All American Muslim

[als463]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

Lol sister we finally agree on something. You worded it way better than I did. (aka sometimes when you're posting on a message board, things don't come out right) I never thought they were terrorists. After high school I didn't think anything of Muslims because there were none there. I began college in 1999 and meeting people of all backgrounds and colors was something new. I learned that there were many great people, and this was before 9/11. I didn't know much about the 93 bombing so I really had no opinion. Had I started college after 9/11, because, really, negativity about Muslims is all the media portrays. I might've thought different. But that wasn't the case.



It's not stupid actually lol. Many Muslims (and Chaldeans and Lebanese and Arab in general) do have an accent even though they were born here. But I also see an accept between people in my little area of southeastern Michigan. Eastsiders especially.

No worries. I knew what you meant. I came from a small town and started college after September 11th. In fact, I was in the military at the time it happened. I can still remember the hateful comments people in my small town would make about the whole situation. I'm glad there is a show like this to help other people who don't have much diversity see things from a different perspective. My town is about 99% Caucasian. Not everyone leaves my town to go to the military or college. Many of the people on here who may have been fortunate enough to grow up in a diverse town would be shocked at the beliefs still held by some of the people (of all ages) in my hometown because they never actually left.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

I didn't know that religion was race based?

Religion is correlated with race, ethnicity, and culture. Are you one of those people who pretends that the history; and racial, ethnic, and cultural dynamics of religions around the world are a mere coincidence?

This is one of the more amusing threads in a minute and that has nothing to do with the new show.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by als463

Many of the people on here who may have been fortunate enough to grow up in a diverse town would be shocked at the beliefs still held by some of the people (of all ages) in my hometown because they never actually left.

Most people in this country do not grow up in diverse "towns." The average American may see or interact with people of a different religion, race, ethnicity, or culture at work or school (sometimes, not even that) but consciously and subconsciously spends more valued time in religiously, racially, ethnically, and culturally segregated friendship and family environments.

So, there is nothing shocking about what PM_Mama experienced. What is interesting is how she conceptualized and expressed what she learned. Afterall, "many I met were wonderful people." But, of course, PM_Mama will claim ignorance and pretend as though I was just randomly trying to create one of "those threads."

Anyway, back to the thread that is not really about a show.

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Most people in this country do not grow up in diverse "towns." The average American may see or interact with people of a different religion, race, ethnicity, or culture at work or school (sometimes, not even that) but consciously and subconsciously spends more valued time in religiously, racially, ethnically, and culturally segregated friendship and family environments.

So, there is nothing shocking about what PM_Mama experienced. What is interesting is how she conceptualized and expressed what she learned. Afterall, "many I met were wonderful people." But, of course, PM_Mama will claim ignorance and pretend as though I was just randomly trying to create one of "those threads."

Anyway, back to the thread that is not really about a show.

Actually no, I'm not ignorant. I didn't conceptualize what I learned.... I worded my thoughts incorrectly. Als worded it better.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

Actually no, I'm not ignorant. I didn't conceptualize what I learned.... I worded my thoughts incorrectly. Als worded it better.

Thanks to als463.

[als463]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Thanks to als463.

Oh, well thank you ladies! The truth is that we should thank EVERYONE in this thread for making it such a great topic of discussion. If we never have discussions like this, things will never change. I applaud PM Mama for bringing up this show (which I hadn't even heard of--though I watch more television than I should even admit) and DrPhil (as well as anyone else) who made a point to look at this from a different perspective. I think we can all learn from one another on here.

I think I may check this show out! Thanks PM Mama for bringing it to my attention. Also, thanks for giving me another reason to procrastinate in doing my work , lol.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Most people in this country do not grow up in diverse "towns." The average American may see or interact with people of a different religion, race, ethnicity, or culture at work or school (sometimes, not even that) but consciously and subconsciously spends more valued time in religiously, racially, ethnically, and culturally segregated friendship and family environments.

Anyway, back to the thread that is not really about a show.

I didn't watch the show--I don't really watch that much TV so it's no surprise there.

Sometimes diversity leads to more segregation. In terms of numbers, I didn't grow up in a diverse town the way that NYC or SF are "diverse cities," but there was a lot less segregation since there wasn't a _____ community the way that some cities have. Because of the military, my hometown has substantial populations of Thai and Filipina women; but outside of that, there are only handfuls of other ethnic groups and they tend to associate with larger groups. For example, the Indo-Caribbean people will associate with the larger "Black community" in my hometown, while in NYC they are segregated by countries--there are delineated Trinidadian and Guyanese communities that don't mix all that often. Eastern Europeans and other white immigrants just get assimilated into specific "white" communities based on their socio-economic status. I guess it's more of a "melting pot," which has its benefits and drawbacks.

The accent thing that PM_Mama mentioned doesn't surprise me at all--I see it in some groups here. If they're living in insular communities, patronizing the same businesses, and going to schools in the same areas, then there are fewer opportunities to interact with larger communities and the accents stay, even among second-generation Americans.

[ElieM]

As the child of a Dutch parent and a Speech pathologist, I have an accent. I am often asked where I come from. It's interesting.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by als463

If we never have discussions like this, things will never change.

Realistically, discussions like this are not what make things substantively change. Things change when societies remove incentives and resources for keeping things the way they are; and add incentives and resources for change.

There are plenty of people who will watch All American Muslim, claim to be gaining insights, and will still say and do things that potentially negatively impact Muslims. To reiterate what I typed on page 1, shows like All American Muslim, Black in America, and Latina in America tend to merely create "exceptions to the rule." Such is life and the constant challenge of differences across groups of people (which are not inherently bad) and the inequalities that were created based on those differences.

Just being honest to avoid the ponies pissing rainbows routine that tends to happen when people discuss group dynamics. We can discuss a show and discuss the details behind the show without it becoming about some sweeping change that is going to make the planet fart unicorns.

[als463]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Realistically, discussions like this are not what make things substantively change. Things change when societies remove incentives and resources for keeping things the way they are; and add incentives and resources for change.

There are plenty of people who will watch All American Muslim, claim to be gaining insights, and will still say and do things that potentially negatively impact Muslims. To reiterate what I typed on page 1, shows like All American Muslim, Black in America, and Latina in America tend to merely create "exceptions to the rule." Such is life and the constant challenge of differences across groups of people (which are not inherently bad) and the inequalities that were created based on those differences.

Just being honest to avoid the ponies pissing rainbows routine that tends to happen when people discuss group dynamics. We can discuss a show and discuss the details behind the show without it becoming about some sweeping change that is going to make the planet fart unicorns.

Oh, no I don't think this thread will necessarily open up doors or eyes of people who choose not to read but, I do think it's great to have these conversations. For instance, I remember you saying something in a thread (I think it was you) that said something about how saying, "I have a ____ friend," really makes a person look dumb. To be honest, until that was said in that thread, I never thought about it and I'm sure I was guilty of it as well. No, I didn't make racial slurs and then say, "Well, my friend is ___ so, that is okay" but, I'm sure I have said things similar to, "I'm not racist. Don't call me that. I have friends who are ____." When it was mentioned by people of various races in a thread, I started being more aware of what I say and how I say it. In fact, I def. pick up on it when other people do it. So, this may not change everyone's perspective but, it can help those of use (a general we) who didn't realize how close-minded we sounded.

[VandalSquirrel]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

I didn't watch the show--I don't really watch that much TV so it's no surprise there.

Sometimes diversity leads to more segregation. In terms of numbers, I didn't grow up in a diverse town the way that NYC or SF are "diverse cities," but there was a lot less segregation since there wasn't a _____ community the way that some cities have. Because of the military, my hometown has substantial populations of Thai and Filipina women; but outside of that, there are only handfuls of other ethnic groups and they tend to associate with larger groups. For example, the Indo-Caribbean people will associate with the larger "Black community" in my hometown, while in NYC they are segregated by countries--there are delineated Trinidadian and Guyanese communities that don't mix all that often. Eastern Europeans and other white immigrants just get assimilated into specific "white" communities based on their socio-economic status. I guess it's more of a "melting pot," which has its benefits and drawbacks.

The accent thing that PM_Mama mentioned doesn't surprise me at all--I see it in some groups here. If they're living in insular communities, patronizing the same businesses, and going to schools in the same areas, then there are fewer opportunities to interact with larger communities and the accents stay, even among second-generation Americans.

I grew up in one of those "diverse cities" and if I hadn't left and moved away to eventually live in Idaho I'd be less knowledgeable about the diversity of White people. It sounds strange to some people, but I had never been around so many White people (including Christian & Conservative) until my first day in Idaho and it was unsettling since I had never been around so many other White people before. Even though I'm White and Protestant (ELCA Lutheran, so on the far liberal end) that's where a lot of the commonality ends which has caused me existential angst I never knew existed. I knew that White people who hated the government, were literal word of God speaking in tongues Christians or Mormons, and had never eaten ethnic foods I did regularly nor met anyone of certain groups existed, I just never knew any personally.

The military does bring some unexpected diversity in some places, my experience being in Alaska and overseas. Now I want some lumpia, dammit.

[PM_Mama00]

http://www.clickondetroit.com/entert...o/-/index.html

Lowe's has pulled its advertising from the reality TV show "All-American Muslim," which the retail store called a "lightning rod."

"All-American Muslim" is an eight-part series that follows five Muslim families living in Dearborn, Michigan.

"Lowe's has received a significant amount of communication on this program, from every perspective possible. Individuals and groups have strong political and societal views on this topic, and this program became a lightning rod for many of those views. As a result we did pull our advertising on this program," the company said in a statement Saturday.
Quick Clicks

"We believe it is best to respectfully defer to communities, individuals and groups to discuss and consider such issues of importance."

The conservative Florida Family Association, which is pushing advertisers to drop "All-American Muslim," cheered Lowe's decision. The group called the TLC show "propaganda that riskily hides the Islamic agenda's clear and present danger to American liberties and traditional values."

But the company's decision was decried by the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) and at least one of the show's cast members.

Both CAIR and Shadia Amen-McDermott, who is featured on the show, posted links on their Facebook pages to a petition, calling on advertisers to continue their support.

Late Saturday night, the petition had some 2,300 signatures.

"This is NOT about standing up for All-American Muslim - This is about Standing Up Against Bigotry and Hatred in this Country Founded on Peace, Justice, and Equality. Let's Stand United against Bigotry," Amen-McDermott wrote.

This is absurd.

[agzg]

It just speaks to the larger point of the show, doesn't it?

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by agzg

It just speaks to the larger point of the show, doesn't it?

That was exactly my thought. I wonder if any others will be pulling out.

[Low C Sharp]

Realistically, discussions like this are not what make things substantively change. Things change when societies remove incentives and resources for keeping things the way they are; and add incentives and resources for change.

In the case of gay rights, at least, I think that TV and movies played a role in the growing cultural acceptance of gay people in the younger generation. There was a certain amount of progress that had to be made to get "Will & Grace," etc., onto the national stage, but once that happens, cultural change accelerates. Whatever the imperfections of those media images, it's a big deal that kids in every small town are aware that gay people exist, and that those gay people aren't ashamed of themselves. I believe that plays a role in the fact that young people in this country are so much less homophobic than their parents. We're a long way from happy pony land, but boy, there's been a ton of progress, and I think TV shows had their part in advancing it.