Scarlett O'Hara's Dresses In Need Of Repair

[DrPhil]

Drolefille is wise well beyond her years.

[Alumiyum]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Heh, I rarely manage to say things nicely, it seems. But it's kind of like the thread about what TV show you'd like to live in. All those past time periods really sucked for women, and when they got better for white women they still sucked for non-white women and men. Not that things are peachy keen now, but I really can't think of any other time period I'd actually want to live in and romanticizing it, whether through a movie or a TV show ignores a lot of the real issues.

With GWTW, and the romanticizing of the Old South, it pretends that everyone (usually just the person writing) was white, rich, and lived the life of luxury on a plantation sipping lemonade on the porch and going to society events. That was the experience of a tiny tiny number of people and it happened on the backs and pain of far too many to ignore.

A bit much for a GwtW thread? Maybe. But the movie's tied up in this selective memory all the way through.

Were I one of my ancestors I'd be at best popping out babies on a tiny family farm, picking lice out of my one dress every night, and plowing the field every morning while the menfolk were shooting each other on the battlefield. No one we know of was sipping lemonade in our family tree. But it's a movie that a lot of people grew up on, and it's nice to watch. I still enjoy watching it, as long as I get my bathroom break. Almost any movie about a period in history is selective...I know when I watch a movie about the middle ages where the characters are chivalrous and beautiful that in reality everyone smelled like rotting road kill and women were essentially livestock. I still enjoy the movie. *Shrug*.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

Were I one of my ancestors I'd be at best popping out babies on a tiny family farm, picking lice out of my one dress every night, and plowing the field every morning while the menfolk were shooting each other on the battlefield. No one we know of was sipping lemonade in our family tree. But it's a movie that a lot of people grew up on, and it's nice to watch. I still enjoy watching it, as long as I get my bathroom break. Almost any movie about a period in history is selective...I know when I watch a movie about the middle ages where the characters are chivalrous and beautiful that in reality everyone smelled like rotting road kill and women were essentially livestock. I still enjoy the movie. *Shrug*.

It's totally cool to enjoy the movie, I'm not saying not to. And to be able to watch it without the history filling your head all at the same time. I only get bothered when people go around romanticizing the era itself, often around here at least based on the movie or similar media.

But for me, it's inseparable.It's like the arrow in the FedEx logo. Not everyone sees it, but because I do see it, I cannot un-see.

[DrPhil]

[Alumiyum]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

It's totally cool to enjoy the movie, I'm not saying not to. And to be able to watch it without the history filling your head all at the same time. I only get bothered when people go around romanticizing the era itself, often around here at least based on the movie or similar media.

But for me, it's inseparable.It's like the arrow in the FedEx logo. Not everyone sees it, but because I do see it, I cannot un-see.

Hopefully everyone remembers their basic history classes (you'd think they would, anyway), but being able to enjoy movies/historical fiction/etc. is a nice way to escape.

No area in history including our own is devoid of immoral practices and social injustice.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Dammit, you ruined it for everyone!

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

Hopefully everyone remembers their basic history classes (you'd think they would, anyway), but being able to enjoy movies/historical fiction/etc. is a nice way to escape.

No area in history including our own is devoid of immoral practices and social injustice.

Exactly. I enjoyed Avatar for example, but when I think about it, I acknowledge all the problems with it. But I still thought the movie was pretty and entertaining.

A lot of people don't sit back and think (and that's ok, I guess) but then some romanticize it and talk about how awesome X is and that's when I, personally, object. I'd hope they would too, but you'd be surprised what our history classes leave out, or you wouldn't. My Virginia friends learned a different version of the civil war than I did, for example.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

Hopefully everyone remembers their basic history classes (you'd think they would, anyway)....

That isn't covered in many history classes especially many history classes in the South.

[Alumiyum]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

Dammit, you ruined it for everyone!


Exactly. I enjoyed Avatar for example, but when I think about it, I acknowledge all the problems with it. But I still thought the movie was pretty and entertaining.

A lot of people don't sit back and think (and that's ok, I guess) but then some romanticize it and talk about how awesome X is and that's when I, personally, object. I'd hope they would too, but you'd be surprised what our history classes leave out, or you wouldn't. My Virginia friends learned a different version of the civil war than I did, for example.

The point of a movie, to me, is to sit back and not think. Some people prefer thought provoking films and some prefer escapism. Both are ok, it's just personal preference.

I grew up in Alabama and don't feel I got an abridged version of the war. I'm personally fond of reading historical non fiction, but I prefer my movies to be very fictional.

[Alumiyum]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

That isn't covered in many history classes especially many history classes in the South.

Are you from the south?

I haven't met anyone yet that thinks all white people in the 1800's were drinking lemonade on the porch of their large plantation home.

[DrPhil]

It's all based on our frame of reference. There is nothing about GWTW that doesn't make me think. Everything about it is based on the history of the era. It isn't a love story that was created so viewers can only see the love.

Two of my fav movies are The Color Purple and Imitation of Life. I watch them all of the time. But, I am fully aware of what I'm seeing and it sets the context for everything that I find humorous, entertaining, and sad about these movies.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

The point of a movie, to me, is to sit back and not think. Some people prefer thought provoking films and some prefer escapism. Both are ok, it's just personal preference.

I grew up in Alabama and don't feel I got an abridged version of the war. I'm personally fond of reading historical non fiction, but I prefer my movies to be very fictional.

You're missing my point. You (General) don't have to think during the movie. Some people do think during the movie and it affects their enjoyment of it. Neither are necessarily better people than the other. You think before you open your mouth about how awesome it would be if we all lived like Scarlett O'Hara. (General You)

The point isn't whether you personally were educated, I'm not saying you weren't. (individual you) The point is that not everyone is educated, nor bothers to correct what they were mis-taught. (Or even knows they were mis-taught.) Who discovered America? You know how many answers there are to that one question? But more often kids are taught it's Columbus, end of story.

Anyway, not trying to hijack this further. I don't want to get into "what really happened" and was just trying to express my reasoning for disliking the movie.

[Alumiyum]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

You're missing my point. You (General) don't have to think during the movie. Some people do think during the movie and it affects their enjoyment of it. Neither are necessarily better people than the other. You think before you open your mouth about how awesome it would be if we all lived like Scarlett O'Hara. (General You)

The point isn't whether you personally were educated, I'm not saying you weren't. (individual you) The point is that not everyone is educated, nor bothers to correct what they were mis-taught. (Or even knows they were mis-taught.) Who discovered America? You know how many answers there are to that one question? But more often kids are taught it's Columbus, end of story.

Anyway, not trying to hijack this further. I don't want to get into "what really happened" and was just trying to express my reasoning for disliking the movie.

Understood, I was just predicting it would turn into a north vs. south thing when it comes to education, and I've never bought that. (What I do buy is good school vs. bad school.)

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

Are you from the south?

Yes.

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

I haven't met anyone yet that thinks all white people in the 1800's were drinking lemonade on the porch of their large plantation home.

I have.

That extends to people who don't know the history behind "redneck." These things are not taught in many schools and that includes the predominantly Black schools. Children are taught what the school districts want them to learn and that varies based on the area. My siblings and I learned most of the things that we learned because both of our parents are educators who believed that learning is what happens before kids leave for school and after the kids get back home.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

Are you from the south?

I haven't met anyone yet that thinks all white people in the 1800's were drinking lemonade on the porch of their large plantation home.

I was being facetious. But plenty of people kind of ... forget... about poor people or minorities or how hard it was to be a woman during those time periods in favor of the mental image that is in their heads.

It's a bit like people who idealize the pioneer days when MEN WERE MEN and we killed our own food and claimed our own land.*

(*And women died in childbirth and families died from all sorts of things and we killed other people to take their land and cut all the trees down which reduced the ability of the soil to stay put in droughts, etc.)

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

Understood, I was just predicting it would turn into a north vs. south thing when it comes to education, and I've never bought that.

Did your prediction come true?