question

[33girl]

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

I misinterpreted your premise. I was imagining girl who goes through informal in the spring, drops, and has to wait 6 months before rushing again regardless.

If I'm understanding you correctly now, you think the rule should be RELAXED not tightened. We may have reached the nub of the battle here.

No no no no no!!! It's a seasonal thing. That's always been the rule as far as I know.

There used to be bidding done of women in November - December or so to hold women till the next pledge class, and while I think this may still be MOI permissible, schools and groups aren't nuts about it because of RM issues. (Olivia Open Bid gets caught selling coke on New Year's Eve- is she a sister or not?)

[Titchou]

OK, these are my final words on this.

The suggestion was to make the requirement one full year instead of the cuurent rule of till the next formal recruitment. There is a difference.

A "proper" new member period meaning the CHAPTER didn't do it's job and gave that class short shrift. In other words, the NM just didn't up and decide she wanted to go thru FR again.

Face it, folks. Some chapters struggle and always will. Nothing this change would accomplish would keep an appreciable number of women in the chapter. I understand trying everything to keep a chapter viable. I was assigned as special adviser to two chapters just for this reason. But sometimes you just have to let it go....as much as it hurts, it can't always be saved or made better.

[33girl]

I know you said final words, but I'm still completely befuddled about the NM period thing. If someone drops out before initiation when she's in a "non-primary rush period" pledge class, how does all the blame fall on the chapter? Women come on here saying they dropped all the time and I've never seen anyone blame it on the chapter unless hazing was involved.

We have no problem saying a woman is bound for a year after spending like 2 1/2 hours with a chapter, often meeting only a small fraction of its members, and in what (while it usually works) we all have to agree is a very unnatural situation. Meanwhile, a woman who's had anywhere from months to years to get to know a chapter and spend time with them can jettison her commitment QUICKER?

I don't get it.

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I know you said final words, but I'm still completely befuddled about the NM period thing. If someone drops out before initiation when she's in a "non-primary rush period" pledge class, how does all the blame fall on the chapter? Women come on here saying they dropped all the time and I've never seen anyone blame it on the chapter unless hazing was involved.

We have no problem saying a woman is bound for a year after spending like 2 1/2 hours with a chapter, often meeting only a small fraction of its members, and in what (while it usually works) we all have to agree is a very unnatural situation. Meanwhile, a woman who's had anywhere from months to years to get to know a chapter and spend time with them can jettison her commitment QUICKER?

I don't get it.

Sweetie, bless your little heart, just because you have trouble reading, I'll say this one more time. READ WHAT I WROTE! I said it may have been the GLO's fault she didn't have a proper new member period. Gosh a-mighty!

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I know you said final words, but I'm still completely befuddled about the NM period thing. If someone drops out before initiation when she's in a "non-primary rush period" pledge class, how does all the blame fall on the chapter? Women come on here saying they dropped all the time and I've never seen anyone blame it on the chapter unless hazing was involved.

We have no problem saying a woman is bound for a year after spending like 2 1/2 hours with a chapter, often meeting only a small fraction of its members, and in what (while it usually works) we all have to agree is a very unnatural situation. Meanwhile, a woman who's had anywhere from months to years to get to know a chapter and spend time with them can jettison her commitment QUICKER?

I don't get it.

I'm with you. I'm still confused. And I'm not understanding why we have different expectations of commitment from different PNMs, especially when those expectations seem backward.

I'm also not understanding why this is such a frustrating concept/concern and why the thought of having a rational discussion about it is quickly being dismissed.

[irishpipes]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I know you said final words, but I'm still completely befuddled about the NM period thing. If someone drops out before initiation when she's in a "non-primary rush period" pledge class, how does all the blame fall on the chapter? Women come on here saying they dropped all the time and I've never seen anyone blame it on the chapter unless hazing was involved.

We have no problem saying a woman is bound for a year after spending like 2 1/2 hours with a chapter, often meeting only a small fraction of its members, and in what (while it usually works) we all have to agree is a very unnatural situation. Meanwhile, a woman who's had anywhere from months to years to get to know a chapter and spend time with them can jettison her commitment QUICKER?

I don't get it.

If she has had so much time to get to know a chapter, why would she accept a bid if she didn't want to stay?

[33girl]

Originally Posted by irishpipes

If she has had so much time to get to know a chapter, why would she accept a bid if she didn't want to stay?

It doesn't happen often, but it does happen. Sometimes the girl has accepted the bid for the wrong reasons and again, that's something a chapter that uses COB often needs to learn how to gauge. I think we all knew women who got along beautifully with our sisters as friends, but who were just not constituted to live in a sorority environment. This is something the pnm and the group need to be honest with themselves about.

[HQWest]

Originally Posted by 33girl

It doesn't happen often, but it does happen. Sometimes the girl has accepted the bid for the wrong reasons and again, that's something a chapter that uses COB often needs to learn how to gauge. I think we all knew women who got along beautifully with our sisters as friends, but who were just not constituted to live in a sorority environment. This is something the pnm and the group need to be honest with themselves about.

Here's the thing - a lot of schools have these huge parties for Bid Day (big reveal and run to the house, etc). Maybe a Party at the lake for new member retreat. Then after that they might have mixers to meet all the members and find a big sis, activities to get to know members and the pledge class, or swaps to meet fraternity members. Still women are disappointed when they realize chapters have rules and requirements, that it costs money.

Chapters do not always do a good job of that with COB girls. COB members need to feel just as special as new members. Some CPCs are not doing a good job where shade is cast on chapters that need to COB. If on top of that when the girls join the chapter they are being told they shouldn't run for office they're a COB, they can't help with recruitment - they're just a COB. That's worse than just the no more unicorns and rainbows. Plus, these girls were your friends before they joined - what's different now? Won't you still be their friend if they deactivate?

COB girls need a Bid Day, new member period etc. They need to learn the meaning of sisterhood. Maybe its not the same length of pledge period - but you can do whatever you want for COB. Send a team with balloons and a fancy engraved bid to go pick them up and bring them to the house for a pizza party or an ice cream social. (You can also use it for practice for a bigger pledge class....)

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by Titchou

OK, these are my final words on this.

The suggestion was to make the requirement one full year instead of the cuurent rule of till the next formal recruitment. There is a difference.

A "proper" new member period meaning the CHAPTER didn't do it's job and gave that class short shrift. In other words, the NM just didn't up and decide she wanted to go thru FR again.

Face it, folks. Some chapters struggle and always will. Nothing this change would accomplish would keep an appreciable number of women in the chapter. I understand trying everything to keep a chapter viable. I was assigned as special adviser to two chapters just for this reason. But sometimes you just have to let it go....as much as it hurts, it can't always be saved or made better.

I'd actually be interested in seeing COB retention vs. FR retention for a lot of these groups. IME, women who join during COB don't often drop, and the ones that do rarely end up going through FR.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

I'd actually be interested in seeing COB retention vs. FR retention for a lot of these groups. IME, women who join during COB don't often drop, and the ones that do rarely end up going through FR.

This is also what I would guess, but again, it's just conjecture. I'd love to see actual numbers.