Indiana University 2014 Recruitment

[cinder1965]

Just learned a friend of mine has a relative who just suicided to Alpha Delta Pi....fingers crossed for her.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by Mom64

She is not bitter at all, just disappointed. I think that asking all these PNMs to give it a shot is asking more of them than of the houses. Most of the houses didn't give them a shot.

And while you criticize a rushee who has met maybe 10% of the chapter for making a conclusion, why can no one admit that having only 10% of their chapter making a conclusion about a rushee any different. And all of these sororities who do not invite certain PNMs back, isn't it because they feel they are not the right fit or not good enough for them,why do the PNMs get criticized for feeling this way about certain houses?

Again, no she is not bitter, she is a bit anxious about who she will live with next year, the changes in her social life, etc. but she is a strong, smart young woman who will do quite well with or without the sorority membership.

What's ironic to me is that you've been arguing that all of these beautiful, intelligent, well-rounded women are "getting hosed" by the system by being invited back to the chapter that "has to take them," when if all of those beautiful, intelligent, well-rounded women accepted their bid to that chapter, that chapter would be the beautiful, intelligent, well-rounded chapter.

Greek life is truly what you make of it. That's why everyone is telling you that your daughter should make lemons out of lemonade. Or she could move on and not be Greek. It's totally her decision. But of course we'd all prefer she take the first course of action and give it a chance. We're Greek.. we love it! And all 26 NPCs have something great to offer.

The reason we comment on the PNMs needing to be open-minded about a chapter whose membership they only know a fraction of is because they're not part of a chapter. At the end of the process, the chapter members are making a different decision than the PNMs. The chapters decide who to invite back. The PNMs decide to either accept their bid and be Greek, or reject it.

Every sorority has to make cuts. That's just how it is. They can't invite back all 1800 PNMs to the 2nd round. They HAVE to make decisions based on those few discussions; there's no other option. They don't have anything against your daughter, or any other PNM. And sometimes, it doesn't work out for them, either. I'm sure we've all had members who we thought would be great who turned out to be a grade risk, or party too hard, or who is just completely unsisterly. Some of those sisters are removed from the chapter. The sororities can make mistakes, and so can the PNMs. Sometimes the mistake is not accepting a bid. Sometimes the mistake is accepting a bid and not having it work out. It's a gamble. But like I said before - we want PNMs to experience Greek life the same way that we all have. We want them to fall in love with a chapter, and with their sorority as a whole. And that love extends far beyond the 4 years in college.

[Griffins&Quills]

Does IU use flex lists? Doesn't it diminish a PNM's chances even further if she decides to suicide bid, like it does elsewhere? Or is that not true of IU?

[ForeverRoses]

Originally Posted by Griffins&Quills

Does IU use flex lists? Doesn't it diminish a PNM's chances even further if she decides to suicide bid, like it does elsewhere? Or is that not true of IU?

Yes we use flex lists. And if a pnm doesn't maximize her options (and suicides) then she is not eligible for quota additions if the chapter decides to take them.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Another thing, re: mutual selection is that chapters do not magically get every PNM they want, either. Sometimes they get women who aren't their top choices, but they know those women have something great to offer and are thrilled to have them on bid day.

[Griffins&Quills]

Originally Posted by ForeverRoses

Yes we use flex lists. And if a pnm doesn't maximize her options (and suicides) then she is not eligible for quota additions if the chapter decides to take them.

Ah thank you. That's what I wanted to know.

[pinksequins]

IU dropped an entire party round this year due to weather (which, as Irishpipes astutely notes, should have been a common sense consideration). IU's problems are largely of its own making.

[ASTalumna06]

And another thing that has been pointed out here on Greekchat numerous times:

Sometimes chapters know PNMs better than they know themselves.

We've read numerous stories where a PNM falls in love with a chapter, doesn't receive a bid from them, "settles" on another chapter, and finds that they never truly belonged in that other chapter anyway. They LOVE their sorority and couldn't imagine being anywhere else.

Some chapters have particular personalities, or things they're looking for in PNMs, or things they're not looking for, or any number of things, that can let them know that a PNM is not a good fit for their chapter. The sororities (perhaps inadvertently) are sometimes making the best decisions for the PNMs by not offering them bids. That might sound strange, but we've also read stories about PNMs falling in love with a chapter during recruitment, accepting a bid from them, and later regretting it. Some of those people have openly admitted that they fell in love with that chapter for all of the wrong reasons (e.g. reputation, colors/symbols, the best house, etc.). And sometimes chapters just provide the best recruitment experience - food, decorations, chanting, great conversations, emotional pref parties - and then fall flat once "real-life" kicks in, giving new members the feeling that they were simply too caught up in the experience of it all to really notice what the sisters were truly like.

Regardless, don't get angry with the chapters. This is a complicated process and every experience of every PNM is different. Sometimes things work out and sometimes they don't, on both the PNM and chapter side of recruitment.

[DubaiSis]

Originally Posted by Mom64

And while you criticize a rushee who has met maybe 10% of the chapter for making a conclusion, why can no one admit that having only 10% of their chapter making a conclusion about a rushee any different. And all of these sororities who do not invite certain PNMs back, isn't it because they feel they are not the right fit or not good enough for them,why do the PNMs get criticized for feeling this way about certain houses?

Actually, no. It's not the same. A chapter is told they have to cut a certain number of girls, but that number doesn't necessarily have any correlation to the number of girls they liked or didn't. Your daughter might have been liked by every chapter and adored by several, but there just wasn't room on the list for her. There's no consolation there because top of the cut list feels exactly the same as the bottom, but don't assume the sorority women are a bunch of meanies who didn't appreciate your daughter's greatness. They have to make some very difficult choices through this process.

[sigmagirl2000]

Originally Posted by Sigmapsimom

But do the unhoused chapters have quota per se? I thought the chapters set their own quotas at IU.

Look at the numbers posted earlier in the thread. Each year 300-500ish women get released from the process (not by choice). This means that no chapters have invited them back. Just because they don't have a physicals house doesn't mean they don't have other reasons for setting a quota before hand, like needing to be able to fit into available rooms for meeting, events, etc. You may not know what the quota is, but it's still there, and I'm sure their RFM specialists know to expect PNMs to react this way towards these chapters and have some idea of what percentage of women will decline the party invites based on the numbers and even just a few years of history. The system will account for such things, and at the end of the day, hopefully these chapters will match with young women who will be excited to be greek and will give it their all.

[614]

My daughter almost went to Indiana, but in the end opted for Illinois. After reading this, I'm so glad she did!! This rush sounds like a complete nightmare and I doubt she would have had a bid. She's adorable, but very reserved and we are not from Indiana so she would have known no one in any house. Quite frankly, I don't get the need to live in so much. My Illinois daughter will live in 3 semesters as did my other daughter who went to Michigan. For both, 3 semesters is/was more than enough. Both my girls have lots of friends in other houses and outside of Greek life all together. It seems like all that living in limits your exposure to so many potential friends since you're so holed up with your sorority sisters. I went to a school without sorority houses and I would have loved nothing more than to spend a year living with my pledge class, but more than that, no thanks!!

[AZTheta]

Sigmapisimom, we do "get IU". We do. Believe us, we do. You don't have to have your leg amputated to know that it is painful. The argument of "you have to experience it to understand it" doesn't apply.

And things do change. This past fall's recruitment (elsewhere) brought some changes that have been decades in the making.

Personally, I am heartsick at the outcome of Indiana recruitment every January. Their Panhellenic system is perpetuating an archaic method of selecting members based on what, to me, are invalid reasons. Yet there is some powerful motivation and support to continue it. As a Panhellenic-minded GC member (search my posts, I truly have friends in every chapter), I say "shame" on my sisters.

Answer this, IU Panhellenic: why NOT change? What valid, supportable, evidence-based reasons can you provide for NOT changing?

Bring it. I'm ready.

[pinkmama]

I went to IU and graduated in 1997. I remember standing on a chair and "fighting" for a girl that my bump group loved! But unfortunately she was on bottom of our list because at the first rounds she wasn't loved with the first bump group that rushed her. She ultimately was cut and she found herself in another house and was happy. Things happen on both sides

Unfortunately yesterday there were hundreds and hundreds of girls happy to attend pref night and those girls who accept bids and be happy on bid day. If you look at Instagram and Facebook of the unhoused chapters they look like they are having a great time!

To be honest I loved living in the house but I had two sisters who were 5th year seniors so they lived out when I was a senior. I spent alot of time
At their apartment making food that I wanted to eat and just only being around three other people instead of 100.

I know there will be women who dropped Bc they only got the two unhoused chapters for pref and they will regret it when they see girls walking around in those letters on bid day. I think they will get two great pledge classes because of the drastic cuts this year due to the lack of one round. I had two girls on my floor who suicided a certain house rather than ranking all three and they regretted it all semester once they saw other girls on the floors with those letters on of those houses they chose not to even put down. Then the following year one of those girls accepted a bid to the house she didn't put down the first year and she loved it.

[AOII Angel]

Realize that IU doesn't really reject 40% of PNMs. Can someone find that thread with the real numbers? I have to go to work. The majority of those numbers are due to PNMs not making grades between 21 party and the beginning of rush the next semester. IU isn't perfect, but numbers aren't that low. The biggest thing to remember with all of this "mutual selection" drama is that increasing quota wouldn't necessarily mean that you or your daughters would have been offered a bid to your/ her dream sorority. The odds are that you/ she would still have been released. The PNM "ranking" does nothing other than accept offered party invitations. We used to get the invitations in the morning and pick which ones we wanted to attend but with computers, it is all done overnight with a party list generated for the PNM in the morning. The rank list doesn't influence how the sororities vote so ranking unhoused groups last does nothing if all the housed groups release you. (I personally think the Rho Gamma should be shot for giving out that very unpanhellenic, prejudicial, inflammatory advice.) Mutual selection is mutual for the highly sought after women who are invited back every where and their lists decide their invites. It doesn't seem so mutual when you get down to the PNMs that haven't made an impression on any of the groups and ends up with few invites. BUT, what we alumnae know is that those women often make amazing members if they can give it a try and get past the tent talk. Greek life, whether in a housed or unhoused chapter, has so much to offer. Choosing to not sign a bid card is one option, but giving it an honest try and seeing what fun might be in store once all the recruitment crap is over may be the best decision you/ she ever made.

[suze81]

I agree with much of what you have expressed here. IU Panhellenic made the decision to eliminate a FULL ROUND (and to incorporate the skits into the first round). This decision impacted the opportunity for PNM's and chapters to get to know one another. Our girls missed out on the opportunity to talk with at least 2-3 actives in every chapter because of the decision to change the first round from mostly conversation to one which included the skit presentation. Some of the rounds were lengthened, but still the elimination of one round meant bigger cuts at each round and less time for chapters to truly have a sense of who the PNM's were in order to make an informed decision about how well a PNM would potentially fit into and contribute to their chapter.

What was so incredibly urgent about completing the process by Tuesday? It seems irresponsible for IU Panhellenic to do so, particularly given the amount of concern and dissatisfaction with the organization which has been expressed on this forum and elsewhere BEFORE this decision was made? Clearly they do not have an interest in listening to their students and parents and making positive changes.