Man has to stand for 7 hour flight due to fatty next to him.

[ggforever]

Because the other passenger allowed himself to be victimized. Had the passenger not allowed the arm rest up, there would have been no place for the obese man to sit and he would have had to go on another flight. If everyone would keep arm rests down and not allow them to be raised so someone can "fit" into the next seat then this would stop. We are all so PC that we do not want to hurt the feelings of an obese person. Believe me, the obese passenger knows they are large. There should be a rule that if a seat belt extension is needed then an extra seat should be purchased. If you have a large couple, they could buy three seats for the two of them.

The airlines are pushing their customer relations nightmare into our laps and we are allowing it.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by ggforever

Because the other passenger allowed himself to be victimized. Had the passenger not allowed the arm rest up, there would have been no place for the obese man to sit and he would have had to go on another flight. If everyone would keep arm rests down and not allow them to be raised so someone can "fit" into the next seat then this would stop. We are all so PC that we do not want to hurt the feelings of an obese person. Believe me, the obese passenger knows they are large. There should be a rule that if a seat belt extension is needed then an extra seat should be purchased. If you have a large couple, they could buy three seats for the two of them.

The airlines are pushing their customer relations nightmare into our laps and we are allowing it.

If it's a problem, then just purchase a first class seat.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

If it's a problem, then just purchase a first class seat.

So a thin person who fits in a seat should have to pay more money to fly because the obese person next to them refuses to do so (as they make the flight uncomfortable for the thin person)?

Am I missing something here..?

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by ggforever

Sorry, but the arm rest does divide the "space" you are renting on that particular flight with the airline. If you need two seats then you should pay for the extra space. A seat belt extension should mean you pay at least 1/2 price to purchase the seat next to you. Also, if you read my post, my husband would never feel victimized.

Yes, you made it clear that your husband does not allow himself to feel victimized. If you read my post, you'll see that what I was saying is that talking about this kind of problem in terms of "rights" and "victimization" is overdoing it and doesn't help anything. If anything, it invites people to to feel victimized.

What I was responding to were these bits:

Originally Posted by ggforever

Because the other passenger allowed himself to be victimized. Had the passenger not allowed the arm rest up, there would have been no place for the obese man to sit and he would have had to go on another flight. If everyone would keep arm rests down and not allow them to be raised so someone can "fit" into the next seat then this would stop. We are all so PC that we do not want to hurt the feelings of an obese person. Believe me, the obese passenger knows they are large.

and this:

Originally Posted by ggforever

Other passengers need to start standing up for their rights. My husband has a VERY firm "arm rest down" policy. If someone says they are not comfortable with it down, he just tells them he is not comfortable with it up.

As far as I'm concerned it isn't about being PC at all -- it's about being a gentleman. I was raised to believe that I have an obligation to be considerate of others regardless of whether they are being considerate of me. And I've learned over the years that a primary benefit of this approach to life is that it makes me a generally happier person.

I agree that the arm rest is a divider and that we would all rather not have others in our "personal space." And as I said, I prefer the arm rest down. That said, I would never make an issue of it. If the person next to me said they are not comfortable with it down, I wouldn't just tell them that I prefer it down and insist on my way because it's my right. I'd try to work something out in as friendly a manner as possible (including, if necessary, asking a flight attendant if another seat was available, and telling the person next to me that I was going to move so he could be more comfortable).

My very firm policy is that I would rather be uncomfortable on a plane than behave like an a$$ on a plane.

[preciousjeni]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

As far as I'm concerned it isn't about being PC at all -- it's about being a gentleman. I was raised to believe that I have an obligation to be considerate of others regardless of whether they are being considerate of me. And I've learned over the years that a primary benefit of this approach to life is that it makes me a generally happier person.

I agree that the arm rest is a divider and that we would all rather not have others in our "personal space." And as I said, I prefer the arm rest down. That said, I would never make an issue of it. If the person next to me said they are not comfortable with it down, I wouldn't just tell them that I prefer it down and insist on my way because it's my right. I'd try to work something out in as friendly a manner as possible (including, if necessary, asking a flight attendant if another seat was available, and telling the person next to me that I was going to move so he could be more comfortable).

My very firm policy is that I would rather be uncomfortable on a plane than behave like an a$$ on a plane.

I adore you. Having been on both sides of the situation (being encroached upon as well as having a hard time fitting in the seat) at different times in my life, I'd rather do away with bucket style seats in favor of bench style seats. The armrests take up very valuable space.

ETA: With the decreasing seat space, can we please do away with reclining coach seats. It's a hazard when someone is sitting in your lap. God forbid there should actually be an emergency! A person in a window seat whose forward neighbor has his/her seat back down is as good as dead. I have yet to be on a flight where the attendants actually force people to put their seat backs up, which makes it even more challenging to actually move once the flight has landed.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by preciousjeni

I adore you. Having been on both sides of the situation (being encroached upon as well as having a hard time fitting in the seat) at different times in my life, I'd rather do away with bucket style seats in favor of bench style seats. The armrests take up very valuable space.

ETA: With the decreasing seat space, can we please do away with reclining coach seats. It's a hazard when someone is sitting in your lap. God forbid there should actually be an emergency! A person in a window seat whose forward neighbor has his/her seat back down is as good as dead. I have yet to be on a flight where the attendants actually force people to put their seat backs up, which makes it even more challenging to actually move once the flight has landed.

Amen on getting rid of the reclining coach seats. Nothing better than having someone's stinky head in your face. Also, amen on the seats and the pitch being ridiculously tiny and continuing to shrink. I'm pretty sure my 32 pound three year old would find it challenging to be comfortable in an airline seat. (OK, so maybe that's an exaggeration, but still).

[Honeykiss1974]

So what exactly does he want the airline to do now after the fact? If the airline has offered to comp him for his ticket and bad experience what is there left for US Airways to do? Most airlines have a rule that if you can not sit in your sit with the arm rest down, you must purchase two seats. Granted this is a judgement call of the ticket agent, but unless they have an actual chair at the ticket counter, it's a guess at best.

Finally, in regards to customer service, airlines have way bigger problems (pun intended) than fat people not buying two seats.

[ggforever]

Sorry, but the arm rest does divide the "space" you are renting on that particular flight with the airline. If you need two seats then you should pay for the extra space. A seat belt extension should mean you pay at least 1/2 price to purchase the seat next to you. Also, if you read my post, my husband would never feel victimized.

The gate agent knew there would be a problem with putting an obese person on a full flight. The agent passed this problem on to the flight crew to resolve, shuts the door and the nightmares begin. The agent just wants the plane off the gate on time.

Until you have experienced a long flight with another passenger spilling over into your seat, no one should be critical of this passenger. Obviously, the flight attendants sympathized with him because there is no way on God's green earth they would have allowed a passenger to be in the aisle or in their galley and working around him otherwise.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by ggforever

Sorry, but the arm rest does divide the "space" you are renting on that particular flight with the airline. If you need two seats then you should pay for the extra space. A seat belt extension should mean you pay at least 1/2 price to purchase the seat next to you. Also, if you read my post, my husband would never feel victimized.

The gate agent knew there would be a problem with putting an obese person on a full flight. The agent passed this problem on to the flight crew to resolve, shuts the door and the nightmares begin. The agent just wants the plane off the gate on time.

Until you have experienced a long flight with another passenger spilling over into your seat, no one should be critical of this passenger. Obviously, the flight attendants sympathized with him because there is no way on God's green earth they would have allowed a passenger to be in the aisle or in their galley and working around him otherwise.

The seat belt extender and the arm rests are two different things. It is entirely possible to sit in the seat with the armrests down and still need an extender. There are people that are wide and people that are thick (I see this all the time on CTs). Differences in body shape would make your rule unfair for people in who may not fit comfortably but fit safely in their seat. BTW, I don't disagree with you about this situation. The man complaining in this story should have politely refused to put his armrest up. If the other passenger couldn't fit at that point, then it is on the other passenger. The airlines won't address this issue so the larger man should have been given a voucher and put on another flight.

A lot of this story sounds like the man was mad to be sitting next to an obese passenger. One of Dr. Phil's links made it sound like he wouldn't, not that he couldn't buckle his seat belt. As a frequent flyer, I haven't figured out why he wouldn't be able to do so.

For everyone, I disagree with the denigration of the large passenger. No need to call him "fatty." The man was obese. Call it what it is. Anything else is rude and blaming him for a situation that the airline didn't control. The airlines have not made a policy that obese passengers must buy two tickets. They don't want to deal with the PR issue and would rather put out small fires. Then again, I don't blame them. How do you define before hand who will need to buy two tickets? This is not an issue that is confined to the obese. The same issues have occurred with people who are just big people, ie a 6'7" man can't squeeze into those little seats.

[SWTXBelle]

Many airlines do have policies; for obvious reasons, they do not publicize them.

QUOTE -
Here's a look at how a few different airlines deal with the "customer of size:"

• Southwest: Passengers should plan on purchasing an extra seat or risk being asked to do so at the airport by staff. If the flight is not sold out, the passenger may claim a refund.
• American: Passengers over 250 pounds should recognize that there may be limitations to the service that the airline can provide. However, it does not require that you purchase an extra seat automatically.
• United: No policy whatsoever.
• Midwest: Like Southwest, passengers are encouraged to know their needs in advance. If staff determine that two seats are required, the seat will be sold at the lowest possible fare, with a refund available if there is one or more open seats on the flight.
• Air France: Passengers with "high body mass" may receive a 25 percent discount on an extra seat, knowing that if they choose to not buy the seat, they may risk not being able to fly.
• JetBlue: You are required to buy a second seat, and there are no refunds.
• Delta: The airline "works to accommodate" passengers with special needs. Upon request and availability, it will try to make sure the next seat is unoccupied. However, if the plane is full, you will most likely be asked to leave the flight and buy a second seat on the next available flight. (You can actually count on this being a fairly typical practice on most airlines.)

( http://www.smartertravel.com/travel-...tml?id=2644439)

[33girl]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

How do you define before hand who will need to buy two tickets? This is not an issue that is confined to the obese. The same issues have occurred with people who are just big people, ie a 6'7" man can't squeeze into those little seats.

You simply say "our seats will comfortably accomodate a passenger who is under 6'2" in height and/or under 300 pounds. If you exceed either or both of these measurements, you will be required to..." Fill in the blank with one of those airline policies in the above post. I like Air France's. In other words, if a woman is pregnant and has topped that weight, then yes, she has to buy an extra seat too. It's no more discriminatory than the spaces in parking garages for compact cars only.

And if this truly did go the way the man is saying it did, and he was UNABLE to sit down, I completely agree w/ ggforever.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by 33girl

You simply say "our seats will comfortably accomodate a passenger who is under 6'2" in height and/or under 300 pounds. If you exceed either or both of these measurements, you will be required to..."

And what would you require someone who is over 6'2" (as I am) do? Buying the seat next to them wouldn't do much good. (Trust me, I know from when the seat next to me is vacant. It may be more comfortable over all, but that has nothing to do with my height, it has to be with not being a sardine.)

And why would you require something of them? The people over 6'2" are the ones who are uncomfortable, not the ones around them.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

And what would you require someone who is over 6'2" (as I am) do? Buying the seat next to them wouldn't do much good. (Trust me, I know from when the seat next to me is vacant. It may be more comfortable over all, but that has nothing to do with my height, it has to be with not being a sardine.)

And why would you require something of them? The people over 6'2" are the ones who are uncomfortable, not the ones around them.

6'2" was a random height I picked - maybe 6'4" would be better, but yes, they should have to buy an extra seat. It's just as uncomfortable to be next to someone who is rootching around constantly as it is to be that person.

Your height (or weight, or dietary issue, or pregnancy) is not my problem. Therefore I shouldn't have to deal with it. The airlines can't have it both ways - they have made air travel cheaper and open to everyone, but they did it half-assed.

[DubaiSis]

This would seem like the time to get on my high horse about how cheap airlines have gotten. The width and the pitch of seats have gotten freakishly small. That is clear to people of size who might have fit reasonably well in a seat 10 years ago, but the 6'2" guy is SOL. There's no way to buy the 2 seats HE needs, which is the one his butt is in and the one his knees are in. And frankly, before long business class isn't even going to be an alternative. They've angled them funny so they can cram in more business class seats so you can't even sit next to the person you're technically seated next to.

If everyone on a flight was of perfect weight and relatively short, people would still be frustrated over cramped quarters because flying is just a miserable experience. There's not enough oxygen, the seats are ungodly uncomfortable, the noise and vibration are irritating at best, and then you have the inevitable delays. When you add being treated like cattle and then realize you are being shoe-horned in next to someone who's a bit bigger than they'd like to be, you've got a recipe for disaster. I'm surprised fist-fights don't happen on flights every day.

I could tell you which airlines are more generous with their space, but what's the point? You have to fly who goes where you're going, so knowing Etihad has a more comfortable seat than Southwest isn't really going to be of much service. Now, contact your Congressmen about improving rail service!

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by 33girl

6'2" was a random height I picked - maybe 6'4" would be better, but yes, they should have to buy an extra seat. It's just as uncomfortable to be next to someone who is rootching around constantly as it is to be that person.

Sorry -- Don't buy it. Buying the extra seat wouldn't do any good. Now if you want to require tall people to get an aisle seat, that's fine. I always do that anyway so that if I need the extra room it's in the aisle. And yes, I pay attention so that no one in the aisle needs to ask me to move my legs or feet.

The bottom line is that airplane seats are too crammed. Period. We all know that when we buy tickets. Anybody expecting to be truly comfortable should either pay more for first class or accept the reality that they will not be as comfortable as they might like to be. But unless you're going to actually be taking up space in a second seat, you shouldn't have to pay for a second seat.

Your height (or weight, or dietary issue, or pregnancy) is not my problem. Therefore I shouldn't have to deal with it. The airlines can't have it both ways - they have made air travel cheaper and open to everyone, but they did it half-assed.

We have to deal with inconveniences caused by other people all the time. But the second part of your statement i agree with completely.

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

This would seem like the time to get on my high horse about how cheap airlines have gotten. The width and the pitch of seats have gotten freakishly small. That is clear to people of size who might have fit reasonably well in a seat 10 years ago, but the 6'2" guy is SOL. There's no way to buy the 2 seats HE needs, which is the one his butt is in and the one his knees are in. And frankly, before long business class isn't even going to be an alternative. They've angled them funny so they can cram in more business class seats so you can't even sit next to the person you're technically seated next to.

If everyone on a flight was of perfect weight and relatively short, people would still be frustrated over cramped quarters because flying is just a miserable experience. There's not enough oxygen, the seats are ungodly uncomfortable, the noise and vibration are irritating at best, and then you have the inevitable delays. When you add being treated like cattle and then realize you are being shoe-horned in next to someone who's a bit bigger than they'd like to be, you've got a recipe for disaster. I'm surprised fist-fights don't happen on flights every day.

Spot on.