UGA Quota Just Raised!!

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by SoCalGirl

Technically median is one type of average, just like mode and mean.
I took five quarters of three different types of statistics and that's pretty much the sum of my stats knowledge.

There in no way should be a change in total that results in most chapters doing COB.

There are two ways of looking at this. If total is set artificially low and some chapters are much larger than total, making it impossible for the smaller groups to EVER catch up because they are capped by total, then you have to raise total to give them a chance to make up that difference. Each FR cycle it just gets worse.

Raising total too high that makes it prohibitive for chapters to ever reach and all they do is COB all the time is not the goal. But...a chapter should not argue that they don't want to have to COB to keep from raising Total if it helps the smaller chapters that need to be able to grow. It becomes very noticeable over time that XYZ is half as big as ABC even though XYZ is at total.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Raising total too high that makes it prohibitive for chapters to ever reach and all they do is COB all the time is not the goal. But...a chapter should not argue that they don't want to have to COB to keep from raising Total if it helps the smaller chapters that need to be able to grow. It becomes very noticeable over time that XYZ is half as big as ABC even though XYZ is at total.

I don't think UGA (or any of the SEC schools for that matter) have to worry about raising total too high. We're talking that probably right now total is 200, raised to 219, and there are many chapters that have 210-215. When you have 215 members getting 4 more is a piece of cake and no reason to whine.

However, when you have 30 members and are trying to get to the too-high total of 50, getting 4 more is a huge undertaking (unless you know a set of conjoined quadruplets).

This all being said...it would be good if there was a way to say to PNMs "just because total has been raised, doesn't mean that you have a snowball's chance to get into Awesome ABC that dropped you after the first round."

[HQWest]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I don't think UGA (or any of the SEC schools for that matter) have to worry about raising total too high. We're talking that probably right now total is 200, raised to 219, and there are many chapters that have 210-215. When you have 215 members getting 4 more is a piece of cake and no reason to whine.

However, when you have 30 members and are trying to get to the too-high total of 50, getting 4 more is a huge undertaking (unless you know a set of conjoined quadruplets).

This all being said...it would be good if there was a way to say to PNMs "just because total has been raised, doesn't mean that you have a snowball's chance to get into Awesome ABC that dropped you after the first round."

I do think there is a potential problem at SEC schools raising total every year. We have seen for the past couple of years that records are being broken with the number of women signing up for recruitment. For example, if you look at the Alabama numbers, the number of women signing up has almost doubled in 6 years. That is not sustainable growth.

At some point, the number of women interested and able to participate in recruitment, and that have the funds to pay dues will be reached and this surge in popularity is bound to swing back the other way. Right when it first happens, it may not be a problem and they may be able to adjust total down four or five at a time, but there is no motivation for the bigger groups to agree to do that.

This is self-correcting to a point with RFM, but if it continues and total is not adjusted down, there will still be a gap as the most popular groups will also have the best retention rates. It doesn't matter if quota is 60 and total is 180 if your graduation numbers are less than 50%. The smaller groups might try to reduce dues to keep up, but that also means changing their goals and activities.

[gatordeltapgh]

I too wonder about if and when the bubble will burst.

I can also say that there will be support for evaluating total down if and when it becomes unnecessary even in these big communities. The NPC College Panhellenic committee has been beating the drum on proper evaluation of total for several years. If one group tries to not vote in what is best for the community there will be pressure via the NPC Delegates to do the right thing for the community. With that said, as was mentioned previous COBing a few to move everyone to average should not be a big deal. Even the smaller groups deserve the opportunity to get closer to the average chapter size and their HQ will want them to have that opportunity.

We have all lived through the days of what can happen when you don't evaluate total each year. I can say that on the NPC CPH committee and NPC Delegate side, there is a commitment to doing what is right...even if that means an adjustment downward.

[33girl]

Yes, but what is that point? 5, 10, 20, 50 years?

I agree with you that retention is key, more than the focus on total and quota. I would disagree that the most popular groups (if by that you are referring to the ones most desired in rush) always have the highest retention rates.

[DubaiSis]

And expansion. I think there has to be a point (150 members, 175 members) where expansion should really be considered. Even if you decide your tipping point is 200, it needs to addressed. Yes there may be reductions over time but the growth we're seeing isn't going to suddenly collapse in a year, and those chapters may not like it, but they could survive (make their mortgage payments) at WAY fewer members.

Plus, as I've seen it, adding chapters doesn't seem to be reducing quota anywhere. More chapters=more interest or possibly more effective RFM. I don't know which.

[HQWest]

Originally Posted by Low C Sharp

A lot of the growth in the SEC, particularly at Bama, is resulting from student body growth, rather than growth in the percentage of the student body that is interested. I'm sure that the Panhellenics are in communication with the university leadership about the planned trajectory in student body size.

(from their website information) The increase in the number of students enrolling at Bama is up 47% since 2002, while the increase in students signing up for NPC recruitment appears to be greater than 100% in that same time frame?

[Hartofsec]

Originally Posted by HQWest

(from their website information) The increase in the number of students enrolling at Bama is up 47% since 2002, while the increase in students signing up for NPC recruitment appears to be greater than 100% in that same time frame?

Off the cuff I would guess that a lot of the increase in NPC recruitment numbers is due to the increase in OOS student enrollment -- the swelling numbers of OOS new members, even among chapters that are in-state strongholds, seems to suggest this. I think the Greek system at Alabama probably serves as a draw to some OOS students (in addition to reasonable tuition, admission requirements, and scholarship incentives).

In-state enrollment does not seem to be increasing (according to the following article, we have hit a plateau in numbers of high school graduates -- okay, I know y'all just laughed ). I know enrollment does not equal interest, so I don't know how the stats compare over the years in regard to in-state vs OOS increases in recruitment percentages (perhaps someone out there has these numbers).

Article I mentioned (from last year):

The number of freshmen from Alabama decreased by 299 students, as 2,848 in-state students enrolled at UA this fall, the report said. The number of freshmen from Georgia also decreased by 117, the largest decrease among states other than Alabama.
The Fall 2011 semester saw the number of freshman students from New York more than triple, as 59 students enrolled. Sixty more freshman students from Texas enrolled, as well as 43 more students from Maryland and 41 more students from New York, the report said.
[…]
“UA recruits in Alabama, the Southeast and across the country,” said Mary Spiegel, executive director of Undergraduate Admissions. “With the number of high school graduates in the state of Alabama at a plateau, there has been a rise in the number of out-of-state students. We share with [both the out-of-state students] and in-state students information about the University and the quality education that they can receive.”
http://cw.ua.edu/2011/10/13/out-of-s...r-recruitment/

[AGDee]

In my 28 years of Greek involvement, I have seen interest in Greek organizations go up and down in cyclical trends. With the number of expansions and the high Totals we're seeing on some campuses, we are clearly in the upward trend. Where will the peak be and when will we start to see a decline remains to be seen.

I think there is an overall trend for young people to join structured things. This generation didn't just go outside and play. They didn't have pick up baseball games in a field. They have been signed up for structured social activities their whole lives. I think this is why we're seeing the insurgence in Greek life too. They don't know how to be social without the structure of an organization.

I've been pretty shocked that with the economy struggling as it has been, we haven't seen a sharp decline over the last decade. Instead, we are seeing huge growth. I really think it is because of the structured social activity life.

[dgdramadawg]

Originally Posted by AGDee

I've been pretty shocked that with the economy struggling as it has been, we haven't seen a sharp decline over the last decade. Instead, we are seeing huge growth. I really think it is because of the structured social activity life.

I've wondered about that, too. A couple of years ago, a mom told me that she was asking her daughter to go through recruitment because she had heard being in a sorority would be a good foot in the door for getting a job after graduation. The mom was essentially willing to foot the bill for God-knows-how-much in total sorority dues and fees over 4 years for a little feeling of security in the unstable job market. [Her daughter had no interest in Greek life and dropped after round 1.]

[HQWest]

Originally Posted by AGDee

I think there is an overall trend for young people to join structured things. This generation didn't just go outside and play. They didn't have pick up baseball games in a field. They have been signed up for structured social activities their whole lives. I think this is why we're seeing the insurgence in Greek life too. They don't know how to be social without the structure of an organization.

I've been pretty shocked that with the economy struggling as it has been, we haven't seen a sharp decline over the last decade. Instead, we are seeing huge growth. I really think it is because of the structured social activity life.

I blame Legally Blonde....

[AGDee]

Not the TV Show Greek?

[HQWest]

I only watched that a couple times but they didnt seem to be having fun. Casey Cartwright was always complaining, and I guess I couldnt get over that Cordelia Chase got finished fighting vampires with Buffy and then went on to e a traveling consultant??

[RavenUGA]

Total was raised from 200 to 229 (average chapter size). There are ~10 chapters that will be under total (it remains to be seen how many will do COB or other recruiting to fill their slots this fall).

[AZTheta]

Question for those who understand this "stuff":

OK, total has been raised. Do all chapters now "have to" raise their membership to total? Is that something that is at the discretion of each chapter's organizational policy? Is there a time frame to "get to total?"

Sorry in advance if I'm not understanding or if this was already answered. I don't know why this is not processing in my brain.