The Black Elite

[SummerChild]

Well, since I'm bored to death and procrastinating in light of what I'm *really* supposed to be doing, I'll just chime in here. LOL. Ok, when I was about 26, I was asked by a Link to submit to start the process for submitting oneself to try to become a Link for her chapter. I, honestly, initially had the same gut reaction,- why would I want to hang around with a bunch of 50 year olds ... and pay all that money to do so? I'm not going to lie. But I, of course, did not say this to her b/c I highly admire this woman and she was a bit of a mentor to me (not to mention that she was the mother of the guy that I was dating at that time LOL). Now, but that was just me. To each her own. And there's nothing wrong with whatever decision to which another woman may come.

So SMC, I guess that I would say that I understand your sentiment. However, the answer is ... to each her own. Each woman is different and that's the answer to the rhetorical question that you raised (although I know that they, by definition, are not asked to receive answers)

SC

[The Original Ape]

Originally posted by Ideal08:
Sorors & SF's,

Has anyone read the book Our Kind of People? I think that's the name of it, by Lawrence Graham. I hope I have that down, but anywho... I have been reading bits and pieces of that book, and many parts of it distress me. I was wondering how you all feel on the topic of the Black Elite, or elitism at all for that manner. I feel like in striving to have more (and there is never anything wrong with that), our people many times try to emulate White Americans (slave mentality, another post for another day). This one lady in the book even said that if [affluent] White people don't associate with middle/lower class/blue collar whites, so why should she associate with those same Black counterparts? The idea of separatism based on class is simply beyond me, but I would like to get a better understanding of it, regardless of whether I agree with it.

So help me sistas! Is anyone in here from an elite social class family? Any one's mom a Link? Summers on Martha's Vineyard? Were you in Jack and Jill growing up?

I can't wait to see your responses!! This whole thing is so interesting to me!!!

Along those lines, I'd like to know who the wealthiest African-American is, and their net worth!

[PositivelyAKA]

i read the book, it was informative and gave a rather realistic portrayal of some black elite mentalities some that still exsist even today. we all know money tends to bring out the worst in some people. but their success during that time period is commendable none the less.

[Teresa2000]

This may be a stupid question, but in the begining of the book, the author lists the a few of the 'haves' and the 'have-nots'. Why is Bill Cosby listed as a 'have-not'? What about the others?
-Teresa

[AKA2D '91]

Maybe Bill is listed as a "have-not" because he ACQUIRED his wealth. He was not BORN wealthy. So he would not be in the same league as those whose wealth has been in families for 2, 3 and 4 generations...

He WAS NOT born with a SILVER SPOON in his mouth...

If I am not correct, someone, please correct me...

NO, I have not read the book...

[AKA2D '91]

Bill probably is listed as a Have-Not, because his "wealth" was ACQUIRED, you know he was not BORN with a SILVER SPOON in his mouth. I have not read the book, but I would assume that Michael Jackson and Oprah would be on that list as well.

If I am wrong, please correct me!
THANKS IN ADVANCE...

[AKA_Monet]

(Sorry this is kinda long)

I have to agree with what Poplife was saying. I have read parts of Otis Graham's book and it was somewhat interesting to me that Graham himself didn't really participate in this lifestyle because his family sheltered him and he attended some "ivy league" school that didn't have the traditional Af-Am organizations... I guess I took his perspective as somewhat jealous 'cuz he didn't get a chance to live this "black bourgeois life" like so many of his peers.

Hey, Poplife, what coast are you on? I ask 'cuz I'm on the west coast. Ironically, there a bizarre kinda "bourgeois" out here. There is the "true-to-life" Black folks that have the heritage--most live in the fabulous houses in "Baldwin Hills" on the correct side of the mountain in LA... Or "Altadena/Pasadena", California or (I forget which part) in Oakland. Those are the folks that homesteaded to the west coast, like right after emancipation and set up a livelihood so well engrained in the "Hollywood-Gold Rush" lifestyle. "A Devil in a Blue Dress" addresses some of that...

Then there is the "nouveau-riche" negroes that are "classless" when it comes to obtaining items. Meaning, they can name all the most expensive items on Rodeo Drive and they probably can afford plenty of those items, but they are purely consumers when it comes to owning real property... Some folx call them the "ghetto-fabulous"... Most of us elitist don't like them 'cuz they often sell us out to the highest bidder... (OJ Simpson, perhaps)

I live more south of LA and not Orange County... The bougie black folx where I'm from are spread out now. 30-40 years ago, they use to live in one place, but now, they live all over with beachfront property. However, because of the severe, institutionalized racism, most black folx still go to this one beach probably 'cuz it was the only beach "they" use to allow "us" to go... And "they" racially profile us to this day!!!

As far as the elitist Blacks go, at least in my city, there are some that's got and there are some that's not... One woman was recently murdered by her husband 'cuz they were tryin' to keep up with the "Jones'"...

However, most folx in Cali, kinda know their "roots" and don't forget too much about it. Or rather, the cops really don't allow you to forget your place... YES, Cali, 'specially, SoCal, is super-duper racist--it like, dayum, y'all may as well be the Kard Karrying Kind with your hoods on!!! Y'all don't think so. Tell that to Rodney King...

[Poplife]

Hey Monet,

My family lives in the DC area (but that's not where I am because of school). So I was raised on the East Coast.

[mccoyred]

Cosby is from the 'hood...North Philly, my hometown.

Originally posted by AKA2D '91:
Maybe Bill is listed as a "have-not" because he ACQUIRED his wealth. He was not BORN wealthy. So he would not be in the same league as those whose wealth has been in families for 2, 3 and 4 generations...

He WAS NOT born with a SILVER SPOON in his mouth...

If I am not correct, someone, please correct me...

NO, I have not read the book...

------------------
MCCOYRED

Dynamic
Salient
Temperate

Mu Psi '86
BaltCo Alumnae

[Discogoddess]

My impression of the book, and others like it (check out E. Franklin Frazier's much earlier, more academic critical piece, Black Bourgeoisie ), is that one's heritage (meaning, who your parents, grandparents and great-grandparents were/are), where you went to summer camp, school, what organizations you joined, etc., were more important than actual money you possessed. I view this like I view European royals, who are oftentimes broke, but are still considered elite because of their lineage. Thus, people like Bill Cosby and others who didn't come from these kind of families will never be considered true elites, by those diehards. Others in these circles may accept them, because of their ties to black greek and social orgs. and/or commitment to black causes and institutions (like black colleges).

I really don't get upset by this, because in my view, it is human nature to self-segregate on the basis of many things-race, class (caste system in India), profession (the guilds of Europe, the secret societies of Africa, Masonry at its inception, etc.), interest-on and on. Why would blacks in this country be any different, even if they don't hold seats at the real table of power? This notion that we should always be united because of our skin color is a newer one, certainly not exhibited with any consistency in our mother continent, or anywhere else in the world.

Then there are those of us whose parents put themselves through school, (or went through on the backs of some steel mill, car factory, shoe-shining, "washing white folks floors", stockyard-working mamas and daddies), sent us to great schools and provided good homes, put us in orgs. like Jack and Jill, but whose heritage doesn't qualify for elite status. To continue the European class system analogy, I guess we're the "merchant class," (for those of you who remember that unit of Western European history!). But because our foreparents were sharecroppers, washerwomen, porters and the like, we'll never be quite there, no matter how much we acquire or what orgs. we join. Oh darn!!!!!

I got the overall feeling that while the author can claim significant black elite heritage, it's not quite enough to be considered such by all those in that crowd. Even his Boule membership doesn't do the trick. And he is really upset by that.

Interesting...

[This message has been edited by Discogoddess (edited December 05, 2000).]

[PositivelyAKA]

ha ha, that's funny cause i didn't get the impression that the brother was bitter about not being completely obsorbed into the elite system, rather to me it seemed he thought it to be just simply the way he grew up and he was trying to share it with those of us on the "outside" so to speak. it didn't seem to me that he was all that interested in being associated with that lifestlye, since he basically went the opposite of his peers by attending a predominately white university and even marrying a non greek. today although some may still look at lineage, i believe the amount of wealth and individual class, college degree, organizations etc. that a person has can get you in many of these circles (if you desire). I mean if Bill and Camille Cosby and she's tight are not elite enough for ya then i don't know what is folks need to stop trippin

[TempleAlum1993]

I read this book and I felt that it was a very interesting read. I consider myself pretty well read and I picked up a few new facts .

I think that the author is "looking in" at this "Elite Society" rather than describing what its actually like to be a part of it. On a side note, I think that his book "Member of the Club" was much better.

I know folks that belong to most of the organizations mentioned in the book and they are just "regular" people to me. Unfortunately, the manner in which the book was edited seems to slant towards the "snobbiness" (perceived or real) by people.

I don't think that all of the people are "emulating white people". Its a matter of how you are raised and what you have experienced. I know folks that "have old money" and are as down to earth as you can be. AND.....I know some folks who are , well aren't monied and they are as snobby as you can get (Remember Regine from Living Single?)

I guess I'm just saying what Ms. Discogoddess already pointed out. Black folks are not a monolithic group and most groups self segregate based on heritage.

[AKA2D '91]

Did anyone see "Anyday Now" Sunday on Lifetime? Same topic was discussed.

[Talaxe]

AKA2D1:

Did anyone see "Anyday Now" Sunday on Lifetime? Same topic was discussed.

My favorite show! I hope it doesn't suffer the fate of "City of Angels" so soon!

[Cultured Pearl]

Originally posted by Ideal08:
Sorors & SF's,

Any one's mom a Link?

LOL! Soror, my mom is a Link, but so am I...and I'm only 32, which I must admit, does make me one of the younger Links.