NYC community board OKs ground zero mosque plans

[MasTNX]

Great example Soror!

No one thinks all White Christians are Klansmen.

And even if White Christian Southerners are stereotyped as being racist, look at how specific the grouping had to get??
If they were protesting against immigrant Muslims from Saudia Arabia and Pakistan, it would still be wrong, but at least it would show that people understood the issue.

[DrPhil]

I agree with Newt Gingrich and Bill O'Reilly that this was a political move to make a point that will be interpreted in different ways. Not wanting a mosque at Ground Zero isn't about stereotyping or hating Muslims. It's a question of why does it have to be THERE? Why there?

I also agree with Gingrich that perhaps an interfaith facility could be built at Ground Zero that contains a mosque, synagogue, and church so that Muslims, Jews, and Christians can show unity in their worship.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Animate

Well aren't we supposed to be "better" than that?

No.

Originally Posted by Animate

I think the building of the mosque is a much needed gesture at the least to try to bridge the gap to help people understand Islam and those that follow its beliefs.

How will this help people understand Islam and Muslims?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

There's already a mosque closer to Ground Zero....

Then why is this a news story?

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

I agree with Newt Gingrich and Bill O'Reilly that this was a political move to make a point that will be interpreted in different ways. Not wanting a mosque at Ground Zero isn't about stereotyping or hating Muslims. It's a question of why does it have to be THERE? Why there?

I also agree with Gingrich that perhaps an interfaith facility could be built at Ground Zero that contains a mosque, synagogue, and church so that Muslims, Jews, and Christians can show unity in their worship.

The mosque (which is more of a community center) isn't a new project. They've been working on this since before 9/11. They own the property.

Asking them to "have consideration" and to move elsewhere both disregards the fact that their community suffered in 9/11 just like the rest of NYC and the country. And, it comes down to Why NOT build it there? I mean, not only did they not have anything to do with the terrorist attacks, but they're not even the same sect of Islam, they don't have anything like the same beliefs. And all of this insinuates that they do.

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Then why is this a news story?

Because people are stupid and reactionary. Not to mention that some think that Muslims are "THEY" and not part of the WE THE PEOPLE."

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

The mosque (which is more of a community center) isn't a new project. They've been working on this since before 9/11. They own the property.

Did I miss this in one of the articles?

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Because people are stupid and reactionary. Not to mention that some think that Muslims are "THEY" and not part of the WE THE PEOPLE."

Muslim citizens are "we the people" as far as I'm concerned but news agencies from various sources have been very selective in the details for this story.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Then why is this a news story?

You know the answer to that. There's so much misunderstanding surrounding this whole topic. The proposed building will house a fitness center, swimming pool, meeting rooms, cultural center, culinary school, library, etc. all of which are open to the entire community.

It's going to be a modern thirteen-story center. The "mosque" is only a part of it. Also, it's not AT ground zero. It's blocks away. There's currently a Christian church closer to ground zero than this building will be.

The mosque that is AT ground zero has been there for 30 years and is not affiliated with the Islamic center we're discussing.

ETA: If you haven't seen this article, I recommend giving it a look: http://www.forward.com/articles/128347/

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

The proposed building will house a fitness center, swimming pool, meeting rooms, cultural center, culinary school, library, etc. all of which are open to the entire community.

What the building consists of is extremely unimportant to me. Jewish centers in many areas hold the same things and most of them are open to the community (some with a minimal fee for some of the faciliites), but that doesn't minimize the fact that it's a Jewish center. I also never forget that the YMCA and YWCA are Christian-based. That's very apparent regardless of whether the entire community can use the facilities. It's also no surprise when the entire community, in some religiously and racially/ethnicity heterogenous areas, does NOT use the facilities.

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

There's currently a Christian church closer to ground zero than this building will be.

So? LOL. Christianity remains the dominant religion in America.

Anyway, I've gone back to not giving a shit about this topic since there's a mosque at ground zero that has been there for 30 years.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Did I miss this in one of the articles?

I don't know about the ones posted here, but it's been all over CNN.
Referenced here
http://www.masjidmanhattan.com/

As for it's specific location being closer, I don't know the city well.

However it's also relevant that the building that they'll be tearing down, though once a store, is currently... a mosque.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/09/ny...sque.html?_r=1

They just want to build a community center out of it while retaining the prayer space. They describe it like a YMCA and with a pool among other facilities i can't think they're that wrong.

Muslim citizens are "we the people" as far as I'm concerned but news agencies from various sources have been very selective in the details for this story.

I've caught some CNN during the day and they've been decent, but this is why I prefer the internet for sources.

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/...ro-mosque.html
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/...ro-mosque.html

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

So? LOL. Christianity remains the dominant religion in America.

But it cannot legally be privileged under the law. Not even if it makes some people feel uncomfortable.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

But it cannot legally be privileged under the law. Not even if it makes some people feel uncomfortable.

I know. For the aforementioned reason, it's simply not noteworthy that a Christian center is at ground zero.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

What the building consists of is extremely unimportant to me. Jewish centers in many areas hold the same things and most of them are open to the community (some with a minimal fee for some of the faciliites), but that doesn't minimize the fact that it's a Jewish center. I also never forget that the YMCA and YWCA are Christian-based. That's very apparent regardless of whether the entire community can use the facilities. It's also no surprise when the entire community, in some religiously and racially/ethnicity heterogenous areas, does NOT use the facilities.

You've hit on my point. This facility has been modeled specifically on Jewish Community Centers (JCCs). Titling it a mosque is a half-truth that has been perpetrated by Islamophobes who want to get a reaction out of you.

Perhaps in the not-too-distant future, we'll be seeing Islamic Centers popping up all over the country. Then, after a while, they'll become so common that people will forget that they're Islamic Centers...like many people - other than you - have forgotten what the "C" in YMCA/YWCA stands for.

Originally Posted by Drolefille

But it cannot legally be privileged under the law. Not even if it makes some people feel uncomfortable.

Precisely.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

like many people - other than you - have forgotten what the "C" in YMCA/YWCA stands for.

I would like to meet those people. I guess they were following behind The Village People.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

I would like to meet those people. I guess they were following behind The Village People.

I had heard rumors that people didn't realize YMCA was an acronym. I hadn't met these people until very recently. One of my coworkers remarked on the YMCA changing its name to "The Y." In the conversation that followed, I discovered that she had no idea of the former legal name.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

I had heard rumors that people didn't realize YMCA was an acronym. I hadn't met these people until very recently. One of my coworkers remarked on the YMCA changing its name to "The Y." In the conversation that followed, I discovered that she had no idea of the former legal name.

Our YMCA and YWCA merged into "The Y" here many years ago. I think it simply reflects how their mission has changed and move away from the religious orientation. But I'm not surprised that not everyone knows what it stood for if they'd never had a reason to ask.