Justifiable?

[AKA2D '91]

A local news channel did a poll on this case. 80% of those polled said that they would have done the same thing (shoot to protect). 20% said they would not have shot (at) the suspected thieves.

Here in Louisiana, it is not justified. You, yourself have to be in immediate danger. The shooter (or victim, depending on how you look at it) is out on bond. He has a CLEAN record. I do not think the guy who was killed had a clean record. The deceased mother hopes that the shooter gets prosecuted to the fullest.

I'm torn. I do expect the mother to grieve for her child, BUT and it's a BIG BUT, his butt (her child) is a CRIMINAL. :rmad: How is that justified or excused?

[Bamboozled]

Originally posted by ENDROAD
I stand steadfast in the belief that the person who was being robbed is the victim and not the other way around. There are many innocent bystanders who are hurt or killed everyday but in this situation this person was not innocent. They were engaged in an illegal act against this individual who has the right to protect himself and his property. One of the Lord's commandments states that "Thou should not convent though neighbors property."

Yeah, well God also says, "Thou shalt not murder" and that is exactly what this man did . God never amended that commandment to say, "....but if some fool ignores this whole coveting thing, the murder commandment is null and void, so do your thang."

[QUOTE]Originally posted by straightBOS
Personally, I say, he had every right to do it. And, if it were me, I would have shot to kill as well. Luckily for them, no one wants my old Buick Regal. That's cool, no hard feelings.

Are we now living in some third world country in 62 B.C. and y'all forgot to tell me? So, you'd KILL somebody over your freaking CAR? How can you say he had every right to do it? Since when do we have the right to shoot and kill anyone, especially some unarmed person who is not threatening your life? Well, you go ahead and do your thing. They might let you log on to GC from Attica.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by RedefinedDiva
I don't feel that the shooter should be prosecuted for the shooting. Plain and simple. Of course, it is absolutely sad that the young man is dead, however, he had no business breaking into that man's car. People work hard for their possessions and here comes Joe, John, and James Blow to steal it. GET YOUR OWN S**T!! Innocent people are killed daily because some clown doesn't want to get off of his a$$ and work to get his own possessions. Instead, they shoot and kill hard-working citizens everyday. Everyone is saying that he should have let the young man just take the car, CDs, etc., and just call the police. HELLO?!! What about the innocent people in the world who submit and turn over their items and STILL get killed?

He should have been at home doing the right thing. If someone wants to be bold enough to REPEATEDLY come to my home and break into my car and steal MY stuff, then he should know that there are consequences.

Yeah, well go head on, Pistol Pete. There's also a consequence for murder...... it's called PRISON.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by AKA2D '91
I'm torn. I do expect the mother to grieve for her child, BUT and it's a BIG BUT, his butt (her child) is a CRIMINAL. :rmad: How is that justified or excused?

I don't think crime should be justified or excused. The criminal should be dealt with ACCORDINGLY. While I do believe that everyone should be held accountable for the crimes they commit, I don't believe the price should be one's life (unless, they are putting another life in jeopardy and killing them is the ONLY answer). I mean, it was just a CAR he was attempting to steal. I think it's a sad commentary on society when we start valuing material things more than human life.

Would a store owner be justified in shooting and killing an unarmed teenager for stealing a candy bar? Especially once the child is out of the store? To me, it's the same thing. I mean, the child came into HIS store, stole HIS candy bar and the child is now a criminal. Man, we'd want the store owner put UNDER the jail. How can we say this man was justified and in the same breath say the police are wrong for all the MURDERS they've commited against unarmed black men? The concept of "God complex" is very fitting in this case.

[oneinamillion]

Originally posted by straightBOS
Depends on the state. In Texas you can kill the repo man, no questions asked.

Personally, I say, he had every right to do it. And, if it were me, I would have shot to kill as well. Luckily for them, no one wants my old Buick Regal. That's cool, no hard feelings.

are you serious....you can kill the repo fellow and get no time or nothing? Dayum you learn something new everyday on this site!!!!!!!

[RedefinedDiva]

The problem is that people are looking at it like the VICTIM chose to kill the criminal. I am not saying that my baby (my car) is worth someone's life, ESPECIALLY my own. However, there is such a thing as quick reactions (without thinking) and being SICK and TIRED!! I don't know what goes on in other parts of the country, but in the New Orleans area where this incident happened, criminals have NO respect for personal property and life. I can promise everyone in this forum that if it had been me, I would have most definitely shot at him also.

The man was shooting his gun to get these criminals away from his car. I hear people saying, "he should have yelled out or called the police." YEAH RIGHT! Please believe that I have witnessed folks walk up to a person, with police less than 50 ft. away, and shot them! Do you think that some innocent victim yelling out is really going to stop the crime? Had the victim lined up, aimed for the head, and fired, then I MIGHT reconsider. However, I am in the least bit concerned about criminal's rights. What about my right to not have to sleep with a gun under my pillow because some fool might be breaking in my house or car?

[thesweetestone]

No this man is not justified! Human life is more important than cars. WTF! Call 911 and let the police and your insurance company handle it. Everybody is still innocent until proven guilty. Those guys may have had a good reason for stealing that car. lol. Anyway, taking the law into your own hands is not right. That's why we have a justice system.

[straightBOS]

Originally posted by oneinamillion


are you serious....you can kill the repo fellow and get no time or nothing? Dayum you learn something new everyday on this site!!!!!!!

Yes, there are, in some states with old laws that allow you to kill a man who is attempting to steal your horse. Well, as we have invented this modern do-hickey with a combustion engine, the same rights to defend your mode of transportation have been transferred to the auto. Now, the Texas repo man has to wear this bright orange vest with the words "REPO MAN" across the front and back. Without it, he is DOA.

Originally posted by Bamboozled

Are we now living in some third world country in 62 B.C. and y'all forgot to tell me? So, you'd KILL somebody over your freaking CAR? How can you say he had every right to do it? Since when do we have the right to shoot and kill anyone, especially some unarmed person who is not threatening your life? Well, you go ahead and do your thing. They might let you log on to GC from Attica.

If they have a cable modem upstate, I'll be strizzy. Naw, but really, criminals are too dayum bold.

I feel that if a man is bold enough to try to take away the Buick--- right in front my own home, then he obviously believes that he has some guardian angel or Bionic powers that make him immune to the potential consequences of his actions. But, on Planet StraightBOS (my street); if you want it that bad, you'd better be willing to die for it.

[FeeFee]

Originally posted by FeeFee

Did the perpetrator (suspect) in question threaten imminent danger of death or grievous bodily injury to his/her victim(s)??

If people feel that the shooting was justified and/or felt that you would have done the same thing, then be prepared to accurately answer the above question, because you will be asked.

[ENDROAD]

Originally posted by ClassyLady


Couldn't this man just have yelled "hey you, get away from my car" from his window? Most people who break into parked cars aren't trying to hurt anyone physically. They just want to get away with some money. If they think that they'll be caught, they run, not fight.

Are you kidding me? Respectfully, what part of Oz do you live in? In my city "Hey you, get away from my car" is received by "Shut Up B*%$ch" or worse a gun in your face. He did not warn them for fear that they would get him before he got them. How many car jackings have ended him grave injury or death? You cannot take to chance that a criminal just wants your property but they still may hurt you or take your life.

Furthermore, many peoples livelihood depends on their automobile. "I can't get to work," "I don't have insurance, " "Hell, that is my car." I am happy for the people who can say oh, just take it I will get a new one. You are truly blessed. However, I am not going.

[Afrochic]

I'm not killing for a car whether the car is parked or I'm carjacked. Take it...I don't care if it's my primary means of transportation. Where I live, if you don't have a car, you can't survive period. But if/when your car is stolen, damaged, etc., sometimes you have to do what you have to do even if you can't afford it. Why couldn't this guy shoot a warning shot in the air from behind his house or hidden where the thieves couldn't see him? Maybe they would run because shots are fired but they don't know where they are coming from. I would kill to save my life, but to save property, it's not worth it. But hey, differences in opinion and actions makes the world go round. And actions can sometimes lead to prison time.

I can't murder for a vehicle because I don't think I:

1. would like the issued prison uniforms and flip flops.
2. would do well in a cell like environment, living in a college dorm was enough for me.
3. would like to be Big Bertha from Biloxi's girlfriend.
4. am rough enough for a prison environment.

Hopefully my life is worth more than a motor, car battery, tires, etc. I hope your blessings aren't determined by your car value but your life value.

[RedefinedDiva]

Originally posted by Afrochic
Why couldn't this guy shoot a warning shot in the air from behind his house or hidden where the thieves couldn't see him? Maybe they would run because shots are fired but they don't know where they are coming from.

This happened in NEW ORLEANS!! There is NO such thing as firing a shot in the air and scaring somebody.

Anyway, my answer remains the same. I strike this as one point for victims. Criminals are getting to bold. Maybe his friend that got away (and other useless criminals out in the world) will think twice next time they consider commiting a crime.

[ClassyLady]

Originally posted by ENDROAD


Are you kidding me? Respectfully, what part of Oz do you live in? In my city "Hey you, get away from my car" is received by "Shut Up B*%$ch" or worse a gun in your face. He did not warn them for fear that they would get him before he got them. How many car jackings have ended him grave injury or death? You cannot take to chance that a criminal just wants your property but they still may hurt you or take your life.

I grew up in West Philadelphia, which is far from being never, never land. But, this was not a carjacking, it was an attempted theft. The word carjacking implies that someone is trying to steal your car while you are still in it. That is a much more violent crime and warrants a harsher reaction. This man was not being carjacked; someone was breaking into his parked car. I'm not saying that he should risk his life, I'm saying that he had safer and more sensible alternatives to opening fire.

I also do not think that this man was fearing for his life. I think he was sick and tired, as Refined Diva stated, of crime in his community. Being tired of crime is not a justification of vigilanteism. If we are going to start saying that murder justifies a crime against property, then why don't we just send all of the policeman, judges, and lawyers home because we won't have any need for them.

Originally posted by ENDROAD

Furthermore, many peoples livelihood depends on their automobile. "I can't get to work," "I don't have insurance, " "Hell, that is my car." I am happy for the people who can say oh, just take it I will get a new one. You are truly blessed. However, I am not going.

It seems to me that people nowadays are just too comfortable and not willing to struggle or perservere in the face of adversity. Cars are a luxury, not a necessity. There are plenty of people out there struggling who are not going to miss work just because they don't have a car. Take the bus. Ninety percent of the people in this world can't afford all of the luxuries that we confuse with necessities. If your livelihood is your car, then you really need to get a life. A car is still not worth killing over.

[Afrochic]

Originally posted by RedefinedDiva


This happened in NEW ORLEANS!! There is NO such thing as firing a shot in the air and scaring somebody.

Anyway, my answer remains the same. I strike this as one point for victims. Criminals are getting to bold. Maybe his friend that got away (and other useless criminals out in the world) will think twice next time they consider commiting a crime.

That was just an idea I was throwing out There is a such thing as what I mentioned, policemen do it all the time whether it be New Orleans, New Jersey or New Mexico. And maybe when more people who shoot for a doggone car get the jail time, they will think twice when they consider committing a crime to cover another person commiting a crime. Does that make you any better than the criminal you're speaking about? Once you shoot, you are a criminal yourself. He's a car thief and you're a murderer...so what now? So when you pray from jail what do you say....."well Lord he was stealing my car, I had to do it. You know how important that ride is."

Wow if you all kill for cars, I guess you would whoop a mean a$$ if someone stole your bike.

[RedefinedDiva]

Originally posted by Afrochic


Wow if you all kill for cars, I guess you would whoop a mean a$$ if someone stole your bike.

I sure would!! Why? Because it is MY bike!! I am not saying that murdering the man was the right answer, however, it was what happened. The murder was not absolutely intentional.

I am not saying that we should not rely on the police to solve crimes, however, sometimes nothing gets done and people don't start paying attention until something like this happens. We can not compare cities in incidents like this. Not all police forces are created equal. Do you really think that the police is going to devote hours to looking for a stolen car when some BOLD a$$ criminals decide that they are going to have a shootout on the corner while the police are in the middle of the block? It happened! Do you know what they did? The shot around the police. They were so intent on killing one another that it didn't even matter that the police were standing there.In cities like N.O. where the muder rate is one of the nation's highest per capita, car thefts are not high on priority lists.

I am not saying that materials and possessions are more important than life, but the fact remains that it's MY property!! Why should I have sympathy for criminals? Just like I work my butt off everyday, they should do the same.

I see that people keep saying that the Bible says, "Thou shalt not kill." However, it also says, "Thou shalt not STEAL."

[Afrochic]

I sure would!! Why? Because it is MY bike!! I am not saying that murdering the man was the right answer, however, it was what happened. The murder was not absolutely intentional.

I don't think I'm getting the gist here or maybe I misunderstood the exact incident. Did the man aim and shoot or did the gun accidently go off? Are you using the Chris Rock's phrase regarding O.J. " I ain't saying to kill....but I understand." Either way though, he went and got a gun.....intent. Not absolutely intentional is like not really pregnant....either it is or it isn't.

I am not saying that we should not rely on the police to solve crimes, however, sometimes nothing gets done and people don't start paying attention until something like this happens.

This has been happening forever. It's not a solution or deterrence to crime. It just may result in more criminal versus victim shootouts.

We can not compare cities in incidents like this. Not all police forces are created equal.

You stated shooting in the air doesn't scare people. I wasn't trying to make a comparison with cities. I was making an observation about tactics I've witnessed police use to intimidate people. The New Mexico New Jersey reference were places beginning with "New" to overstate the point, not an effort to compare similarities in car theft incidents.

I am not saying that materials and possessions are more important than life, but the fact remains that it's MY property!!

Yes you really are. When you put yourself out there like that you risk your life by doing so. Just because you come out of your house blazing, doesn't mean you will win.

Why should I have sympathy for criminals? Just like I work my butt off everyday, they should do the same.

I work my butt off also. I don't have sympathy for criminals, but killing is not the ultimate answer for the crime problem. Do you think this is really going to give criminals a "wake up call?" I highly doubt it. They are and have been sleeping through life, that's why they are trying to steal yours. Instead of a wakeup call this may in turn backfire and make more criminals make sure they are packing just in case.

I see that people keep saying that the Bible says, "Thou shalt not kill." However, it also says, "Thou shalt not STEAL."

So does justifying one sin with another makes it right or does it just make you feel better about shooting for a car or whooping a mean a$$ for a bike? Please don't think I'm attacking you or your opinions because it's not my intent. Even though I may disagree, I respect your opinions.

[RedefinedDiva]

Originally posted by Afrochic
Please don't think I'm attacking you or your opinions because it's not my intent. Even though I may disagree, I respect your opinions.

It's all love. I appreciate and respect a hearty debate.

Of course you have your opinion and I have mine. I am not trying to change the way that you see things or your opinion. It's just voicing another side of the story. If it seems like I am putting materials over life, so be it. What's the difference between killing someone outside trying to steal your car as compared to someone in your home? NOTHING. Why? Because you are still killing. In either case, you still have to ask for forgiveness from the Lord. That's personal between that man and God.

Of all the people in here that say that they would not have shot at the man, who has actually been a victim of crime? If you have been , why would you have reacted differently than this man?