Chicago Teachers Set Strike Date

[AGDee]

The UAW did accept a two tier pay system so new guys hired in make only $14 an hour. And honestly, it is very difficult to raise a family on $23 an hour. They do some things that seem greedy, but all in all, they made salaries higher for everybody... both blue and white collar employees.

Issues with the auto companies go far beyond the UAW. The very fact that they have to compete with foreign auto companies who don't have to pay a dime for health care for their employees puts them at a distinct disadvantage.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by AGDee

The UAW did accept a two tier pay system so new guys hired in make only $14 an hour. And honestly, it is very difficult to raise a family on $23 an hour. They do some things that seem greedy, but all in all, they made salaries higher for everybody... both blue and white collar employees.

Issues with the auto companies go far beyond the UAW. The very fact that they have to compete with foreign auto companies who don't have to pay a dime for health care for their employees puts them at a distinct disadvantage.

Oh, the things I could do if EITHER my husband or I was making $23/hour. Unless you're talking single income home, in which case, it still isn't that hard. Yeah, you might not get a large family vacation every year, and your kid(s) may have to choose between soccer OR band, but it's certainly no where near poverty.

[LaneSig]

PM_Mama and AlphaFrog-

$23 times 40 = $920 for a week's pay.

$920 times 4 = $3680 for the month.

$3680 times 67% (which is the average take home pay after taxes, insurance contribution, etc.) = $2465 for a month

$2465 times 12 = $29580 for a year's take home pay.

$29580 to buy groceries, gas, rent (or home mortgage if lucky), utilities, etc. Most people would have trouble making due on that as a single person. Now, add in a family. Even if your spouse is making a 2nd income, it's still going to be tough.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by LaneSig

PM_Mama and AlphaFrog-

$23 times 40 = $920 for a week's pay.

$920 times 4 = $3680 for the month.

$3680 times 67% (which is the average take home pay after taxes, insurance contribution, etc.) = $2465 for a month

$2465 times 12 = $29580 for a year's take home pay.

$29580 to buy groceries, gas, rent (or home mortgage if lucky), utilities, etc. Most people would have trouble making due on that as a single person. Now, add in a family. Even if your spouse is making a 2nd income, it's still going to be tough.

Even if your mortgage/rent was $1200/month (would be very middle class where I live), that still leaves you $1,200 for expenses. Can you live large on that? Obviously not, but you could live economically on that. Might mean no cable and no eating out. But no one owes you that stuff.

I know what I'm talking about, because my husband and I together don't make much more than $23/ hour since he had to take a huge cut in pay when the restaurant he was working for shut down. We luckily have a low mortgage payment, but we also put money in the savings account every month as well.

[AOII Angel]

Because if I don't have it no one else can. Great argument.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Because if I don't have it no one else can. Great argument.

And we don't even have to talk about money. I, for one, enjoy my 40-hour work week, my appropriate safety training and equipment, and the occasional holiday.

In fact, when I purchase a vehicle, I'm glad it was made by skilled workers!

[Kevin]

Maybe COL in Michigan isn't what it is in Cook County, etc.? I can tell y'all that in OKC, $30K can go a pretty long way as far as being able to provide for the necessities. That said, I earn quite a bit more than that amount and couldn't imagine making it on a penny less. I probably could, but I wouldn't want to try.

[AGDee]

Perhaps. My mortgage is $1000, car payment is $244. I own the kids' car outright but my car insurance is $385 a month. Right now, gas is costing me $320 a month for both cars. I haven't even gotten to the $200 a month for utilities. We're at $2149 of the 2500 a month and we haven't eaten, bought clothes, had home or car repairs or anything. Pretty tough to raise a family on that here. Oh yeah...and tuition, Boy Scout camps, they all add up really fast. And in the days when I paid day care? That was $1000 a month alone. Can people live on it? Yes. Is it a comfortable middle class income? No. It is low enough to qualify for reduced lunch.

[joliebelle]

30K is not much in Cook County. I make a couple grand more than that and between rent, student loans, and savings it's often a tight squeeze every month. I also have the added luxury of not having kids or a car.

I have worked in 2 CPS schools--one a charter school and the other an elementary school. It's not easy being a CPS teacher with 29 kids in your classroom, much less 55. I also stand with Chicago teachers.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by joliebelle

30K is not much in Cook County.

This.

Not sure where you live, AF, but take $30k to NYC/Chicago/LA/etc. and see what it gets you. Particularly if we're talking 2 kids and a spouse. It gets you a cardboard box. Or massive credit card debt. One of those.

[Venusloves11]

I can't blame those teachers for making a big deal out of possibly having 55 kids in a classroom. I can imagine that parents aren't loving it either! When I was a teacher in a traditional honors/gifted classroom, I had one class of 36 gifted kids. I didn't even have enough room for that amount of desks and would have kids sitting in folding chairs while sharing a desk with a classmate. For exams, I would have kids using my desk. I had two honors classes that had 33 kids each. Florida has a class size amendment in place, but that does not apply to social studies classes and I would shoot daggers with my eyes at the language arts, math, and science teachers who complained about having 23-25 kids in a class.

As a virtual school teacher, I have 350 students. We don't have a union (charter school). My heart goes out to those teachers. Sadly, salary negotiation is the only bargaining chip that teachers have.

[ASUADPi]

Boy and I glad I work in DoDEA. We have a powerful union, awesome pay, pretty decent benefits and small class sizes.

That being said, I have worked public school and what the states are doing is downright pathetic! I remember when Napalitano was governor she pissed the republicans off so much as everytime they tried to send her a budget that included an excessive amount of cuts to education, she sent it back and told them to "cut from someplace else". She advocated for education. But yet when Brewer took over, the first thing she made cuts too, education.

I find it so pathetic that we live in a country that has these insane rules for teachers and requirements for teachers to meet, yet we do not put our money where our mouths are. We would rather continue to fund a going on 12 year war. (Just an FYI, I'm not saying don't fund the military, but this war in Afghanistan/Iraq is beyond old now, we just need to bring our men and women home).

I only have 15 kids in my room, but even 15 I don't feel like I'm doing my job sufficiently. I've got a kid who doesn't know his alphabet all the way to a child who is reading/comprehending at a 3rd grade level with everything in between. I have like 5 kids on medication in my class (adhd). I cannot imagine having 55 first graders with all of that. I'd lose my frickin mind and probably say "screw education".

The reality is, teachers don't get into teaching for the money, but we would like to be valued for what we do. We would like to be able to survive without having to take out personal loans or have 2nd/3rd jobs to make ends meat. If I went to public, I would take about a 27k paycut. With the cost of living in the town I'm living in, there is no way I could survive without having 2 or more roommates.

I say more power to the teachers of CPS. I may not be in CPS but as a fellow teacher I support you 100%!

[chitownxo]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

Even if your mortgage/rent was $1200/month (would be very middle class where I live), that still leaves you $1,200 for expenses. Can you live large on that? Obviously not, but you could live economically on that. Might mean no cable and no eating out. But no one owes you that stuff.

I know what I'm talking about, because my husband and I together don't make much more than $23/ hour since he had to take a huge cut in pay when the restaurant he was working for shut down. We luckily have a low mortgage payment, but we also put money in the savings account every month as well.

I'm sorry, Jess, you don't know what you're talking about. You may be able to live comfortably on this where you live. I know you've lived in Illinois before, but you don't now. You don't live in Cook County, I do, and after taxes and benefits, I'll make about 31,000.00 this year. My husband lost his job a while ago; he is able to make some money teaching on a per diem basis at one of the community colleges. I don't know what gas is where you live, but it's $4.23/gallon here. We try and fill up in Will County when possible, since it can be anywhere from .10 to .45 cheaper, depending on the day. My monthly train ticket runs $149.50. Driving downtown would be much more expensive. We have cable and internet, our mortgage is $1150 and our oldest is in preschool, which is running us about $290 a month. Do we have money left over? A bit, but it's hard. We cut coupons, follow sales, and get a lot of the kids' clothes at second hand stores. I don't know what's gonna happen if we have a major problem with our cars or an illness.

As for the CPS strike, I know several CPS teachers. They don't want to strike, but they feel they don't have a choice. They simply cannot be effective as things stand now.

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

And we don't even have to talk about money. I, for one, enjoy my 40-hour work week, my appropriate safety training and equipment, and the occasional holiday.

Who doesn't? No one has said that the original intent of the Unions was bad.

In fact, when I purchase a vehicle, I'm glad it was made by skilled workers!

I don't care wh knows what I make. Like I said, I have a bachelors degree. I've been at my company, an automotive supplier, for 2 years. I make $28/year. I don't know how people manage to survive on that, but I can't. So much so that I'm still stuck living with my parents. I am grossly underpaid. So forgive me if i don't feel bad for someone with barely a high school education making more than twice per hour than I do, to sit and push a button all day. They make in the $20s/hr and have awesome benefits and so far a pension, while my classmates and I have struggled to find decent paying jobs. Hell some of the UAW make more than those in the skilled trades. There are teachers and firemen who are paid less. Depending on what someone does on the line, I wouldn't call them a skilled worker. I'd call them lucky that they got in there. (for those who don't know, you have to basically know someone to get into the Big 3. you don't just apply)

And, perhaps it's only those of us living in the Detroit area that know what some of those workers are doing on their lunch? And who protected their asses from getting canned? The UAW. Yes, it was only SOME that got caught, a fraction of how many people actually work at the plants. But those SOME are working on the car that you drive every day with your family and kids and pets and whatever else you drive around. Plus, who knows how many others never got caught? They should be drug tested every year for what they are working on, but I'm sure the UAW would block that thought immediately.

Going back to the teacher thing, 55 kids per class?! I didn't have that many in my college classes. That's insane!

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by AGDee

The UAW did accept a two tier pay system so new guys hired in make only $14 an hour. And honestly, it is very difficult to raise a family on $23 an hour. They do some things that seem greedy, but all in all, they made salaries higher for everybody... both blue and white collar employees.

Issues with the auto companies go far beyond the UAW. The very fact that they have to compete with foreign auto companies who don't have to pay a dime for health care for their employees puts them at a distinct disadvantage.

Sorry Dee I completely missed your post when I replied. I agree with the competition part. It sucks. And bravo to starting new guys at $14.