Radford: Probation for Hazing (Sigma Chi)

[RU OX Alum]

yeah...i'll pm you

[TSteven]

Originally Posted by PSKPike

Also with the IFC, yea they try to do alot, and have a fair amount of control. Sigma Chi has actually been runninh IFC the last few years. The last president of IFC was Sigma Chi, and so was one of the vice presidents. Right now there are three Sig Chi's on IFC.

Doesn't each chapter have the same number of representatives? Or is the number of representatives based on chapter membership (i.e. numbers)?

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by PSKPike

The Greek Life director told us the university wanted to wait 5 years after the close of our chapter before they would consider reopening us. That way all of the old brothers would have graduated or left. We ended up being an off campus group for almost two years. Our nationals really went to bat for us and finally got us back on campus as a colony in fall 05, and we formally rechartered and initiated 29 new brothers feb 07.

Also with the IFC, yea they try to do alot, and have a fair amount of control. Sigma Chi has actually been runninh IFC the last few years. The last president of IFC was Sigma Chi, and so was one of the vice presidents. Right now there are three Sig Chi's on IFC. Im not sure how I feel about the whole thing, I am not sure if this was really a hazing issues, or more or less just a bad situation. All things said they are the biggest fraternity on campus, and I think they are getting off with the best possible outcome. As far as I know they can still take pledges and be a part of IFC, and all on campus events. I mean it was not that long ago (2003) when Sigma Nu got the boot for hazing, but that was a "real" case of hazing, much different than this.

How was SX able to control IFC? Usually there is one Rep. from each GLO!

5 years is normal for a comback to campus. That means the actives are all gone by then.
If hazing is a problem then it is the GLO problem and if they act like idiots then they will be gone as well they should be!


If the school is hard on it that then it is going to happen!

[TSteven]

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

How was SX able to control IFC?

Usually there is one Rep. from each GLO!

Agree. Or at least there should be equal representation. I know that at The University of Kentucky, unless it has changed, each chapter has two voting representatives on IFC. The chapter president and a chapter delegate. But again, since each chapter has the same number, no one chapter can control IFC without "help" from other chapters.

5 years is normal for a comeback to campus. That means the actives are all gone by then.

If the actives are gone in less than five years, then it could be less. Or the suspension might only be for the duration of the members who engaged in the hazing. If - as an example - only seniors were involved, then maybe the suspension might be for only one to two years.

[Rad06]

We have 3 Members on the Exec Board..only one IFC Rep Chair

[PSKPike]

Originally Posted by Tom Earp

How was SX able to control IFC? Usually there is one Rep. from each GLO!

5 years is normal for a comback to campus. That means the actives are all gone by then.
If hazing is a problem then it is the GLO problem and if they act like idiots then they will be gone as well they should be!


If the school is hard on it that then it is going to happen!

IFC requires each group send at least three brothers to each meeting, with one being the main rep. You can also have other brothers sit on the exec board. SX usually has two or more brothers on exec. For a time they had a brother as the president, judicial vice president, and tres.
We didnt have a problem with waiting the five years for all the former actives to have left school, it was more or less the way the university approached the whole situation. The former chapter had gone into a large amount of debt (tens of thousands of dollars) and had decided to close itself. There never was any issue with hazing, but the reception we recieved was not very open. We spent almost two years trying to get colony status and just be recognized by the university. Once we got colony status though we still werent able to vote at IFC because we were so new to campus, so we still had gained any pull on campus. It took us just about a year to go from colony back to a full chapter, but that first year we were on campus we got a lot of new members and ended up being larger than at least half of the other groups, and we ended up with the highest GPA of any GLO that year.

[TSteven]

Originally Posted by PSKPike

IFC requires each group send at least three brothers to each meeting, with one being the main rep. You can also have other brothers sit on the exec board. SX usually has two or more brothers on exec. For a time they had a brother as the president, judicial vice president, and tres.

From what you have written, it seems like Sigma Chi has three representatives - like every other chapter - yet additional members serving on the executive board.

As such, how is the executive board selected? Is the e-board elected or is it some sort of rotation? If they are elected, then who votes? And how does it work? i.e. one vote per chapter?

Again, my point is that if the feeling is that Sigma Chi has some sort of dominance on the e-board (and in my humble opinion, that may not be such a bad thing), then the Sigs are getting support from other chapters.

To be clear, I am not a fan of some IFCs when it comes to certain issues or the powers they might wield. Regardless, I understand the importance of being in a position - by having members serve on the e-board and forming alliances when necessary - to help form policy favorable to your chapter.

[PSKPike]

Originally Posted by TSteven

As such, how is the executive board selected? Is the e-board elected or is it some sort of rotation? If they are elected, then who votes? And how does it work? i.e. one vote per chapter?

The exec board is done through elections each year. As for the voting I do not remember exactly. I am an alum now, but I will try and find out from one of my active brothers how exactly it is done.

[KyleMcGuire1983]

at my school the same 4 or 5 fraternities control IFC Exec. Right now we have 2 bros (myself included) on the Board at SJSU.

What's with Sigma Nu and hazing these days?! Seems like in the past 5 years we've shut down a dozen chapters! I thought we were founded against this nonsense.

I still haven't seen what happened at Radford.....some links don't work and the rest are vague

[DeltAlum]

Originally Posted by TSteven

From what you have written, it seems like Sigma Chi has three representatives - like every other chapter - yet additional members serving on the executive board.

That's not at all uncommon. It just depends on how any fraternity system and school choose to set up their IFC.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by KyleMcGuire1983

at my school the same 4 or 5 fraternities control IFC Exec. Right now we have 2 bros (myself included) on the Board at SJSU.

What's with Sigma Nu and hazing these days?! Seems like in the past 5 years we've shut down a dozen chapters! I thought we were founded against this nonsense.

I still haven't seen what happened at Radford.....some links don't work and the rest are vague

Old school hazing is still alive and well, particularly in the South. It's one of those things I think IHQ just doesn't really want to acknowledge. I think closing down MTSU and KU was a shot across the bow, but I haven't seen any truly southern schools affected. No disrespect to MTSU, but they're not exactly in the same category tradition-wise as the SEC schools, although their recent achievements were very respectable.

I always ended up hanging out with guys most from the South whenever I went to Grand Chapter. While my chapter doesn't haze at all, I can say that at the time I was a collegian, hard pledging was something many of the guys I'd come across were pretty proud of.

[KyleMcGuire1983]

Originally Posted by Kevin

Old school hazing is still alive and well, particularly in the South. It's one of those things I think IHQ just doesn't really want to acknowledge. I think closing down MTSU and KU was a shot across the bow, but I haven't seen any truly southern schools affected. No disrespect to MTSU, but they're not exactly in the same category tradition-wise as the SEC schools, although their recent achievements were very respectable.

I always ended up hanging out with guys most from the South whenever I went to Grand Chapter. While my chapter doesn't haze at all, I can say that at the time I was a collegian, hard pledging was something many of the guys I'd come across were pretty proud of.

I think my chapter has pretty challenging pledging without being hazing or humiliating. We expect our candidates to run the pledge class as if it were an active chapter complete with their own meetings and projects. If they don't care to learn our history, organize events, and bond then WE don't care to initiate them. It's pretty easy. I think booting a crappy pledge is a harsher punishment than push ups or drinking contests.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by KyleMcGuire1983

I think my chapter has pretty challenging pledging without being hazing or humiliating. We expect our candidates to run the pledge class as if it were an active chapter complete with their own meetings and projects. If they don't care to learn our history, organize events, and bond then WE don't care to initiate them. It's pretty easy. I think booting a crappy pledge is a harsher punishment than push ups or drinking contests.

Oh I agree completely. My chapter is much like yours. We've fully adopted LEAD, although we've sort of incorporated it into our own program. I'm just saying that as a national organization, many of our chapters are still very traditional in terms of their new member programs. For what it's worth, none of the things I've heard about are things I could see anyone getting seriously hurt doing. Doing bows 'n toes on a scratchy hardwood floor may be embarrassing, painful, etc. but it won't kill you. It's definitely hazing though.

If I were a national officer, I honestly don't know how I'd treat something like that. I'd almost have a hard time shutting down a chapter when they were hazing but not doing things which could result in insurance claims down the road.

I think a lot has changed in recent years though. In most states, having a pledge do bows 'n toes would be a crime. Also, it's against the RM rules promulgated by the Grand Chapter, High Council, etc. The fact that someone broke the rules and the law in order to keep up a tradition which runs against the organization's national goals would be enough for me to justify closing even our biggest/best chapters although admittedly, it'd be very hard for me to do.