"Taking someone else's spot"

[Titchou]

For the last time, the rule says "MAY" not will. So if a campus is forcing women who do not attend a party because they simply don't want to, the AA should be told. I'm not saying she's going to do anything. I'm just saying she should be made aware because she may not know and may need to investigate what's going on. If she says she knows and has blessed it because X, Y and z, then fine. At least she knows.

Good grief, ladies!

[SWTXBelle]

I'm also tired of posters acting as if recruitment has not been improved. It has, it will continue to be, and to act as though recruitment is the same as rush was a 100 years ago indicates a real lack of knowledge as to what modern recruitment is. We hear from many of those for whom recruitment did not work because those for whom it did are BUSY WITH THEIR SISTERS - not to mention the human tendency for people to complain when things go wrong, and not acknowledge when things go well. Look at the numbers - the vast majority of pnms WILL find a home and WILL have a positive Greek experience.

eta - As far as I know, Titchou, collegiate panhellenics have to submit their recruitment rules to the area panhellenic adviser, so she would already be aware of the requirement to attend all parties. Please correct me if my experience is not true of every campus.

[AOII Angel]

I have to tell you, I just sat through a testimonial from a sister last night who was telling her chapter sisters not to discount girls who may have been disinterested early in the process. She didn't want us and cried when she got her bid, but in her own words, "I fell in love with all these wonderful women and I wouldn't have it any other way." She'd have been robbed of sisterhood and a wonderful experience without this system.

[SWTXBelle]

MEMBERSHIP selection is mutual - the chapter has to want the pnm; the pnm has to want the chapter. The chapter indicates they want a pnm by including her on their bid list(s) and inviting her to pref; a pnm indicates she wants a chapter by listing it (them) on her bid card. If she doesn't want a chapter she simply need not put it on her card - she runs a risk of not being placed at all. If a chapter doesn't want a pnm it will not invite her to pref.

PARTY selection is not mutual - all chapters have to invite all pnms to the first round; sometimes pnms have to go to all the parties to which they are invited. I don't see having to sit through a party for an hour at a chapter you might think you are not interested in as some horrible, awful torture pnms are forced to endure.

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

MEMBERSHIP selection is mutual - the chapter has to want the pnm; the pnm has to want the chapter. The chapter indicates they want a pnm by including her on their bid list(s) and inviting her to pref; a pnm indicates she wants a chapter by listing it (them) on her bid card. If she doesn't want a chapter she simply need not put it on her card - she runs a risk of not being placed at all. If a chapter doesn't want a pnm it will not invite her to pref.

PARTY selection is not mutual - all chapters have to invite all pnms to the first round; sometimes pnms have to go to all the parties to which they are invited. I don't see having to sit through a party for an hour at a chapter you might think you are not interested in as some horrible, awful torture pnms are forced to endure.

This....and since "we" are the organization which "owns" the thing the PNM wants and we can "give" it away, we should get to choose to whom we give it. If not then we could all be members of one or more groups. Hey, let's belong to all of them! Then it's not so special any longer...

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

MEMBERSHIP selection is mutual - the chapter has to want the pnm; the pnm has to want the chapter. The chapter indicates they want a pnm by including her on their bid list(s) and inviting her to pref; a pnm indicates she wants a chapter by listing it (them) on her bid card. If she doesn't want a chapter she simply need not put it on her card - she runs a risk of not being placed at all. If a chapter doesn't want a pnm it will not invite her to pref.

PARTY selection is not mutual - all chapters have to invite all pnms to the first round; sometimes pnms have to go to all the parties to which they are invited. I don't see having to sit through a party for an hour at a chapter you might think you are not interested in as some horrible, awful torture pnms are forced to endure.

Thank you, you have said this so well!

I did some math in another thread showing how a lower quota often helps a small chapter. If that small chapter wanted to release a ton of women to make quota artificially low, everyone else on campus would be outraged. The same is true when a PNM wants to skip parties. RFM requires everyone to play the game properly on both sides.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

PARTY selection is not mutual - all chapters have to invite all pnms to the first round; sometimes pnms have to go to all the parties to which they are invited. I don't see having to sit through a party for an hour at a chapter you might think you are not interested in as some horrible, awful torture pnms are forced to endure.

Exactly. Yes, the sorority members (or the PNMs, for that matter) might not be "your style" but for the love of all that's holy, you are going to have to learn to converse and be polite with people who are "not your style" at some point in your life. If you think every community meeting and work situation is going to be filled with people who are just like you who you'll be blabbing away intimately with in 2.5 seconds, you're in for a very rude awakening.

If the worst thing that happens to you ever is that you have to spend 20 minutes at a party with a girl who has nothing to say, your life is pretty easy peasy. To say that PNMs shouldn't have to go through it is just making the "entitlement generation" even worse.

[Titchou]

Originally Posted by 33girl

If the worst thing that happens to you ever is that you have to spend 20 minutes at a party with a girl who has nothing to say, your life is pretty easy peasy. To say that PNMs shouldn't have to go through it is just making the "entitlement generation" even worse.

Amen!

[AnchorAlumna]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

I'm also tired of posters acting as if recruitment has not been improved.

I think it has indeed improved. The RFM system has been a godsend to smaller chapters and has built up the entire system where it has been used.
A few years before my rush (which was 1,055 years ago), the practice was for rushees to be invited to half the sororities for first round. You didn't even get to look at all the groups to begin with, and they didn't get a look at you.
The "open house" rounds where rushees visited every sorority was revolutionary at the time.

[DubaiSis]

I think a person cannot argue with the fact that a LOT more girls are getting placed in chapters these days than before RFM was in place. No, it's not perfect and I think NPC would love to hear of a logical, fair, easy to incorporate system that allows more women to be placed in more chapters on as many campuses as possible, and with less heartache. It is no one's goal to leave any girls out in the cold, but the sorting hat only exists at Hogwarts, and short of that, there is going to be exclusion, top and bottom chapters and girls most and least desired by a lot of the chapters. It's just the way it is, and in the meantime a goal should be to be as nice as possible to all hosts and all guests. And that means, among other things, attending all parties to which you were invited. Unfortunately, you do sometimes have to dictate courtesy to people who don't know better. So you have free will vs. combatting teenagers who have not yet been trained in the social graces. What do you do?

[Titchou]

When I went thru in 1963 we all went to every house the first day. So anything less was before my time. And I had a very perfect rush...and am very lucky that I did. I don't know personally what it's like to not get invited back to a chapter. Many girls were in that boat with me however. And I'm the one who made the final selection. Back then at my school, you picked which pref you went to first and which second. By doing so, you indicated which group was tops with you at that point in time. If you went to the last pref, they were your top choice. I rather like that but have no idea how you would do it with 1400 PNMs! Rather tough to manage I would think.

[Titchou]

While I realize that some campuses do this, that does not alter the fact that NPC says "may". therefore, I would still make sure the AA had blessed it. There are far too many places where peopletry to act outside the rules. Am dealing with something that would make your hair curl right now. So I would err on the side of informing the AA....now what exactly is wrong with that????

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Titchou

While I realize that some campuses do this, that does not alter the fact that NPC says "may". therefore, I would still make sure the AA had blessed it. There are far too many places where peopletry to act outside the rules. Am dealing with something that would make your hair curl right now. So I would err on the side of informing the AA....now what exactly is wrong with that????

The fact that you used four question marks for one question and four periods for an ellipses?

It's not outside the rules, so why would people notify anyone? Again this is like telling people as a general rule to notify the AA that there are silence rules on campus, or that this campus has prohibited skits. I'm just saying that when you make a really blanket statement like that you're creating the potential for AAs to be overwhelmed by calls about something that isn't a problem, hypothetically speaking.

Particularly since it just appears to be a rule you're not familiar with and despite others telling you it's no big deal and happens frequently you're still insisting that "we" should notify someone.

You're asking "Why not?" without actually answering our "Why?" with anything other than "I don't know this rule."

ETA: I have to laugh at my hair curling due to a recruitment issue. I sincerely doubt that.

ETA Again: Ok seriously, what do you think the word "may" means except that this is a potential consequence? Again, these are sample rules and I even linked you a circumstance where one campus says "WILL" and others say "May result in you being cut." In your world do you say "May" and actually mean "Will not?"

[DGTess]

Drolefille wrote:

Originally Posted by DGTess
As I said, some have so kindly* reminded me I didn't go through the type of formal rush that some, or most, schools now use.

You're really passive aggressive, did you know that?

And?
Quote:
I know I don't have a say; that's what happens in any representative form of government.
This isn't government.

It's the chosen form of governance for the 26 NPC groups.

Quote:
So you have your opinion, and I have mine. I'll not silence mine.
Get off the cross, build a bridge and get over it.
Seriously stop with the martyrdom.

Don't like it? Don't read. I respect your right to your opinion; that's all I can do. There's an ignore option.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DGTess

And?

It's immature as hell.

Don't like it? Don't read. I respect your right to your opinion; that's all I can do. There's an ignore option.

Please do complain about how kindly* people are treating you again.

The point.





Your head.