Questions about GPA Requirements and PNMs

[SororityGirlBO]

Originally Posted by Titchou

Bama's web site and the other one mentioned - FSU? - do it the right way. Tell them that one really needs a high GPA but doesn't go listing everyone's requirements. We all know that some folks get in that don't meet the chapter's requirement because of a lot of reasons. And recs are the way to get the information you need to make those decisions. And if your alumnae don't know how to do a rec and you aren't inclined to teach them, well, you're going to get what you are going to get.

I do agree, might as well be up front about it. I guess that was my thinking to begin with.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Titchou

And if your alumnae don't know how to do a rec and you aren't inclined to teach them, well, you're going to get what you are going to get.

Welcome to the Northeast. As violetpretty said one time, at her school, alumnae sending recs could almost make a rushee's chances WORSE - it's seen as undue interference. We don't like to be bossed up here. I would wager Towson would be the same way, even if all the chapters got a truckload of recs tomorrow.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by 33girl

I could care less if a GLO wants to set their GPA at (random number) 3.9. However, if all of them do that, and Panhellenic lets someone with a 2.7 sign up and pay the $100 fee, KNOWING she will be cut by all the sororities, I consider that irresponsible. This isn't about membership requirements and lofty things like that, it's about something a little more practical - not allowing a young woman and/or her parents to throw money down the toilet. If that's too gauche for NPC to even talk about, whatEVER.

This! And forget just the application fee.. There are house round casual clothes and preference dresses to be bought!

At many schools, there would be no harm in going through recruitment with a low GPA. At others, however, I'm sure there are girls who are spending hundreds of dollars for just a chance to be in a chapter. If you give PNMs no warning, that's a very quick way to potentially build a list of girls who resent sororities and everything they're about.

Originally Posted by 33girl

Welcome to the Northeast. As violetpretty said one time, at her school, alumnae sending recs could almost make a rushee's chances WORSE - it's seen as undue interference. We don't like to be bossed up here. I would wager Towson would be the same way, even if all the chapters got a truckload of recs tomorrow.

Exactly. I didn't know what a rec was until I came to GC a few years after I graduated. If my chapter received one, I'm pretty sure we wouldn't have known what it was, or what the hell to do with it.

[MaryPoppins]

@33girl - Your use of the word gauche made my day!

[KSUViolet06]

I've been debating making a thread about the whole "selection isn't really all that mutual" thing (for the benefit of PNMs and parents), but there's no real nice way to say "it's more sorority selection."

I think it is much more mutual in the actual bid matching process, but...that's after we've made the bulk of the selection decisions in the earlier rounds. Like, you're mutually matched with what you have left after we're done doing most of the choosing. lol.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

I've been debating making a thread about the whole "selection isn't really all that mutual" thing (for the benefit of PNMs and parents), but there's no real nice way to say "it's more sorority selection."

But as OldRow just mentioned, that's not true for a weak recruiting chapter. Yes, the chapter still makes the first "cuts", if you will, but a) weak recruiting chapters often make very few cuts under RFM, and b) there are far more women who choose not to return to weak recruiting XYZ than are cut by weak recruiting XYZ over the course of recruitment. It is just as heartbreaking to not see your favorite PNM on a party list as it is not to see your favorite chapter.

I think the difference may be that the women in XYZ have a pretty good idea of this going in; the PNM's may not.

[Titchou]

What's wrong with looking at it this way. I invite people to my home. They just don't show up for parties - they're invited. So, we invite PNMs to our chapters. They "accept" or "decline" based on their rankings of us. After all, a bid is an invitation to join. We invite; they accept or decline. It is mutual - but we're the ones having the parties...so we get to say who's invited.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Titchou

What's wrong with looking at it this way.

Ask the 1990s. It's their fault. LOL.

I think it's a misguided attempt by women who have been out of college for FAR too long to attract different kinds of women than the ones who have traditionally been members and stop their orgs being tagged as the "snobby old-girl network." Not that attracting different kinds of women is misguided at all, but making them think it's going to be easy peasy lemon squeezy is..."it" being rush, or sorority membership/Greek life itself.

The plain fact of the matter is, not everyone is cut out to be Greek - some people not at certain schools, and some people not at all. But in a college culture where calling a building a "dormitory" instead of a "residence hall" apparently hurts the building's feelings, it's par for the course.

[MaryPoppins]

ROFLOL

Originally Posted by 33girl

The plain fact of the matter is, not everyone is cut out to be Greek - some people not at certain schools, and some people not at all. But in a college culture where calling a building a "dormitory" instead of a "residence hall" apparently hurts the building's feelings, it's par for the course.

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Ask the 1990s. It's their fault. LOL.

I think it's a misguided attempt by women who have been out of college for FAR too long to attract different kinds of women than the ones who have traditionally been members and stop their orgs being tagged as the "snobby old-girl network." Not that attracting different kinds of women is misguided at all, but making them think it's going to be easy peasy lemon squeezy is..."it" being rush, or sorority membership/Greek life itself.

Sorry but this indicated to me that you don't like the term "mutual selection" nor RFM...

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Titchou

Sorry but this indicated to me that you don't like the term "mutual selection" nor RFM...

No, I like RFM very much. Sororities who invite back women they have no intention of pledging just to say WE GOT MORE FULL PARTIES THAN ANYONE ELSE are poopyheads.

As to "mutual selection," while it is true to a point, in the same way as suicide vs. intentional single preference and rush vs. recruitment, it pretties up what is happening a little too much. Justgowithit summed it up perfectly:

Originally Posted by justgo_withit

I think the problem is that often PNMs get the impression that mutual selection = equal selection

That Seventeen article on rush from eons ago put it in a better way - i.e. letting you know that you are checking the groups out, but somehow making it clear that you were not in charge, but not making it mean. That's the kind of thing that you can't do in a "mutual selection" sound bite.

[Titchou]

I'm not sure how you desenters would want "mutual selection" to work. In any type of selection process, someone has to make the first selection...even in the jungle! That's a requirement. In NPC, we say the chapters make the first choice because it's their "house" and their organization. They have the right to determine who comes into that circle. The PNMs decide which invitations they would like to accept. And the process goes on. Just because Susie Snowflake has been led to believe that she will always be selected for everything because daddy's little darling is so special and unique that "no" has never been said to her and never will doesn't mean that we (the members) are a bunch of out of step mean *itches. We didn't all get asked to the prom. Someone gets left out. Some don't belong in the first place. That doesn't mean they have no self worth. The only place we are all special is with God. It doesn't extend to everything else.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by Titchou

I'm not sure how you desenters would want "mutual selection" to work. In any type of selection process, someone has to make the first selection...even in the jungle! That's a requirement. In NPC, we say the chapters make the first choice because it's their "house" and their organization. They have the right to determine who comes into that circle. The PNMs decide which invitations they would like to accept. And the process goes on. Just because Susie Snowflake has been led to believe that she will always be selected for everything because daddy's little darling is so special and unique that "no" has never been said to her and never will doesn't mean that we (the members) are a bunch of out of step mean *itches. We didn't all get asked to the prom. Someone gets left out. Some don't belong in the first place. That doesn't mean they have no self worth. The only place we are all special is with God. It doesn't extend to everything else.

Am I the only one who's completely confused at where this is coming from?

[DrPhil]

lane swerve/

I do not know where some NPC discussions come from. I keep reading certain threads about letters of recommendation and mutual selection and saying to myself "I feel slow as hell...what is the point of contention." I'm sure some non-NPHCers feel that way about NPHC discussions.

/lane swerve

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

lane swerve/

I do not know where some NPC discussions come from. I keep reading certain threads about letters of recommendation and mutual selection and saying to myself "I feel slow as hell...what is the point of contention." I'm sure some non-NPHCers feel that way about NPHC discussions.

/lane swerve

I'm totally with you. The problem comes when people think they can make a system designed to fit a region work in a place it isn't used or think they can make a system suddenly stop using them. They have their place. Since Towson was the bone of contention in this thread, I'll explain the difficulties trying to suddenly require women to come up with recs when they have no idea what they are. Most women who go through recruitment in the south are locals to their respective schools. At Towson, MD, a large proportion are from Long Island and other New York locations. It is cheaper to go to school at Towson. Since these recs are for OUR benefit, getting these women to get recommendations is not realistic when they have never done them before. Our alumnae in MD have no idea what recommendations are (I personally had to do any recs for students heading down to Bama and Ole Miss requesting recs from our alum chapter when I lived there.) We do have an alumnae chapter in Long Island, but considering that New York schools don't require recs either, the likelihood is that those women are not likely to go out of their way to take time from their busy schedules to hunt down the GPAs for women attending college in a different state. And...they couldn't get those GPAs without permission of the women going through recruitment anyway so the whole point is moot. Recs are a mostly southern thing. I am from the south and from a chapter from the south that used recs so I'm fully aware of them. You just can't shove a square peg in a round hole.