2007 UGA Recruitment

[UGAalum94]

I've recently found out that a lot of what I thought I knew about rush at UGA is wrong, but the way I understand it it that she would be completely ineligible to be a quota addition if she didn't list all three. It's a reward for maximizing your options, and she wouldn't have.

(and apparently, it's not a guaranteed reward. A girl who maximized her options can still end up without a bid.)

[sarasmile]

Originally Posted by AlphaGamUGAAlum

(and apparently, it's not a guaranteed reward. A girl who maximized her options can still end up without a bid.)

If a chapter hits or goes over chapter total by taking quota, would they be able to take a quota addition?

That's one situation where I could see a PNM who maximized her options not getting a bid...she prefs 3 chapters who go over chapter total by taking quota. Since each chapter is already over total, maybe they couldn't take a quota addition? (just a guess, but it seems like a likely possibility...)

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by sarasmile

If a chapter hits or goes over chapter total by taking quota, would they be able to take a quota addition?

That's one situation where I could see a PNM who maximized her options not getting a bid...she prefs 3 chapters who go over chapter total by taking quota. Since each chapter is already over total, maybe they couldn't take a quota addition? (just a guess, but it seems like a likely possibility...)

I have no idea. A friend of mine politely pointed out that I had bad information about girls getting bids for maximizing options, and now I realize how little I really do know.

It appears to me that some groups I would guess would be over total took additions, but I just don't know.

[SoCalGirl]

I believe the Green Book suggests the max allowed quota additons to be 5% of quota. So if quota is 55, a chapter could take a max of 3 more as quota additions. I don't think total factors in to who's eligible to take additions.

I think Barbara can clarify but I think QA works similar regular bid matching to try and match girls with their first choice. But if her first choice maxed their QA before she comes up on their list then her second choice would get a shot at her.


Now that we've had a more thorough explanation of QA I have mixed feelings about the process. In the old school days if a girl failed to match to any of her top choices she either didn't go greek or started to consider other chapters in COB or as a snap bid. Chapters that were smaller (and may have had added stigma just because they were smaller) had a better shot at these girls and turning their numbers around. Now NPC leans more towards favoring the PNM instead of the chapters. I guess they'd rather have fewer chapters that are bigger than more chapters that are smaller. The way I see it is that if a smaller chapter is struggling, QAs takes a sizable chunk of their PNMs out the equation. Which really stinks because we've all heard stories or have sisters that end up in houses that they would never want to be in only to find they'd never want to be any where else!

[AnchorAlumna]

That's what I've felt all along. With QAs, the big get bigger, and the small either stagnate or get smaller.
Are QAs to blame for 300-girl chapters? No....but it doesn't help. If there are enough girls dropping or not getting matched, then the campus can consider expansion.

[FSUZeta]

i believe that in the event that a pnm is matchless with all three of her pref. card rankings and would then be eligible as a quota addition, techinically first dibs on her is supposed to go to the smaller of the three chapters that she visited for prefs and ranked on her pref. card.

[Titchou]

From the NPC Manual of Information (aka "The Green Book"), page MR-57:

The woman will be matched to the fraternity chapter she has listed on her Membership Recruitment Acceptance Agreement [B]that is smallest in chapter size, as long as her name appears on that chapter's preferential bid list, [B] and that by matching her that group does not exceed Quota by more than 5 percent.


So as you can see, the purpose is first to place the woman in a group of her choosing and then to be sensitive to chapter size.

[Titchou]

From the NPC Manual of Information (aka "The Green Book"), page MR-57:

The woman will be matched to the fraternity chapter she has listed on her Membership Recruitment Acceptance Agreement that is smallest in chapter size, as long as her name appears on that chapter's preferential bid list, and that by matching her that group does not exceed Quota by more than 5 percent.


So as you can see, the purpose is first to place the woman in a group of her choosing and then to be sensitive to chapter size.

[cluelessUGAmom]

Originally Posted by FSUZeta

i believe that in the event that a pnm is matchless with all three of her pref. card rankings and would then be eligible as a quota addition, techinically first dibs on her is supposed to go to the smaller of the three chapters that she visited for prefs and ranked on her pref. card.

That doesn't seem "fair"....because if a pnm "maximizes" her bids even though she feels strongly that she is not a fit to her #3 or even her #2 this still limits her chances of getting her #1 if her #1 is doing QA's I would think. does that make sense???

Even though there are "many stories" of girls who couldn't be happier with where they wound up as they "look back" there are those girls who are not "shallow" in their own personal assessments and just trying to get into the so called campus "best" house, but rather are good at interviewing and reading people and know that they wouldn't "fit" there. (after all the pnm was cut by the other houses she listed as a fit - so she didn't tecnhically bring her prefs down to only 1) This process has the "system" as being "taken care of" instead of the girl and let's try to "improve XYZ" by pushing her there any way we can because she has lot's to offer! And, unfortunately for the pnm who "has lots to offer" (other than A+ looks and top social connections) is typically a good-hearted soul and maximizes her bids because it is the "right thing to do" meaning that she didn't do like others she saw and "kill her interviews" at the parties if she didn't want to be "there"....

I think from all that I have been hearing and been told outright in PM and from girls who have been "placed" in houses of 2nd and 3rd choices just because they maximized their bids -- these girls are not truly happy. Yes, they should give it time, have an open mind and all -- but I'm not so sure I don't agree with considering the "suicide" option....At least doing it that way the pnm knows it's an all or nothing and if it's a nothing can move on to classes with an open, clear head and try again next year instead of being consumed with "trying to make it work".

I know that this is a diversion from my previous posts and I certainly don't want anyone to assume that I am "speaking" for my D as I have spoken to many moms and girls about their placements and this is how "I" feel in my assessment remembering that I'm not greek.

[cluelessUGAmom]

Originally Posted by Titchou

From the NPC Manual of Information (aka "The Green Book"), page MR-57:

The woman will be matched to the fraternity chapter she has listed on her Membership Recruitment Acceptance Agreement that is smallest in chapter size, as long as her name appears on that chapter's preferential bid list, and that by matching her that group does not exceed Quota by more than 5 percent.


So as you can see, the purpose is first to place the woman in a group of her choosing and then to be sensitive to chapter size.

where do you find "the green book"?

[bejazd]

Originally Posted by cluelessUGAmom

where do you find "the green book"?

The "green book" is the NPC Recruitment "how to" book for sorority chapter recruitment chairs, recruitment advisors and Panhellenic officers, advisors etc. It's not something available to the general public. The info in there includes guidelines on how to run a Panhellenic recruitment ...balancing fairness to the PNMs and fairness to the chapters. Keep in mind that different people can read the same guidelines and have different interpretations of what the guidelines mean and how to implement them.

The Panhellenic advisor at your campus should be able to answer any and all questions you have about bid matching and options available to women still interested in pledging at your specific school.

[UGAalum94]

CluelessUGAmom,

I understand that from your perspective, you want your daughter matched to her top group. But much of the process is designed to level the playing field for the groups and to some degree for the PNMs.

The ideal recruitment would leave each group at campus with the same sized pledge class, and if possible every girls with her first choice. But it's completely against every girl at her first choice if it will create wild differences in size among the groups.

The point of quota additions is to offer girls who maximize their chances another shot at being placed. Maximizing her options isn't just being willing to list them all and take a bid from one or two: it means she was open to all the groups. If a PNM isn't really willing to be at a particular chapter, she shouldn't list them on her bid list. To list with no intention or desire to join isn't really maximizing options. It kind of violates the idea.

But where a PNM gets placed is also again, about equalizing size among the groups.

Basically, it kind of seems to me that you want her to have her cake and eat it too. Get the benefits of Quota Additions, but also not really have to worry about being placed at any but her favorite group. That's not how it works.

ETA: You are correct in your claim that the structure of recruitment benefits the groups. The NPC has worked hard to develop a system and procedures allowing the maximum number of groups to succeed at any given campus. Sometimes I wonder if it's too much and that we'd be better being more like the IFC groups. But honestly, when you look at the number of girls, at the recruitments who disclose the information, who do get their first preference choice as their group, it really does work well. Girls matched to choice two or three are really in the minority.

[jwright25]

Originally Posted by SoCalGirl

Now that we've had a more thorough explanation of QA I have mixed feelings about the process. In the old school days if a girl failed to match to any of her top choices she either didn't go greek or started to consider other chapters in COB or as a snap bid. Chapters that were smaller (and may have had added stigma just because they were smaller) had a better shot at these girls and turning their numbers around. Now NPC leans more towards favoring the PNM instead of the chapters. I guess they'd rather have fewer chapters that are bigger than more chapters that are smaller. The way I see it is that if a smaller chapter is struggling, QAs takes a sizable chunk of their PNMs out the equation. Which really stinks because we've all heard stories or have sisters that end up in houses that they would never want to be in only to find they'd never want to be any where else!

I can definitely see where you are coming from on this one. I always thought that way as well. However, now that campuses are implementing the new RFM, we are achieving greater parity amongst the chapters - meaning more of them are pledging quota, and the ones who miss are much closer than they have been in the past. QAs are rarely more than a few, 1-4 per chapter in a large system. Exceptions are made based on chapter size - meaning chapters who started out in recruitment with numbers on the lower end might receive more QAs to bring them closer to the average size. And the RFM process funnels PNMs their way anyway. If the chapter is doing a good job recruiting, having meaningful conversations with their PNMs, and showing enthusiasm about the recruitment process, PNMs will find them desirable and want to join.

When you make the suggestion that PNMs who are placed as QAs to strong chapters would have otherwise considered COB with weak chapters, I think that would only encompass a few women. Just as some women want to suicide because they would never want to be part of another group, they would never accept a COB invitation. So then we have to decide what is more important - the smallest chapter COB'ing one or two more people who mismatched; or placing 10 mismatches as QAs in larger chapters and increasing the size of the Greek system and making 10 women happy and excited to be part of it.

[jwright25]

Originally Posted by AlphaGamUGAAlum

But honestly, when you look at the number of girls, at the recruitments who disclose the information, who do get their first preference choice as their group, it really does work well. Girls matched to choice two or three are really in the minority.

I think this is a point worth emphasizing. I haven't read all of the stories from AU and UGA, so I don't know if there is a rash of GC PNMs who are getting their second or third choices. If so, they are definitely in the minority. By far.

[bejazd]

But doesn't a large number of QA's also indicate that somewhere in the the statistical end of recruitment, there are several chapters (maybe most of them) that simply kept inviting too many women to their parties (even if it was only by say 4-5?) and when they ended up having a better recruitment than they expected, these women sort of piled up and became the "mismatched." ????