Sorority Shopping?

[PenguinTrax]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

AND...since we're talking about NPC Groups... A-L-U-M-N-A-E
There's only ONE NPC that can claim an Alumni.

OK, this is nit-picking, but the proper term is alumna for women, alumnae for a group of them.

For men, it is alumnus (singular) and alumni (plural). It is also alumni when speaking of mixed gender groups.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by PenguinTrax

OK, this is nit-picking, but the proper term is alumna for women, alumnae for a group of them.

For men, it is alumnus (singular) and alumni (plural). It is also alumni when speaking of mixed gender groups.

I know, but I didn't feel like going that far into it.

[SmartBlondeGPhB]

Originally Posted by MBurden

If you would review the message boards, and you clearly haven't, those seeking to join a sorority through AI don't "shop" on these boards...there is an unwritten rule that you don't mention the name of the sorority that you are seeking to join until AFTER you have been initiated. This is for alot of reasons, mainly, because it's an individual choice and isn't anyone else's business.

Yes they do.

If you read the threads, you would see that many comment that they are pursuing multiple groups at the same time. THAT is shopping, plain and simple. It's irrelevent if they actually SAY what groups they are going to.

Those of us who see those comments, and are then approached by them for help are much less likely to put 100% effort into helping them.

[Dionysus]

People shop for houses, jobs, and even SOs. Why would shopping for GLOs be any different? The reasons presented so far, aren't good enough to discourage some people from sorority shopping.

[SydneyK]

Originally Posted by James

So the big question is: Do you think that using GC as a a market to shop for a sorority, or even sorority shopping in general, is a good or bad thing?

To get this thread back on topic, I thought I'd take a stab at James' question.

Since I'm not an AI, my opinion is probably different from those who are AI or who are pursuing AI. Having said that, I think (my opinion only, obviously) that GC can be a useful tool for simply learning which orgs are NPC, which are local, what the difference is between them, and basic info like that. Since there isn't a campus (that I know of, anyway) that houses all 26 NPCs, it is likely that potential AIs are unfamiliar with a good number of them. GC can serve as a place to educate people about which orgs are even out there.

But, to try to learn about a specific org's policy on GC is probably not ideal. Since there are lots of links here to specific NPC websites, then GC can serve as the springboard for more in-depth research about specific groups. But, again, to try to take it further than that on here is probably going to steer some people in the wrong direction.

So, I think GC is not a good place for sorority-shopping, so-to-speak, but I think it can be a good place to learn about what sororities are even "available" should one decide she wants to look around.

I don't want to even touch the second part of your question, James. I can see good and bad points to sorority shopping... I'm going to just sit on that fence until I hear more arguments for or against it.

[SmartBlondeGPhB]

Originally Posted by SydneyK

I don't want to even touch the second part of your question, James. I can see good and bad points to sorority shopping... I'm going to just sit on that fence until I hear more arguments for or against it.

A woman should be joining a group that she feels (or has) a connection with. If she's shopping around then she obviously doesn't have one that she feels a connection with.

[SydneyK]

Originally Posted by SmartBlondeGPhB

A woman should be joining a group that she feels (or has) a connection with. If she's shopping around then she obviously doesn't have one that she feels a connection with.

Very true.

But, to play devil's advocate, a woman might have a connection with women in ABC, but may strongly support (through time, $, whatever) XYZ's philanthropy. So, her choice might depend on what she values more at the time - already established friendships with a less-than-appealing philanthropy or potential friendships built over a common dedication to an extremely appealing philanthropy.

Like I said earlier, I can see both sides. I think some women just want to join any sorority however they can. This type of "shopping" irritates me (although, I understand the argument that that's what undergrad PNMs are doing during rush; I also understand the rebuttal that all the groups are aware that they're being compared by PNMs). But, I think women can have connections to more than one group, in which case "shopping" isn't as offensive.

-I dunno... I'm still on the fence

[SmartBlondeGPhB]

Originally Posted by SydneyK

Very true.

But, to play devil's advocate, a woman might have a connection with women in ABC, but may strongly support (through time, $, whatever) XYZ's philanthropy. So, her choice might depend on what she values more at the time - already established friendships with a less-than-appealing philanthropy or potential friendships built over a common dedication to an extremely appealing philanthropy.

She's going to pick a philanthropy over already established FRIENDS??????? I really hope someone wouldn't actually do that.

I support Zeta's philanthropy every year (in fact my entire alumnae chapter does). That doesn't mean that I want (or need) to be a Zeta. I support many philanthropic endeavors outside of Gamma Phi Beta, I don't depend on Gamma Phi to give me all of my community service opportunities.

My alumnae chapter's last AI has the following story (for an example). She went to a college without a greek system, and had moved around quite a bit mostly due to being in the military. She was approaching the time when she wanted to leave the military and settle down with her young family. She wanted to get involved with a women's group that could also give her opportunities to help out college aged women. She stumbled onto GC, saw that I live in her general area and approached me about it. I met with her, introduced her to some of the other alumnae in her area (a bit away from me actually) and got her coming to our events. She found some of them that she has quite a bit in common with and she lives near one of our collegiate chapters. After a number of months, she was inivited to join and the rest is history.....

[adpiucf]

Originally Posted by James

So the big question is: Do you think that using GC as a a market to shop for a sorority, or even sorority shopping in general, is a good or bad thing?

What should be done if anything about it?

Or is it something that doesn't matter at all?

If the NPC organizations wanted to make AI a highly publicized activity, they would do so by aggressively promoting it within their memberships and holding open house events for PNAMs.

I've said this on another thread. NPC and its member organizations werefounded for the benefit of undergraduate membership. Alumnae membership is a completely separate bag and more of a way to keep members connected through friendship, community service and keeping the collegiate arm running through long-term strategic planning and programming.

Many alumnae are uninvolved because, quite frankly, there's no compelling reason for them to stay involved. Their membership won't be revoked if they never contribute another service hour in the name of sisterhood or pay a penny to the Foundation.

Sorority shopping would be a great thing is AI was structured as a recruitment-oriented activity. It's not. AI is an honor given to a few whom the sorority believes will add prestige, honor and/or service to the sorority. Once initated, AI's are sisters. Sure their experiences are a bit different from someone who had 4 years as a college member. That doesn't mean they won't make great advisers or alumnae officers once they get up to speed on sorority policies and activities-- heck, many of the alumnae advisers and officers I have worked with over the years have had to completely re-learn their sorority ABC's because they were not actively involved in undergrad or its been years since they have been involved and things have changed.

For those telling us that collegiate members are ungrateful, lazy and complain about all of the work: here's a cookie. Tell me what college students are happy about all of the work involved in classes that they have voluntarily registered for? If someone is going to transfer to another school or break up with her boyfriend due to peer pressure, that isn't due to the organization: it is that individual's personal sense of self that should be blamed. And just because you don't know any sorority alumnae who stayed active post college doesn't mean they don't exist.

Sorority as a resume builder? You must be joking. I am loathe to put my lengthy alumnae involvement on a resume: I'm not interested in being a martyr for the "Why don't you stand up and show people your involvement?" cause. Post-college, professionals and academics view Greek life differently. The "alumnae network" is something that you seek out by making calls, emails and sending letters-- not an established party line that finds you a job with an alumna. This doesn't make me less proud of my membership-- but there is a time and a place. I wouldn't list my faith-based activities on a resume, either. Discrimination exists, and I'd rather not be passed over for a job or a program because of someone else's personal biases or in trying to make a statement for all of Greekdom.

Shame on anyone speaking poorly of our collegiate members. These girls are incredibly overprogrammed, balancing school, sorority and life (which for many includes working at a real job), and the angst that comes with being 17-24. They're learning how to be an adult, be out on their own and how to make responsible choices. I applaud them for their service, programming and activities. Like it or not, collegians come first. We were founded for the benefit of undergraduate students, and that will continue to be our focus until NPC changes their creed from "We as undergraduate members..." And we're not there yet.

[ThetaPrincess24]

Originally Posted by adpiucf

If the NPC organizations wanted to make AI a highly publicized activity, they would do so by aggressively promoting it within their memberships and holding open house events for PNAMs.

I've said this on another thread. NPC and its member organizations werefounded for the benefit of undergraduate membership. Alumnae membership is a completely separate bag and more of a way to keep members connected through friendship, community service and keeping the collegiate arm running through long-term strategic planning and programming.

Many alumnae are uninvolved because, quite frankly, there's no compelling reason for them to stay involved. Their membership won't be revoked if they never contribute another service hour in the name of sisterhood or pay a penny to the Foundation.

Sorority shopping would be a great thing is AI was structured as a recruitment-oriented activity. It's not. AI is an honor given to a few whom the sorority believes will add prestige, honor and/or service to the sorority. Once initated, AI's are sisters. Sure their experiences are a bit different from someone who had 4 years as a college member. That doesn't mean they won't make great advisers or alumnae officers once they get up to speed on sorority policies and activities-- heck, many of the alumnae advisers and officers I have worked with over the years have had to completely re-learn their sorority ABC's because they were not actively involved in undergrad or its been years since they have been involved and things have changed.

For those telling us that collegiate members are ungrateful, lazy and complain about all of the work: here's a cookie. Tell me what college students are happy about all of the work involved in classes that they have voluntarily registered for? If someone is going to transfer to another school or break up with her boyfriend due to peer pressure, that isn't due to the organization: it is that individual's personal sense of self that should be blamed. And just because you don't know any sorority alumnae who stayed active post college doesn't mean they don't exist.

Sorority as a resume builder? You must be joking. I am loathe to put my lengthy alumnae involvement on a resume: I'm not interested in being a martyr for the "Why don't you stand up and show people your involvement?" cause. Post-college, professionals and academics view Greek life differently. The "alumnae network" is something that you seek out by making calls, emails and sending letters-- not an established party line that finds you a job with an alumna. This doesn't make me less proud of my membership-- but there is a time and a place. I wouldn't list my faith-based activities on a resume, either. Discrimination exists, and I'd rather not be passed over for a job or a program because of someone else's personal biases or in trying to make a statement for all of Greekdom.

Shame on anyone speaking poorly of our collegiate members. These girls are incredibly overprogrammed, balancing school, sorority and life (which for many includes working at a real job), and the angst that comes with being 17-24. They're learning how to be an adult, be out on their own and how to make responsible choices. I applaud them for their service, programming and activities. Like it or not, collegians come first. We were founded for the benefit of undergraduate students, and that will continue to be our focus until NPC changes their creed from "We as undergraduate members..." And we're not there yet.

I totally agree with and applaud this post!!!

[LPIDelta]

Originally Posted by adpiucf

NPC and its member organizations werefounded for the benefit of undergraduate membership. Alumnae membership is a completely separate bag and more of a way to keep members connected through friendship, community service and keeping the collegiate arm running through long-term strategic planning and programming.

Further, many groups realize that it is a saavy business move to get their alumnae involved and connected, because that is where the money is in terms of funding programming for collegiate members.

That said, there is a move in several NPC groups, just from my observation and information I have read, to focus more on alumnae membership because you will spend most of your "lifetime of sisterhood" as an alumna member. I went to a Panhellenic luncheon for a group that has more than 350 alumnae chapters versus 125 collegiate chapters--there is obviously a great focus on services for alumnae in an organization like that, and it requires an immense amount of support and infrastructure to keep it going.

So I don't wonder if, as others have suggested, that AI is becoming less rare and potentially more of a business opportunity. I know that ruffles feathers--and it ruffles mine as well because I think there have to be good, solid reasons for why you would choose a sorority over another kind of social organization--but I think is naive to think that some groups may not have considered AI as a way to improve their bottom line.

[adpiucf]

Originally Posted by Heather17

So I don't wonder if, as others have suggested, that AI is becoming less rare and potentially more of a business opportunity.

Of course--I personally see huge business potential and revenues (and leadership/involvement!) in making huge changes in alumnae membership, including recruitment of members post-college. There are greater gains and opportunities to be made. However, the focus would need to drastically shift from collegiate and undergraduate programming to lifetime membership-- making us similiar to organizations like the Junior League. (Some leagues allow you to join at age 18. Others at age 21-- you have a few years of required active membership before moving into voluntary "sustainer" level where you have limited membership obligations-- but these are still obligations nontheless! You don't just coast on your lifetime membership.)

However, it seems that a good deal of research has gone into identifying membership trends, and we've observed that most collegiate members are likely to drop after their first year. I think right now there is much focus on improving collegiate programming to address why women aren't actively involved for all 4 years of college as they used to be (I think that has a lot to do with changes in the ways students learn, women's lib, what is considered a "traditional" student and general social change). Until the programming goes away from a primarily collegiate focus and more big-picture lifetime membership outside of "lifetime member in name only," I don't think this will be an across-the-board shift. Change is slow-- it takes a long time to implement policy changes that have such wide-scale impact (even if it is for the better), changing the members' perceptions of membership, changing the way we do recruitment, etc. The possibilities are endless.

[BadSquirrelBeta]

EDITED TO ADD FROM A PREVIOUS POST: Sorority as a resume builder? You must be joking. I am loathe to put my lengthy alumnae involvement on a resume: I'm not interested in being a martyr for the "Why don't you stand up and show people your involvement?" cause. Post-college, professionals and academics view Greek life differently. The "alumnae network" is something that you seek out by making calls, emails and sending letters-- not an established party line that finds you a job with an alumna. This doesn't make me less proud of my membership-- but there is a time and a place. I wouldn't list my faith-based activities on a resume, either. Discrimination exists, and I'd rather not be passed over for a job or a program because of someone else's personal biases or in trying to make a statement for all of Greekdom.

********

OMG...the part about the resume builder, I agree completely. I will go one step further and say that we were actually told by the job fair advisor (an English professor in my case) to state "National Womens Association, Treasurer, Preparing and maintaining a budget for 65 members...", etc.

It's like the Old Saturday Night Live skit...once you are out of college, no one really cares if you are a AAA or a BBB...

[Scandia]

Nope, I did not hear from them again. But I have no idea whether they had my contact information or not.

[ZTAngel]

Originally Posted by BadSquirrelBeta

EDITED TO ADD FROM A PREVIOUS POST: Sorority as a resume builder? You must be joking. I am loathe to put my lengthy alumnae involvement on a resume: I'm not interested in being a martyr for the "Why don't you stand up and show people your involvement?" cause. Post-college, professionals and academics view Greek life differently. The "alumnae network" is something that you seek out by making calls, emails and sending letters-- not an established party line that finds you a job with an alumna. This doesn't make me less proud of my membership-- but there is a time and a place. I wouldn't list my faith-based activities on a resume, either. Discrimination exists, and I'd rather not be passed over for a job or a program because of someone else's personal biases or in trying to make a statement for all of Greekdom.

Same here. ZTA and any of my involvement is no where to be found on my resume. Most people see greek life as a college thing only. The last thing I need is for my sorority to conjure up any stereotypes when I go in for my interview.