Always a PNM, never a sister.

[AZTheta]

Originally Posted by Greek_or_Geek?

It just doesn't add up. Either sorority members are making up excuses because the pariah won't leave them alone or the pariah has done something so heinous that everyone at a small school knows about it and the pariah is leaving out key facts or living in denial.

I can't wrap my head around the OP's situation. Or, as I often say, I can't connect the dots. It's too convoluted.

I'm with Greek_or_Geek.

[SydneyK]

Originally Posted by Greek_or_Geek?

the pariah is leaving out key facts or living in denial.

This.

Originally Posted by AzTheta

I can't connect the dots. It's too convoluted.

She hasn't given us enough information to connect the dots. I don't think anyone could figure this out without more to go on.

SoccerSweetie22, just be honest here. What was in that letter?

[28StGreek]

Not saying this is the case, but sometimes the reason can be as simple, harsh and judgmental, as appearance. Especially if its a small clique-y campus? And perhaps I am totally reading between the lines the wrong way, but the OP seemed to think it necessary for whatever reason to make comments about her own appearance.

C'est la vie.

[KDCat]

Originally Posted by 28StGreek

Not saying this is the case, but sometimes the reason can be as simple, harsh and judgmental, as appearance. Especially if its a small clique-y campus? And perhaps I am totally reading between the lines the wrong way, but the OP seemed to think it necessary for whatever reason to make comments about her own appearance.

C'est la vie.

I doubt it. In my experience, even the plainest PNM can usually find a place if she has good grades, good extracurriculars, and a decent personality. Not all sorority women are beauty queens.

The "not upholding the values and morals of sisterhood" sounds more serious.

[33girl]

A college student using the term 1%er?

Come on y'all. This screams troll/field trip like whoa.

[28StGreek]

Originally Posted by KDCat

I doubt it. In my experience, even the plainest PNM can usually find a place if she has good grades, good extracurriculars, and a decent personality. Not all sorority women are beauty queens.

I am not saying all sorority women are beauty queens, or that this applies to the OP. But nowadays at some schools were PNMs are so similar in grades, extracurriculars and personality (i.e. driven to excel, outgoing, social media savvy, etc) that it isn't much of a stretch of the imagination that the deciding factor could well be appearance.

Maybe its just my experience in a region where appearance/personal grooming is very much ingrained in the lifestyle habits of the general population.

[SoccerSweetie22]

I have no reason to troll or lie. It honestly just feels like you guys are trying to "catch" me trolling so you can tell me how pathetic and/or stupid I am. I'm not trolling, okay? And I've decided that I won't be going through recruitment again, but I want to clear a few things up because although I have a lot of respect for the Greek System (I really wanted to be a part of it!) this actually happened to me, and in some ways, the system may be flawed. This is what I have went through for two years. It doesn't sound right because it isn't. But that doesn't mean that I came on here to mess with you guys. Check my profile out. I made my profile for this specific question because I wanted an honest answer, and I believe that many of you gave me one. So thank you.

I'm going to stop being so anonymous so that hopefully this makes more sense.

DISCLAIMER: I do not have a problem with any of these sororities. I have the utmost respect for these organizations and in no way am I trying to insult any of them. I'm simply clarifying!


First Year: Lived with a roommate. She is in Delta Zeta. I went through recruitment. On day 2, I was called back to DZ and Sigma Kappa. I did not list my legacy, I did not make it to preference.

Second Year: Day 2 I was called back to Delta Zeta, Zeta Tau Alpha, and Alpha Delta Pi (My legacy) I listed my legacy. Again, did not make it to preference.

Let a year go by. Just a few months ago I became friends with the Panhellenic President at my school. She asked me what I thought about going through recruitment again. She said she heard from a Rho Chi that I was offered a bid from Delta Zeta and turned it down my second year. I was shocked because I was not offered a bid and I would have loved to have been a DZ. This news also shocked her so she did some digging. So did I. I wanted to know what had happened. Did I really get a bid? That is when I found out about the letter that my former roommate wrote to somebody in the Greek System. i do not know to who, i never saw the letter, but it was written and submitted. This was confirmed. This information is technically confidential. I was only able to receive confirmation because I had heard about it from someone else elsewhere.

The PanPres talked to the Pres of DZ. The DZPres talked to my former roommate asking if she felt any differently and if they could extend me a bid (other DZ sisters were also telling the DZPres I should join) My former roommate said no, her feelings about me remained the same. I was told this by a DZ sister and mutual friend of mine who observed the conversation and it was later confirmed by members of the panhellenic council. Both Presidents looked into overriding it, but were apparently told it was "above their heads" and it was just "politics" and they are very very sorry.

I had no knowledge that this letter was written, but it was apparently written before my first recruitment. I had known this woman for less than three months at the time she wrote the letter. I was told (and it was later confirmed) that she believed I did not uphold the values and morals of sisterhood and threatened to drop if I were offered a bid. This is especially painful because we hardly knew each other well enough for her to make those judgements, and she was so nice to me the entire year. Never in a million years did I think she would do that. Especially because she was always telling me and everyone we met how "awesome" I was. I feel very betrayed, but there is nothing I can do except to move on. I did NOT read the letter, I have never seen it. I only know what I have been told by mutual friends and Greek "employees" at my school (not sure what to call it. Council members perhaps) who have CONFIRMED what I'm saying. These are not rumors, they are facts.

I really wanted to pledge Delta Zeta. I loved the other chapters, but I fit in more with Delta Zeta. Please don't think I'm dissing the other chapters or blaming them for not getting a bid. It's true what they say, "you just know." I only really felt that with DZ. They were all great and it was an amazing weekend, but i just felt more connected to that chapter. And it's become clear to me that I will not receive a bid from Delta Zeta, and yes that's disappointing, but I will still remain friends with the members outside of the Greek system. At first I wanted to go through recruitment and I wanted to get in so badly that I was willing to join any one that would take me. But that's not fair to myself, nor the sisters of the sorority.

I appreciate all of the things you guys have told me, so thank you.

This seems crazy because it is. But that doesn't mean that I'm making it up. This is what I have gone through. THESE THINGS HAPPEN! It happened to me. There isn't more to the story. This is it. And it sucks, but that's how it played out. The only thing that I ask is that you stop trying to play detective and find "holes" in my story. If this made sense and if it wasn't confusing, I would not be on a Greek site asking for opinions. I have no reason to lie or hold back information. You can choose to believe what you want.

But I believe that everything happens for a reason. I don't understand right now, but hopefully I will in the future. In the meantime, I'll get involved in other things on campus. Life is full of disappointments and I'm going to move on and handle rejection maturely. It isn't the end of the world.

Again, thank you for your replies! Many of you had very honest and helpful feedback and I appreciate it!

[Greek_or_Geek?]

Originally Posted by SoccerSweetie22

I have no reason to troll or lie. It honestly just feels like you guys are trying to "catch" me trolling so you can tell me how pathetic and/or stupid I am. I'm not trolling, okay? And I've decided that I won't be going through recruitment again, but I want to clear a few things up because although I have a lot of respect for the Greek System (I really wanted to be a part of it!) this actually happened to me, and in some ways, the system may be flawed. This is what I have went through for two years. It doesn't sound right because it isn't. But that doesn't mean that I came on here to mess with you guys. Check my profile out. I made my profile for this specific question because I wanted an honest answer, and I believe that many of you gave me one. So thank you.

I'm going to stop being so anonymous so that hopefully this makes more sense.

DISCLAIMER: I do not have a problem with any of these sororities. I have the utmost respect for these organizations and in no way am I trying to insult any of them. I'm simply clarifying!


First Year: Lived with a roommate. She is in Delta Zeta. I went through recruitment. On day 2, I was called back to DZ and Sigma Kappa. I did not list my legacy, I did not make it to preference.

Second Year: Day 2 I was called back to Delta Zeta, Zeta Tau Alpha, and Alpha Delta Pi (My legacy) I listed my legacy. Again, did not make it to preference.

Let a year go by. Just a few months ago I became friends with the Panhellenic President at my school. She asked me what I thought about going through recruitment again. She said she heard from a Rho Chi that I was offered a bid from Delta Zeta and turned it down my second year. I was shocked because I was not offered a bid and I would have loved to have been a DZ. This news also shocked her so she did some digging. So did I. I wanted to know what had happened. Did I really get a bid? That is when I found out about the letter that my former roommate wrote to somebody in the Greek System. i do not know to who, i never saw the letter, but it was written and submitted. This was confirmed. This information is technically confidential. I was only able to receive confirmation because I had heard about it from someone else elsewhere.

The PanPres talked to the Pres of DZ. The DZPres talked to my former roommate asking if she felt any differently and if they could extend me a bid (other DZ sisters were also telling the DZPres I should join) My former roommate said no, her feelings about me remained the same. I was told this by a DZ sister and mutual friend of mine who observed the conversation and it was later confirmed by members of the panhellenic council. Both Presidents looked into overriding it, but were apparently told it was "above their heads" and it was just "politics" and they are very very sorry.

I had no knowledge that this letter was written, but it was apparently written before my first recruitment. I had known this woman for less than three months at the time she wrote the letter. I was told (and it was later confirmed) that she believed I did not uphold the values and morals of sisterhood and threatened to drop if I were offered a bid. This is especially painful because we hardly knew each other well enough for her to make those judgements, and she was so nice to me the entire year. Never in a million years did I think she would do that. Especially because she was always telling me and everyone we met how "awesome" I was. I feel very betrayed, but there is nothing I can do except to move on. I did NOT read the letter, I have never seen it. I only know what I have been told by mutual friends and Greek "employees" at my school (not sure what to call it. Council members perhaps) who have CONFIRMED what I'm saying. These are not rumors, they are facts.

I really wanted to pledge Delta Zeta. I loved the other chapters, but I fit in more with Delta Zeta. Please don't think I'm dissing the other chapters or blaming them for not getting a bid. It's true what they say, "you just know." I only really felt that with DZ. They were all great and it was an amazing weekend, but i just felt more connected to that chapter. And it's become clear to me that I will not receive a bid from Delta Zeta, and yes that's disappointing, but I will still remain friends with the members outside of the Greek system. At first I wanted to go through recruitment and I wanted to get in so badly that I was willing to join any one that would take me. But that's not fair to myself, nor the sisters of the sorority.

I appreciate all of the things you guys have told me, so thank you.

This seems crazy because it is. But that doesn't mean that I'm making it up. This is what I have gone through. THESE THINGS HAPPEN! It happened to me. There isn't more to the story. This is it. And it sucks, but that's how it played out. The only thing that I ask is that you stop trying to play detective and find "holes" in my story. If this made sense and if it wasn't confusing, I would not be on a Greek site asking for opinions. I have no reason to lie or hold back information. You can choose to believe what you want.

But I believe that everything happens for a reason. I don't understand right now, but hopefully I will in the future. In the meantime, I'll get involved in other things on campus. Life is full of disappointments and I'm going to move on and handle rejection maturely. It isn't the end of the world.

Again, thank you for your replies! Many of you had very honest and helpful feedback and I appreciate it!

...

[BadCat25]

I probably have no right to give you advice as I am in a sorority and don't know the pain of being rejected twice but you have made the right decision not to try again. I really think you should move on and leave sorority life behind, no matter how hard this may be. Make non-greek friends and get involved in non-greek activities and remember that if your college is like most others the majority of students are not greek and have a great college experience. Just put the past behind you and move on with your life.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by SoccerSweetie22

This was confirmed.

By whom? Who told you that there was a letter written that went to some unidentified Overlord of all things Greek?

Originally Posted by SoccerSweetie22

This information is technically confidential. I was only able to receive confirmation because I had heard about it from someone else elsewhere.

Again, who confirmed what?

Originally Posted by SoccerSweetie22

The PanPres talked to the Pres of DZ. The DZPres talked to my former roommate asking if she felt any differently and if they could extend me a bid (other DZ sisters were also telling the DZPres I should join) My former roommate said no, her feelings about me remained the same. I was told this by a DZ sister and mutual friend of mine who observed the conversation and it was later confirmed by members of the panhellenic council. Both Presidents looked into overriding it, but were apparently told it was "above their heads" and it was just "politics" and they are very very sorry.

The Panhellenic President has no say in membership decisions (unless of course, she is also a DZ, which I'm not clear on from your earlier post). It is indeed possible that one person can prevent you from getting a bid to her chapter. What is so confusing to the rest of us is why that would have affected your chances at other chapters.

Originally Posted by SoccerSweetie22

I only know what I have been told by mutual friends and Greek "employees" at my school (not sure what to call it. Council members perhaps) who have CONFIRMED what I'm saying. These are not rumors, they are facts.

If you don't know who they are, neither do we. Panhellenic officers? Someone in the Greek Life office?

[SydneyK]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

What is so confusing to the rest of us is why that would have affected your chances at other chapters.

My guess is that whatever was in that letter was really bad. OP hasn't said what's in the letter, and I can't help but think she hasn't shared that information because it's true and she's terribly embarrassed by it. Once the contents of the letter were shared between other sororities, they agreed that the OP isn't up to snuff. I agree with whoever here said that the letter was probably accompanied by video, or police record, or something that supports the claims made against the OP.

I'm oblivious to the inner workings of Student Life, so this may be a stupid question. But let's say the person who received the letter was the Dean of Students, and the offense the OP committed was something that violated the school's code of conduct. Could the Dean prohibit her from being eligible to participate in recruitment? (Which doesn't seem to be the case at all, since she did participate in recruitment, but it's one of the only ways I can imagine a "higher up" official having input into membership selection across several chapters.)

[gee_ess]

I believe your story. I'm sorry that the whole thing happened, and it sounds like you had a really hateful roommate. Some people use membership privilege as a weapon, and it sounds like that is what your roommate did. If it were me, I would want to know what the roommie found so appalling in my behavior, so I probably would ask her directly just to get it cleared up in my mind. But, I agree. You should not go through recruitment again.

[AZTheta]

Now that (IMO)mostly all of the dots are presented, my thought is this: for an active to (a) write a negative letter against a PNM's membership and (b) stand firm two years later, something unconscionably egregious must have transpired in the active's relationship with the OP.

None of us will discuss membership selection here. That said, I believe that this is a membership selection matter, and that ends it for me.

OP: it does appear clearly that your sorority ship has sailed. I wish you all the best in the future.

[33girl]

I've never heard of ONE letter from ONE woman in ONE sorority scuttling a person's sorority chances for the whole campus, unless it has a police report or videotape attached to it.

I mean, if we met a girl coming through rush and heard through the grapevine "Debby DZ is going to drop out of DZ if this girl gets a bid" our response would be "Who effing cares?" For that matter, depending on how well liked or not Debby was, some groups would pledge the rushee just to get Debby's goat.

There are five other sororities, including a legacy which you apparently tossed to the side. You unwisely set your sights on one and refused to keep an open mind. THIS is why you didn't receive a bid. THIS is why you aren't Greek. I'm sorry your roommate was such a bitch, but there's also the possibility that this was the only way to make you see that even though YOU thought DZ was right for you, it really WASN'T.

[ellebud]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I've never heard of ONE letter from ONE woman in ONE sorority scuttling a person's sorority chances for the whole campus, unless it has a police report or videotape attached to it.

I mean, if we met a girl coming through rush and heard through the grapevine "Debby DZ is going to drop out of DZ if this girl gets a bid" our response would be "Who effing cares?" For that matter, depending on how well liked or not Debby was, some groups would pledge the rushee just to get Debby's goat.

There are five other sororities, including a legacy which you apparently tossed to the side. You unwisely set your sights on one and refused to keep an open mind. THIS is why you didn't receive a bid. THIS is why you aren't Greek. I'm sorry your roommate was such a bitch, but there's also the possibility that this was the only way to make you see that even though YOU thought DZ was right for you, it really WASN'T.

Sorry, I have heard (and know) two women who went out of their way to make sure someone didn't get a bid. They were quite proud of their accomplishment(s).

No, the venom was not to one girl. Nor were the two women friends (they didn't know each other). Nor was it for the same house and/or the same year. When there is a chance for ugly behavior it will happen.