can someone explain cuts to me

[carnation]

What dgdramadawg said!

I have seen the new release figures cause a few unexpected results. First, it seems that far fewer legacies are getting bids...almost all the legacies I've known who went to UGa or Auburn were released right after second parties. Also--and I know we talked about this on some other thread--students have to be outstanding to get accepted to UGa. I mean, sky-high SATs and grades, top activities, the whole bit. So here all these outstanding girls are pitted against each other and sorry folks, that's what it is, and after second parties, massive cuts are made. Really super girls are blasted away because they get their results and over half the sororities have cut them. They don't care what they have left, their egos are shattered, and they drop out-especially if all their buddies did well.

My daughter and a friend were in front of one of the freshman dorms last year and all these buses drove up. Crying girls began to get off the buses and the friend asked one why they were crying. She told him that all these girls had dropped out of rush, having gotten their invitations after second parties.

I see the point of release figures--back in the day it was common to keep lots of girls as late as possible because it looked good--but I fear that we're alienating several potential, outstanding Greeks and I have let folks in NPC know this.

[honeychile]

When I hear of SO many top women who were cut so quickly in Recruitment, I can't help but wonder if that campus has enough sororities on campus. I was always in awe of the SEC campuses with 300-400 women in their chapters - until I saw that there was ten chapters or less on campus.

I know that release figures (and yes, I intend to go to the site mentioned later tonight) are supposed to help out the smaller, "weaker" chapters, and sometimes, that does happen. Other times, it creates a large community of anti-greeks. Somewhere, the twain has to meet.

[33girl]

I think carnation's last paragraph and hc's whole post are both absolutely correct. Especially for those girls who do give every sorority a closer look and keep an open mind.

However...as I've said before, a LOT of the time, it is girls saying "I'll pledge ABC or I won't pledge at all...I wouldn't lower myself to pledge XYZ." I have no pity for those people at all. Those people (and to a lesser degree, housing issues) are the reason we do have 400 person chapters - because they refuse to give a new chapter a chance.

Cutting quickly may create anti-greeks, but so does being strung along until pref and not getting a bid. The former at least makes things easier on the sororities.

[TxGirl]

Before they rolled out the Release Figure Method on a nationwide (and I say that loosely as it is still voluntary at this point) they asked all the NPC groups to reevaluate their MS process. The powers that be at each group were to look at how their process worked, what their policies were regarding legacies etc. All of this with the knowledge that on some campuses their chapters would have to release 50-60% of the women that signed up for recruitment - legacy or no.

As to courtesy invites, I know that many chapters at UofTx did this, but they never had any intention of taking an entire new member class of legacies. I think this is probably true for most schools/chapters. Of course the PNM's don't know this.

I think that while it is unfortunate that the women's carnation's daughter saw dropped out of recruitment because the didn't like their invites, it's also indicative of more than that. It seems that it is possible that many of these women had preconceived notions about the chapters on campus, their chances with each chapter or could possibly been promised bids. All of these things have to figure in somewhere - not to mention the domino effect that could also happen. But I also feel like 33girl, if they came with the mindset that they are only going XYZ then which is better to drag through the whole process only to be release or to be released after the first day? If only one chapter on the entire campus will do for you then I think it's better to know after day one then to fall in love with the group more and more each day only to be release before pref. I think the sting of the first is a lot less than the second.

So which makes the more "anti-greek"? The woman who knew after a day that XYZ didn't feel she was a fit for their group or the women that went to XYZ for 3 days, was made to feel welcome, befriended and on her way to being a sister? No one wants to be a seat filler (unless its for the Oscars or something) and that's basically what a lot of the women that are carried to far are.

It was mentioned that it also helps smaller chapters. While this may be true, it isn't always. No method is going to save chapters that are too far gone. I do feel that it's main purpose is more to help the PNM's than the chapters.

While everyone may not love it, it is far better than the old release figure methods. I think one of the big reasons chapters/advisors/alums are scared of it is because it's not a formula thats written in the Green Book for all to see. Of course the reason it's not published is because NPC doesn't want someone to make a program and charge us to use the method we came up with in the first place.

Also, as mentioned earlier, its a working "document" (for lack of a better term). It can adjust to what is going on for that round, with this group of PNM's and this group of chapters. As we all know, many things can change in 3 years with a chapter and campus. The old method was hard and fast and just because you had done great the prior three it didn't help you if you feel on your face during the current year.

Sorry, I'll step off the soap box. I just really feel that the new Release Figure Method is a step in the right direction to help PNM's and chapters make the best of the mutual selection process.

[carnation]

Originally Posted by TxGirl

I think that while it is unfortunate that the women's carnation's daughter saw dropped out of recruitment because the didn't like their invites, it's also indicative of more than that. It seems that it is possible that many of these women had preconceived notions about the chapters on campus, their chances with each chapter or could possibly been promised bids.

Hard to say for sure, but my daughter (a new ChiO alum) and others I've talked to at UGa feel like it's not so much that the girls they knew were cut by specific groups. At UGa, where the freshmen are the type who have succeeded in almost everything they've done in high school, the devastation seems to come when many girls are cut by the majority of sororities early in rush. I have never seen a rush booklet that warns the girls that this can happen and maybe they all should.

[dgdramadawg]

Originally Posted by carnation

Hard to say for sure, but my daughter (a new ChiO alum) and others I've talked to at UGa feel like it's not so much that the girls they knew were cut by specific groups. At UGa, where the freshman are the type who have succeeded in almost everything they've done in high school, the devastation seems to come when many girls are cut by the majority of sororities early in rush. I have never seen a rush booklet that warns the girls that this can happen and maybe they all should.

I totally agree. What do I say to a gorgeous valedictorian with a million charity hours and tons of extracurriculars who was cut by 6 houses in round 1? It's just hard to explain to the girls that ABC and XYZ have to cut tons of girls just to keep the playing field level for everyone else. And a girl like this would most certainly roll her eyes at me if I mentioned the possibility of a less-than-full round 2 party list, so I don't think that mentioning the possibility of high cuts would do any good. High achieving young women have difficulty understanding that UGA rush is like swimming in a sea of high achieving young women.

However, on the flip side at UGA, the release figure method has been very helpful to a few chapters on campus that used to be much smaller than the other groups and now these groups have at least 100 members each. I think this definitely shows that the method CAN help the smaller groups on campus grow, whether or not it helps the women growing through achieve a high number of invites.

[33girl]

I've seen girls who were the queens of everything in high school get cut hard at Clarion and I'm sure it's happened at other small schools too. No one is 100% successful 100% of their life. If you get to learn that lesson the first week of college, you might get saved a lot of pain later. And no matter where you end up, college is not like high school.

They should probably do as they did in "Class Reunion" when the women were starting at Radcliffe and told them sitting on each side of them was the valedictorian of their class.