Girlie AGDee's College Search Thread

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

Not really thousands of dollars, the app fee for (example) Harvard = $75. If all 10 of your schools fall into that range, it's only $750. I'd imagine that depending on the school, it's not even that high. My state school's app fee is only $40. If you're applying to all state type schools, your total app fee costs are like $400-500.

Grad/med/law app fees are a different story lol.

That's just the application fee though. There is a fee for every school you send SAT scores to, and ACT score fees, and CSS Profile fees. I easily spent well over $1000. The only free app she did was for Wellesley.

Financial aid packages for DePaul and American came in today. I don't know if we can swing American. They seem to think I can spend 1/3 of my income out of pocket and, well, I can't. And that was after enough in loans that she'd be about $80K in debt when she graduates. DePaul's was a little bit better.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by southbymidwest

Yup. Nowadays, not only are colleges looking at rate of acceptance, they are also looking at yields using some pretty clever algorithms. In other words, they want to show that they are some degree of selective (Oh look, we are tougher to get into than you thought, this makes us a hot and more desired school!) along with yields of those kids who are accepted (Oh look, we have an acceptance rate of 34%, and our yield is 97%-practically everyone we accept ends up coming to school here, yay us, we ARE a hot and desired school, US News will now give us a shout out!). So if the school figures that they might be a safety school for you, and they have a snowball's chance in hell to get you, according to the algorithm, they might not accept you, even if your credentials are quite a bit better than the average (Dude/dudette! You can do better than us! You're just toying with us! Bah!). Throw in KDCat's selection process "take the applications for the qualified kids and throw them down the stairs. The ones that land on the third step from the bottom get accepted" and yeah, no wonder kids are applying 8, 10, 12 places. Our high school counselor recommended seven at an absolute, absolute minimum.

Innnnnteresting....Do most public schools publish their standards, though? I know that Illinois pretty much said "if your rank is this, and your ACT score is this, you will be accepted". So, if Illinois was your safety school, and you had the numbers they said you should, you didn't need 3 safeties.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Innnnnteresting....Do most public schools publish their standards, though? I know that Illinois pretty much said "if your rank is this, and your ACT score is this, you will be accepted". So, if Illinois was your safety school, and you had the numbers they said you should, you didn't need 3 safeties.

Unless you need to be able to compare financial aid packages.

[gebbie]

Hey AGDee!

I have only skimmed through this post, so if somebody has already suggested this, don't mind me! Has your she looked into Emory at all? I know it is in the south, but it is a spectacular place and boasts an incredible program for what she seems to be interested in. It might be worth a bit of research.
Honestly, my best advice to you and your daughter is to go with what feels right.

Good luck! Don't stress!

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by gebbie

Hey AGDee!

I have only skimmed through this post, so if somebody has already suggested this, don't mind me! Has your she looked into Emory at all? I know it is in the south, but it is a spectacular place and boasts an incredible program for what she seems to be interested in. It might be worth a bit of research.
Honestly, my best advice to you and your daughter is to go with what feels right.

Good luck! Don't stress!

She did lots and lots of research, but at this point, it is too late to apply anywhere else. She has options. Personally, I wish she would see what a gem U of M really is, especially since it's so much cheaper than the others. I will be glad when the next week is over and we know who has accepted her for sure.

[southbymidwest]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Innnnnteresting....Do most public schools publish their standards, though? I know that Illinois pretty much said "if your rank is this, and your ACT score is this, you will be accepted". So, if Illinois was your safety school, and you had the numbers they said you should, you didn't need 3 safeties.

Not that I am aware of anymore- they will publish 25%-75% ACT/SAT spreads, GPA averages for the current freshman class, etc., but you can never be sure until you get the notification that you are in. In this day and age, especially with the larger, nationally recognized state universities, there are more kids with the right numbers than there are seats for them at the schools. Schools also want a diversified student body, so that also is taken into account. That can mean ethnicity/demographics/sex, but also where the kids reside within/outside the state, and niche interests (i.e.," I have a passion for studying jellyfish, and have done so since I was in 4th grade").

Ahh, found the term I was looking for regarding a university trying to figure out if they are of importance to an applicant-they look for "demonstrated interest" in the form of visits, requests for information, discussions with admissions officers, etc. They track this stuff. Read it in a "Chronicle of Higher Education" article a few years back, was also echoed by daughter's high school counselor.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Unless you need to be able to compare financial aid packages.

Got it. I guess the days of the state school being the cheapest option by default are long gone.

Originally Posted by southbymidwest

Not that I am aware of anymore- they will publish 25%-75% ACT/SAT spreads, GPA averages for the current freshman class, etc., but you can never be sure until you get the notification that you are in. In this day and age, especially with the larger, nationally recognized state universities, there are more kids with the right numbers than there are seats for them at the schools. Schools also want a diversified student body, so that also is taken into account.

Illinois used to just open up more seats, so they never turned away qualified applicants. My freshman year, this meant that there were people living in the study lounges because there were more freshmen than anticipated.

UT guarantees admission to anyone in the top 10% of their graduating class, so I guess those students have a load off.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Got it. I guess the days of the state school being the cheapest option by default are long gone.

Pretty much. Obviously it's cheaper for in-state kids, but one of the factors in why I didn't apply to Berkeley as school #5 was that, after all was said and done it would have ended up being more expensive than Brown or Emory.

I think the high amount of applications is more of a coastal thing--kids in DC, NYC, Boston, LA, and SF are in a super-competitive pool and they have to cast a wider net. Like I said, in 1998 I applied to 4 schools. In 2008, I interviewed kids who applied to 14. I was in a smaller school district and had an excellent state school to fall back on. The kids I interviewed? Not so much.

[southbymidwest]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

My freshman year, this meant that there were people living in the study lounges because there were more freshmen than anticipated.
.

That can still happen if the yield is higher than anticipated-makes college administrators' hair turn grey. It is a less than ideal situation, and just plain upsetting all around.

[DubaiSis]

Yes, Munchkin, I think the applications thing is geographic and also societal. In the city where I grew up (think largish suburb, but no adjacent urb) we had very good public schools, and everyone who went to college went to one of the Iowa schools, or to one of the good Catholic schools fairly nearby, Notre Dame and Marquette. I bet there weren't 10 applications total out of the 380 in my graduating class to any of the schools listed in this thread. Some certainly would have been able to get into those schools (it wasn't completely uncommon for a kid to have a perfect ACT score), but it just never occurred to most of us. Perfectly acceptable, close by and relatively affordable was pretty much what we thought, and between 3 big state schools, pretty much every major would have been covered.

I think this whole process would be really exciting but soooo anxiety-inducing.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by southbymidwest

Not that I am aware of anymore- they will publish 25%-75% ACT/SAT spreads, GPA averages for the current freshman class, etc., but you can never be sure until you get the notification that you are in.

Ahh, found the term I was looking for regarding a university trying to figure out if they are of importance to an applicant-they look for "demonstrated interest" in the form of visits, requests for information, discussions with admissions officers, etc. They track this stuff. Read it in a "Chronicle of Higher Education" article a few years back, was also echoed by daughter's high school counselor.

Yes, and this may be why she was waitlisted at Wellesley. She decided, last minute, to apply there.. no visit, no demonstrated interest ahead of time. One of her best friends since kindergarten will be swimming for them and she the application was free. When she scratched U Chicago off of her list, she added Wellesley. She is hoping that this will be the difference with Barnard since she went there for their Young Women's Leadership Institute last summer.

Originally Posted by DubaiSis

I think this whole process would be really exciting but soooo anxiety-inducing.

It is.. both, totally.

College confidential's Northwestern board was going nuts last night because Northwestern didn't publish results on the 4th Thursday of the month for the first time in 4 years. These kids are going insane over these decisions.

The Barnard board is going crazy too. Some people have called the admissions office and were told that decisions were being mailed yesterday or today. Others called and were told late next week. However, international students receive an email and they haven't gotten their emails yet, so decisions have likely not been mailed yet. For the past 7 years, accepted students get a large express mail envelope. Rejected get a regular envelope, not express.

I am regretting that I didn't push hypoallergenic to apply to some of the state schools where she would have gotten free ride tuition scholarships. I'm trying to let her follow her dreams, but perhaps I didn't push for some more practical options too. More safeties would have been a good idea. She considered "target" schools to be safeties and the rest are definitely "reach" schools.

[Sciencewoman]

Originally Posted by AGDee

She is hoping that this will be the difference with Barnard since she went there for their Young Women's Leadership Institute last summer.

It is.. both, totally.

College confidential's Northwestern board was going nuts last night because Northwestern didn't publish results on the 4th Thursday of the month for the first time in 4 years. These kids are going insane over these decisions.

The Barnard board is going crazy too. Some people have called the admissions office and were told that decisions were being mailed yesterday or today. Others called and were told late next week. However, international students receive an email and they haven't gotten their emails yet, so decisions have likely not been mailed yet. For the past 7 years, accepted students get a large express mail envelope. Rejected get a regular envelope, not express.

I am regretting that I didn't push hypoallergenic to apply to some of the state schools where she would have gotten free ride tuition scholarships. I'm trying to let her follow her dreams, but perhaps I didn't push for some more practical options too. More safeties would have been a good idea. She considered "target" schools to be safeties and the rest are definitely "reach" schools.

I think attending the institute at Barnard has to help. My daughter attended summer programs at Northwestern for 3 years and took on-line classes there for another 3. If she gets in there, I'm thinking that this would be a factor. She did get a special invitation to apply, which was obviously sent to the kids who are in the summer program's database. I heard from our NU chapter president that they do track visits/calls, etc. there...another sister works in the admissions office and this is what she said. On the other hand, the Georgetown rep. told us they do not track visits, because that would discriminate against students who cannot afford the travel expense of making college visits. I've heard/read this about some other schools, as well. I'm taking some of this with a grain of salt...I think you'd have to get a more serious look if you show demonstrated interest and they know you'd really love to attend if you got in (as opposed to padding your application list with this school just to be on the safe side).

My daughter applied to one definite safety state school with a great Honors program...where nice merit was an additional lure, one target flagship state school (virtually no aid), and 5 private schools that range in the 6%-30% acceptance range. Of those, she's accepted to the state schools, received early action deferred decision from one private school, and is in with a full ride at another. The rest she is waiting on. I'm predicting that she'll get into 2 that are left, and not the other 2. It was amazing to me, though, that the deferred school and the full-ride school have the exact same admissions stats and very similar "rankings"...one obviously loved her and the other deferred her. I will say that the one that loved her is one she loves back, and they knew it. It really is a great fit, and that came through in her application, interviews, etc. Everything just seemed to go great at every stage. Last night an admission rep. called to talk to her and see if she had any additional questions.

I do think she's going to end up where she was meant to. I think your daughter will, too. Sometimes this whole process feels like a crap shoot, and sometimes it feels like these admissions officers know what they're doing and they can tell who would bit a good fit, likely accept, etc. Too late, I found out that a number of flagship, OOS schools offer big merit scholarships, unlike the Michigan flagship schools. If I had known that, I might have encouraged her to apply to some of those. But I don't know if any of them would have actually appealed to her, so it might have been a waste of time anyway. I just don't think I can second guess any more.

I am thinking about you and your daughter. The NU boards blow-up is really an indication of how much stress these kids are under when they put themselves out there and await judgment from the highly selective schools. I think your daughter is brave, and I think there are many valuable life lessons to have learned throughout this process...interviewing skills, reaching for challenges, setting goals, handling rejection, etc. I say good for our daughters for taking on a challenge, knowing there would be some rejection, because the process does involve taking risks. They deserve a pat on the back for putting themselves out there at this tender age.

[LAblondeGPhi]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

Illinois used to just open up more seats, so they never turned away qualified applicants. My freshman year, this meant that there were people living in the study lounges because there were more freshmen than anticipated.

This happened my freshman year at UCLA, too. But I think it was because they were behind schedule on building one of the newer dorm buildings. I didn't even realize we had a large study lounge until the six boys living there moved out spring quarter.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

Pretty much. Obviously it's cheaper for in-state kids, but one of the factors in why I didn't apply to Berkeley as school #5 was that, after all was said and done it would have ended up being more expensive than Brown or Emory.

True. The out-of-state tuition + room/board at my alma mater = same tuition as any number of private schools. Although I think a lot of state schools around here give in-state tuition to kids from neighboring states (PA, WV, etc.) to try and pull kids from other states.

[PeppyGPhiB]

Originally Posted by AGDee

She did lots and lots of research, but at this point, it is too late to apply anywhere else. She has options. Personally, I wish she would see what a gem U of M really is, especially since it's so much cheaper than the others. I will be glad when the next week is over and we know who has accepted her for sure.

My husband loved his time at Michigan. He still talks about how smart, but well-rounded, the students were. Filled with intellectuals.

As someone who attended a very expensive private university, if your daughter was sitting in front of me I would tell her to seriously reconsider it unless the school gives her a very generous GRANT package. I got good financial aid from my university, but it was only half grants. The loan debt is stifling for the first 10 years after you graduate, which is the time in her career when she will be making the least amount of money. And that was for a loan debt significantly lower than it sounds like she would responsible for. When she's paying $500-$600/month for student loans, it's going to make it hard for her to even move out of your house! That's how a lot of young people get themselves into major credit card debt - it's the only way they can afford to live.