Harvard sports captains can no longer be in Greek Life

[PhilTau]

Harvard's real target here are the exclusive final clubs. From Harvard's perspective, the fraternities and sororities are (fairly or unfairly) included in this group. From my experience, Harvard's administration can be both stubborn and arrogant. Everybody whose done business with them knows this. I also suspect that every fraternity and sorority involved with Harvard knew this going in. For example, in its magazine, my wife's fraternity cannot even mention its chapter's Harvard association. There's just a blank. Harvard's rule.

So could being swept up in something like this really be a surprise to its national office? I'm not defending Harvard, but I cannot really disagree with Harvard's president:

“Although the fraternities, sororities, and final clubs are not formally recognized by the College, they play an unmistakable and growing role in student life, in many cases enacting forms of privilege and exclusion at odds with our deepest values,” ***** wrote. “The College cannot ignore these organizations if it is to advance our shared commitment to broadening opportunity and making Harvard a campus for all of its students.”

"Privilege and exclusion" is what Harvard is trying to tramp down here. And don't expect Harvard to back off either. They didn't with gays in the military and other issues they think are important.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by PhilTau

Harvard's real target here are the exclusive final clubs. From Harvard's perspective, the fraternities and sororities are (fairly or unfairly) included in this group. From my experience, Harvard's administration can be both stubborn and arrogant. Everybody whose done business with them knows this. I also suspect that every fraternity and sorority involved with Harvard knew this going in. For example, in its magazine, my wife's fraternity cannot even mention its chapter's Harvard association. There's just a blank. Harvard's rule.

So could being swept up in something like this really be a surprise to its national office? I'm not defending Harvard, but I cannot really disagree with Harvard's president:

“Although the fraternities, sororities, and final clubs are not formally recognized by the College, they play an unmistakable and growing role in student life, in many cases enacting forms of privilege and exclusion at odds with our deepest values,” ***** wrote. “The College cannot ignore these organizations if it is to advance our shared commitment to broadening opportunity and making Harvard a campus for all of its students.”

"Privilege and exclusion" is what Harvard is trying to tramp down here. And don't expect Harvard to back off either. They didn't with gays in the military and other issues they think are important.

The only way they will change their culture is to completely change their student body to one who has no interest in final clubs or similar societies. I don't think that will happen. Plus, national groups gladly put up with the crap to have a chapter at an Ivy.

[Sciencewoman]

Originally Posted by PhilTau

Harvard's real target here are the exclusive final clubs. From Harvard's perspective, the fraternities and sororities are (fairly or unfairly) included in this group. From my experience, Harvard's administration can be both stubborn and arrogant. Everybody whose done business with them knows this. I also suspect that every fraternity and sorority involved with Harvard knew this going in. For example, in its magazine, my wife's fraternity cannot even mention its chapter's Harvard association. There's just a blank. Harvard's rule.

So could being swept up in something like this really be a surprise to its national office? I'm not defending Harvard, but I cannot really disagree with Harvard's president:

“Although the fraternities, sororities, and final clubs are not formally recognized by the College, they play an unmistakable and growing role in student life, in many cases enacting forms of privilege and exclusion at odds with our deepest values,” ***** wrote. “The College cannot ignore these organizations if it is to advance our shared commitment to broadening opportunity and making Harvard a campus for all of its students.”

"Privilege and exclusion" is what Harvard is trying to tramp down here. And don't expect Harvard to back off either. They didn't with gays in the military and other issues they think are important.

I'm not sure if your wife is a Theta, but my Theta friend told me the same thing a few years ago...I believe she said they can't list the chapter on Theta's website.

[PhilTau]

Originally Posted by Sciencewoman

I'm not sure if your wife is a Theta, but my Theta friend told me the same thing a few years ago...I believe she said they can't list the chapter on Theta's website.

Good guess.

[chi-o_cat]

Originally Posted by Sciencewoman

I'm not sure if your wife is a Theta, but my Theta friend told me the same thing a few years ago...I believe she said they can't list the chapter on Theta's website.

I just looked it up myself on Theta's website. I searched for all college chapters in Massachusetts, and it brings up this list:

Eta Chi Boston University

Eta Psi Tufts University

Gamma Eta Univ. of Massachusetts (Disestablished)

Zeta Mu MIT

Zeta Xi ~


The Zeta Xi chapter at "~" is the Harvard chapter.

Aren't there some other orgs that have to call their Harvard chapter the Cambridge, MA chapter or something like that?

[Aloha123]

That's interesting as I believe the Harvard Kappa chapter is on the kkg.org website just like all the other chapters. I never got the vibe that the connection to Harvard isn't supposed to be mentioned. But I'm certainly no expert!

[Amy Kates]

Originally Posted by chi-o_cat

I just looked it up myself on Theta's website. I searched for all college chapters in Massachusetts, and it brings up this list:

Eta Chi Boston University

Eta Psi Tufts University

Gamma Eta Univ. of Massachusetts (Disestablished)

Zeta Mu MIT

Zeta Xi ~


The Zeta Xi chapter at "~" is the Harvard chapter.

Aren't there some other orgs that have to call their Harvard chapter the Cambridge, MA chapter or something like that?

Yes, we (Theta) were asked many years ago not to use the Harvard name in any of our media. We honored that request. You will notice this for other campuses as well. The College Panhellenic comprised of our chapter, that of Kappa Kappa Gamma, Delta Gamma and Alpha Phi is called the Cambridge Panhellenic.

[honorgal]

One huge issue with this policy, that Harvard hasn't addressed at all, is the fact that many of the Finals Clubs do not publicize their membership rosters. So, enforcement that goes beyond self-selection could end up being a process that smacks of McCarthyism.

[PhilTau]

Originally Posted by honorgal

One huge issue with this policy, that Harvard hasn't addressed at all, is the fact that many of the Finals Clubs do not publicize their membership rosters. So, enforcement that goes beyond self-selection could end up being a process that smacks of McCarthyism.

They will probably just require leadership nominees to certify in writing or provide an affidavit that they do not belong to a final club, fraternity, etc. that discriminates by gender. Pretty simple.

[FSUZeta]

Originally Posted by PhilTau

They will probably just require leadership nominees to certify in writing or provide an affidavit that they do not belong to a final club, fraternity, etc. that discriminates by gender. Pretty simple.

All the while discriminating against folks who exercise their rights of association.

[honorgal]

Originally Posted by PhilTau

They will probably just require leadership nominees to certify in writing or provide an affidavit that they do not belong to a final club, fraternity, etc. that discriminates by gender. Pretty simple.

Oh I agree, very simple. But it definitely smacks of McCarthyism.


"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of the State of California, and that I will faithfully discharge the duties of my office according to the best of my ability; that I do not believe in, and I am not a member of, nor do I support any party or organization that believes in, advocates, or teaches the overthrow of the United States Government, by force or by any illegal or unconstitutional means, that I am not a member of the Communist Party or under any oath or a party to any agreement or under any commitment that is in conflict with my obligations under this oath."

University of California Board of Regents oath that was required to be signed by all professors and employees.