Domestic Violence

[Kevin]

As someone who primarily practices in the family law arena, needless to say, I deal with the results of abuse for a living. It's difficult to discuss the concept in such general terms as is being attempted here as domestic abuse like a lot of human behavior is very nuanced and it is difficult to generalize.

In my experience, when there's abuse, it often goes both ways. I sometimes have a hard time finding a victim, sometimes it's really easy to find the victim. Sometimes, it's two a-holes who deserve each other.

[amIblue?]

Originally Posted by Kevin

As someone who primarily practices in the family law arena, needless to say, I deal with the results of abuse for a living. It's difficult to discuss the concept in such general terms as is being attempted here as domestic abuse like a lot of human behavior is very nuanced and it is difficult to generalize.

In my experience, when there's abuse, it often goes both ways. I sometimes have a hard time finding a victim, sometimes it's really easy to find the victim. Sometimes, it's two a-holes who deserve each other.

So, in the case of two assholes who deserve each other, abuse is OK?

[GammaPhi88]

Originally Posted by amIblue?

So, in the case of two assholes who deserve each other, abuse is OK?

I don't think that is exactly what Kevin is saying. I think (and Kevin, correct me if I'm wrong), that while the abuse is never okay, it's sometimes hard to find the victim because abuse is so rampant on both sides.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by GammaPhi88

I don't think that is exactly what Kevin is saying. I think (and Kevin, correct me if I'm wrong), that while the abuse is never okay, it's sometimes hard to find the victim because abuse is so rampant on both sides.

That was what I gathered from it. Sometimes there's not just ONE victim and one person perpetrating the abuse. Sometimes, both people end up in both roles at different times because it happens so often.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by GammaPhi88

I don't think that is exactly what Kevin is saying. I think (and Kevin, correct me if I'm wrong), that while the abuse is never okay, it's sometimes hard to find the victim because abuse is so rampant on both sides.

Absolutely. I don't condone it, and as others have observed, ultimately things like when they had sex, who said what/did what to whom become relevant. Dealing with these issues is often very personal, and like I said, it's often the case that both parties are in the wrong.

And it's those cases where both parties are in the wrong that I find the law (at least in Oklahoma) doesn't seem to have an adequate remedy. Often, it's the first person to talk to the police or the first person to get to the courthouse to file for a victim's protection order (VPO) (think restraining order for a victim of domestic violence).

In Oklahoma, the standard for awarding a VPO is pretty low, just that there has been domestic violence, stalking, harassment, dropping off of items at the victim's home, etc. And to go along with that, in the divorce arena, if the court finds there's domestic violence (and it often does in a he-said/she-said context), then there's an automatic presumption that the complaining party should get custody of the child. It's a great way to gain a leg up in a custody proceeding and is abused all the time.

On the civil end, I've both prosecuted and defended these actions and in the majority of the cases, I think the statute is being misused and that there should be a more adequate remedy. Treating one party as the "victim" and the other as aggressor, which is usually a distinction based on gender, is often a wholly inadequate means to tackle this issue in the courtroom context.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Kevin

It's difficult to discuss the concept in such general terms as is being attempted here as domestic abuse like a lot of human behavior is very nuanced and it is difficult to generalize.

It actually is not difficult to discuss the concept in general terms and it is not difficut to generalize. Across millions of domestic violence cases, there are similarities. Generalizations are not intended to apply 100% and even the differences are similar to other differences.

For instance:

Originally Posted by Kevin

In my experience, when there's abuse, it often goes both ways. I sometimes have a hard time finding a victim, sometimes it's really easy to find the victim.

This is an accurate observation and generalization that has also been addressed in research.