Palestine - Israel Discussion

[Rudey]

Originally posted by Reds6
Rudey please take your own advice and post facts, you haven't posted one yet

I didn't post opinion...you did. You started it so show me the facts.

Fact: Israel does not target civilians.

Fact: Israel investigates incidents where innocent civilians are killed regardless of the side.

Fact: Israel lives under a different stress that no country in the world could begin to understand.

Opinion with fact: Israel is judged by different standards than most countries in the world.

Fact: Palestinian terror group target civilians inside and outside of the green line.

Fact: Israel has been attacked repeatedly from the day it was born.

Fact: Nobody complained about Egypt owning Gaza or Trans-Jordan owning the West Bank.

Fact: Jews were slaughtered under Jordanian rule in the West Bank.

Fact: Israel gave and gave up land and still has no peace.

Fact: Clinton said that Arafat was not looking for peace.

Fact: The rulers of Jordan and Egypt have expressed their opinions that Arafat is not looking to make peace, is an ineffective corrupt leader, and should step down.

Fact: You don't know much about Israel.

Fact: Israel, at the risk of breaking up its government, is making efforts to unilaterally withdraw from Gaza and is uprooting Israeli families.

Fact: The UN, Arab countries, the US, the Europeans have all congratulated Israel on being the one to take the initiative.

Fact: I will consume you in this discussion.

-Rudey

[PhiPsiRuss]

Originally posted by Reds6
No they just wipe out entire communities with one big bomb.

Israel targets legitimate targets, and sometimes there is collateral damage (civilians.) Palestinian terrorists rarely target legitimate military targets, and go deliberately target innocent civilians. There is a huge difference between the two.

[Kevin]

Originally posted by PhiPsiRuss
Israel targets legitimate targets, and sometimes there is collateral damage (civilians.) Palestinian terrorists rarely target legitimate military targets, and go deliberately target innocent civilians. There is a huge difference between the two.

It's hard to understand that when people are anti-semitic. I love how people dismiss everything that occurs (in reality) and talk about these fantasies of these blood-crazed Jewish imperialists.

Anyone remember the peace talks in which Israel offered Palestine basically the entire Gaza strip and West Bank? In other words, everything they had been asking for? Then Yassir turned it down??? Remember when there was a declared peace between Israel and Palestine? Who broke it? Does anyone remember??? Who glorifies their "martyrs" for blowing up women and children?

It's not exactly a situation where both sides contribute equally to the violence. At this point, I think Israel has tried everything possible and met with a Palestine that wants nothing less than the eradication of the state of Israel and will settle for nothing else. Israel, it seems has decided that the only way to defend its people is to kill the terrorists before they kill Israel's citizens.

[Reds6]

Originally posted by ktsnake
It's hard to understand that when people are anti-semitic. I love how people dismiss everything that occurs (in reality) and talk about these fantasies of these blood-crazed Jewish imperialists.

Anyone remember the peace talks in which Israel offered Palestine basically the entire Gaza strip and West Bank? In other words, everything they had been asking for? Then Yassir turned it down??? Remember when there was a declared peace between Israel and Palestine? Who broke it? Does anyone remember??? Who glorifies their "martyrs" for blowing up women and children?

It's not exactly a situation where both sides contribute equally to the violence. At this point, I think Israel has tried everything possible and met with a Palestine that wants nothing less than the eradication of the state of Israel and will settle for nothing else. Israel, it seems has decided that the only way to defend its people is to kill the terrorists before they kill Israel's citizens.

Having a different viewpoint on a topic doesn't make you anti-semitic. But I'll have the Christian half of me tellthe Jewish half of me what ya said.

[Rudey]

Originally posted by Reds6
Having a different viewpoint on a topic doesn't make you anti-semitic. But I'll have the Christian half of me tellthe Jewish half of me what ya said.

There is no Jewish half to be Jewish. You are or you aren't. You can be half black though if you choose. I didn't see him say you are anti-semitic or even say that having a different viewpoint makes you anti-semitic so relax, breathe, and stop thinking so defensively.

-Rudey

[Reds6]

Originally posted by Rudey
There is no Jewish half to be Jewish. You are or you aren't. You can be half black though if you choose. I didn't see him say you are anti-semitic or even say that having a different viewpoint makes you anti-semitic so relax, breathe, and stop thinking so defensively.

-Rudey

I know Einstein, You are what your mother is, but I can't ignore nor will I ignore the fact my Father and many family members are Jews living in Israel which is still apart of me and my heritage.

[Reds6]

Death Toll in 3 Years of Mideast Violence


3,481 deaths in more than three years of Israeli-Palestinian violence.

2,583 on the Palestinian side
898 on the Israeli side
289 Palestinas killed prepring or carryingout attacks
117 Palestinan militants targeted and killed by Israelis
88 Bystanders killed in targted attacks on militants
108 Palestinian sucide bombers
436 victims of suicide bombers
A Palestinian from the West Bank town of Tulkarem killed 29 Israelis on March 27, 2002, during a Passover hotel dinner.
An Israeli F-16 warplane bombing on July 23, 2002, hit a Gaza City apartment building and killed a Hamas military leader, Salah Shehadeh, his bodyguard and 13 bystanders, including his wife, daughter, and eight other children.
244 Israeli soliders killed.
146 jewish setlers killed in the west bank and gaza

Figures go on and on.
I'm not saying either side is right, but both continue to contibute to the violence.

[Tom Earp]

Then I guess, the basic question is:

If The Jews try to work out an agreement with the Palistenians for a Home land, then why does it not work?

The killing still goes on by a want to be country who talk little kids into strapping bombs on and destroying themselves and many others.

To me, and is just my opinion, that the Isrelies are trying to root out the blackards who do this. What Relegion do the Palistenians Preach? If is doing this, then why do they desearve any Home Country especially when it has been offered to them and have a DipS**t like Arrafat who cannot control his own bowel movement? Oh, he is a littl S**T and has the spine of a snake.

Allah is good, pray to Allah, He preaches kindness to all people!

Then what are the Musilums doing what they are doing?

I truely dont know, but if you can explain to all of us, you will be the better person.

I just dont think you can do it!

Rudey has stated his point, and I beleive him first.

Yes, I get the news and try to injest it.

You have made no points until you can refute what has been asked!

Oh, Earpstein is not Jewish!

[KSig RC]

Originally posted by Reds6
I know Einstein, You are what your mother is, but I can't ignore nor will I ignore the fact my Father and many family members are Jews living in Israel which is still apart of me and my heritage.

OK - but you're mixing the metaphors.


"Jew" = "someone who practices Judaism"

"Israeli" = "someone who is native to Israel"

By definition, you cannot be half-Jewish and half-Christian. It's a religion - to 'half-practice' one or both would effectively make you neither. You can be of partial ethnic descent - so you can feel free to use those claims in your argument if you really feel that anecdotal evidence matters at all (I don't).

Also, can we use "Israeli" instead of "Jew" when discussing the political side of these things? I don't know why, but that just seems much more correct (and fair?).

[PhiPsiRuss]

Originally posted by ktsnake
It's not exactly a situation where both sides contribute equally to the violence. At this point, I think Israel has tried everything possible and met with a Palestine that wants nothing less than the eradication of the state of Israel and will settle for nothing else. Israel, it seems has decided that the only way to defend its people is to kill the terrorists before they kill Israel's citizens.

I agree. This is a conflict between Israel and some Palestinian organizations.

Israel has declared that they will stop attacking when Hezbolah, Islamic Jihad, etc. stops.

These groups have declared that they will stop attacking Israel as soon as it no longer exists.

For those who disagree with Israel's actions, what would you do if you had the power to affect Israeli policy?

[Rudey]

Originally posted by Reds6
I know Einstein, You are what your mother is, but I can't ignore nor will I ignore the fact my Father and many family members are Jews living in Israel which is still apart of me and my heritage.

In other words, you are not a Jew Sherlock.

-Rudey
--Ignore it, love it, do whatever you want with it...I don't care.

[Rudey]

So 88 people bystanders died in targeted attacks on terrorists. Why were they there? Why don't they renounce violence? Why is it that they're fine with those terrorists existing and living right next to them?? Why should I give a damn about a wife and kids of a murderer?? Why don't they leave? Did they ever say anything against him? Why should I care? Why did Israel attack those terrorists? Why did it attack people who were going to kill more innocent civilians???

You have nothing. Israel won. Israel will bring about the peace itself. Arabs lost the war a long time ago. They lost it when they decided they loved violence instead of negotiations.

Again you've done nothing but a copy and paste. Your figures show nothing and I don't understand why you posted it. Again, if Israelis are allowed to use their weapons and this is all an equal game, then fine...let Israel play.

You have nothing.

-Rudey

Originally posted by Reds6
Death Toll in 3 Years of Mideast Violence


3,481 deaths in more than three years of Israeli-Palestinian violence.

2,583 on the Palestinian side
898 on the Israeli side
289 Palestinas killed prepring or carryingout attacks
117 Palestinan militants targeted and killed by Israelis
88 Bystanders killed in targted attacks on militants
108 Palestinian sucide bombers
436 victims of suicide bombers
A Palestinian from the West Bank town of Tulkarem killed 29 Israelis on March 27, 2002, during a Passover hotel dinner.
An Israeli F-16 warplane bombing on July 23, 2002, hit a Gaza City apartment building and killed a Hamas military leader, Salah Shehadeh, his bodyguard and 13 bystanders, including his wife, daughter, and eight other children.
244 Israeli soliders killed.
146 jewish setlers killed in the west bank and gaza

Figures go on and on.
I'm not saying either side is right, but both continue to contibute to the violence.

[Kevin]

If Israel wanted to intentionally target civilians, they could probably wipe out the entire Palestinian population in a day or two.

If the tables were turned, I don't doubt that the Palestinians would do exactly that.

[mrblonde]

Originally posted by Reds6
289 Palestinas killed prepring or carryingout attacks

What a shame

[Rudey]

Originally posted by mrblonde
What a shame

You didn't cry?

-Rudey