive me. As of yet he has not returned my email as I want this information made public. If he did get my mail and did not post it here I find that troubling.

If you reviewed my other auctions you will see that the first groups of pins are in fact related. I was glad to see in his post that the woman missing the two pins said my other items were not related to her burglary. As you will read below one P.E.O. star pin was in fact Gertrude Spaulding Havens. Her name after she was married. Also the badge that did not sell was Alice Spaulding’s husband M.H. Taylor in his younger years. The two other pins ending tonight are Alice’s Husband M.H. Taylor and their son M.H. Taylor Jr. The spoons are also from my purchase. An advanced collector could have easily determined this.

I must thank all of the people who supported me without knowing all of the facts. I clearly listed all of the names on the auctions. The update below was written before I found this chat board. I hope that you will take the time to read my opinion. I feel I am being railroaded and I want to do the right thing. Is my auction being high jacked to benefit someone? I think a museum would be a good place for these pins. I don’t know much about your groups but you are all doing a wonderful job preserving the history of your groups. Below you will read my different scenarios of what may have happened 100 years ago. Again, thanks for all of your support and please follow up with your opinions. Also, I was never asked to stop the auction. I knew I had a link between the pieces and was waiting for more facts.

Many Thanks, Brian from Estateauction


AUCTION UPDATE: A few people were asking me how these pins were acquired. They were purchased through descendents of the original family. Now we are talking over 100 years of genealogy, an account of the descent of a person, family, or group from an ancestor or from older forms. The Spaulding sisters went to college and joined the KKG. A question arose that presented that these TWO pins may have been given away to replace a missing pin that another KKG woman had lost about 100 years ago. Please hang in there with me as I am trying to trace the history of these two pieces.

I have been an antique dealer in New Jersey for over four decades. I enjoy tracking the history of pieces. We must go over some scenarios. The question is did the Spaulding sisters give their TWO original pins away? Did the Spaulding sisters buy replacements pins for the missing pin? If so, did the Spaulding sisters receive replacement pins for the TWO pins they gave away, either purchased for themselves or given to them by others. Did one of the Spaulding sisters or family member later receive the two pins back? These scenarios would have occurred nearly 10 decades ago.

I want to be fair to all KKG collectors and to all of you who have been following this auction. Are these TWO pins the property of the Spauldings? What could link them to the true blood line of descendents? Did the Spaulding descendents regain the ownership of these TWO pins if they were given away? My claim that I purchased them from descendents of the family can be shown in my Ebay auction that just ended. Both of the Spaulding sisters got married. Many of you may have viewed the auction: 14K Gold P.E.O STAR PIN Sorority KANSAS 1919 Gertrude S. Havens MAIDEN SPAULDING. There was not much interest in this piece but it does reveal a direct blood line of the descendents of the family. This pin is about 20 years older than the TWO pins in this auction.

How could they get to New Jersey. The married name Havens were original family founders of the town in the area where these were purchased. I also have other information on the Spauldings. I hope that this information is helpful to those of you who are following this auction.

Just a quick tidbit. Having dealt with many families over the years I cannot recount the number of times that a family member has told me that they have their grandparents’ sterling silver flatware set which is over 100 years old. I am the one who must inform them that the set they had for years is only silver plated. When facts transition over time sometimes the true facts change a bit. That is why I am going over different scenarios which may have occurred.
Thanks so much for reading this new information. Brian from Estateauction

[SWTXBelle]

Having to prove that an item is indeed stolen property is hardly "a bummer". That's just common sense. If you make an accusation you should be prepared to provide some sort of support for your claim.