Arizona governor signs immigration bill

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by Alumiyum

I'm white, but am asked very frequently if I am Hispanic or part Hispanic. (As far as we know we're Scotch-Irish, but no one's bothered to research family history, so I probably got all the genes from some ancestor who very well might have been Hispanic, but it was past great-great grandparents.) I'm willing to bet I'd get stopped, and I'm certainly more likely to than a "lily-white blonde".

I agree with the concept, I just don't agree with how this is probably going to play out. And I certainly don't carry a birth certificate or ssn card. I feel like if this were done right, it could be productive. But it would be naive to think this isn't going to result in racial profiling. (Or in carding anyone with an accent).

Exactly. The whole problem is not what it would do to illegal immigrants but what it would do to legal immigrants and American citizens. If you are really interested in cutting into the problem, there has got to be a way to tackle the problem without the real potential of discriminating against a minority population that has done nothing wrong.

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by agzg

Common misconception. CBP employees (especially those who patrol the spaces between points of entry) typically go through a Federal background investigation which can usually be done electronically - it's a more in-depth credit/criminal history check.

CBP employees do not deal with the type of information that would require a security clearance to have. ICE employees do, especially because they've been tasked with aiding the FBI in the monitoring of foreign-born terrorist suspects (This is why I say that ICE and CBP do not really enforce the same laws).

About the airports - that may be true, but CBP (especially the patrol) is less concerned with legitimate points of entry than they are with the spaces between. Generally, the spaces between are land-based. If you get stopped in an airport, it's a Customs and Border Protection agent. If you're getting stopped on land, away from a legitimate point of entry, it's Customs and Border patrol personnel (also part of CBP). Which is who we're talking about in this thread, mostly. My mistake for not clarifying.

I'm going to have to still disagree on you in regards to the background investigation requirements. How did you come upon this "knowledge", are you an employee of CBP? The thing you aren't pointing out is that CBP is the parent org to several seperatly operating agencies, OFO and USBP being two of them. All of the agencies Have their own requirements and standards, so lumping everything into "CBP" doesn't work.

BTW- I've never heard a USBP Agent referred to as a Customs and Border Patrol Agent.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by PiKA2001

I'm going to have to still disagree on you in regards to the background investigation requirements. How did you come upon this "knowledge", are you an employee of CBP? The thing you aren't pointing out is that CBP is the parent org to several seperatly operating agencies, OFO and USBP being two of them. All of the agencies Have their own requirements and standards, so lumping everything into "CBP" doesn't work.

BTW- I've never heard a USBP Agent referred to as a Customs and Border Patrol Agent.

My source is USAjobs.gov. You can go ahead and look if you like, I already have and the overwhelming majority of jobs within CBP posted do not require a security clearance. Obviously jobs that are not posted for the public are different, but I've already covered that by saying things like "most often CBP employees do not need" and "most often ICE employees do need." And yes, I have personal experience with the security clearance process and hiring requirements of varying agencies, many of which are tasked to monitor and enforce immigration policy and law. All of the information that I've posted is open source, however.

Are you an employee of the CBP?

I've obviously made generalizations (Border Patrol Agent) because most people don't know the differing agencies involved in DHS or its immigration regulatory arms. I can start using the proper acronymns if you like, but I have a feeling then the conversation will be just you and I. Not that it makes a difference.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by agzg

My source is USAjobs.gov. You can go ahead and look if you like, I already have and the overwhelming majority of jobs within CBP posted do not require a security clearance requirement. And yes, I have personal experience with the security clearance process with varying agencies. All of the information that I've posted is open source, however.

Are you an employee of the CBP?

I've obviously made generalizations (Border Patrol Agent) because most people don't know the differing agencies involved in DHS or its immigration regulatory arms. I can start using the proper acronymns if you like, but I have a feeling then the conversation will be just you and I. Not that it makes a difference.

Challunge!

With so much drama in the CBP
It's kinda hard being PiKA2001 and agzg
So I, somehow, someway
Keep coming up with funky ass debates like every single day

I guess I got the answer to my border patrol question. LOL.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Challunge!

With so much drama in the CBP
It's kinda hard being PiKA2001 and agzg
So I, somehow, someway
Keep coming up with funky ass debates like every single day

I guess I got the answer to my border patrol question. LOL.

LOL.

My original point is the same - from what I can tell, this law is pretty redundant with the added bonus of being pre-disposed to perpetuate racial profiling.

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by agzg

My source is USAjobs.gov. You can go ahead and look if you like, I already have and the overwhelming majority of jobs within CBP posted do not require a security clearance. Obviously jobs that are not posted for the public are different, but I've already covered that by saying things like "most often CBP employees do not need" and "most often ICE employees do need." And yes, I have personal experience with the security clearance process and hiring requirements of varying agencies, many of which are tasked to monitor and enforce immigration policy and law. All of the information that I've posted is open source, however.

I think we are looking at seperate sides of the spectrum. I'm thinking more of the enforcement arm ( in the field) of CBP and I think you are looking at the support specialist (office job) arm. I suppose someone who works in IT or accounting wouldn't need an extensive background check as opposed to someone with a gun and arrest authority, possibility of being bribed.

[PiKA2001]

I could go for a gin and juice this weekend... Make it an arnold Palmer with tanquary

[agzg]

Originally Posted by PiKA2001

I think we are looking at seperate sides of the spectrum. I'm thinking more of the enforcement arm ( in the field) of CBP and I think you are looking at the support specialist (office job) arm. I suppose someone who works in IT or accounting wouldn't need an extensive background check as opposed to someone with a gun and arrest authority, possibility of being bribed.

No, I'm looking at the law enforcement arm (as that is what I have the most experience with). I think you're looking at the higher level (investigative) jobs while I'm looking at the patrolling groups - which have similar training to local law enforcement and therefore have similar background investigations.

They don't typically have Security Clearances (Confidential, Classified, Secret, Top Secret, etc.).

A thorough background investigation does not equal a Security Clearance.

People will office jobs are actually MORE likely to need a Security Clearance.

ICE agents (who are actively practicing law enforcement) are more likely to need a security clearance than Customs and Border PATROL (who are actively practicing law enforcment).

[DaemonSeid]

Not to be outdone in the loonacy department, Texas rep. Leo Berman calls Obama God's Punishment on us all.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Not to be outdone in the loonacy department, Texas rep. Leo Berman calls Obama God's Punishment on us all.

Oh Lawd help us!

[Ghostwriter]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

I think you're right. Maybe he'll come back and confirm.

Don't know about Kevlar but to clear up any questions, my Father was Seminole and my Mother's side was Dutch/Irish/French. My point is that I could easily be mistaken for an illegal and if I was stopped, so what.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Ghostwriter

My point is that I could easily be mistaken for an illegal and if I was stopped, so what.

Other than the possible unconstitutionality of it?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by Ghostwriter

Don't know about Kevlar but to clear up any questions, my Father was Seminole and my Mother's side was Dutch/Irish/French. My point is that I could easily be mistaken for an illegal and if I was stopped, so what.

Then you have a party.

[VandalSquirrel]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

Calls for boycott follow Ariz. immigration law

San Francisco officials say they will propose not doing business with state

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36791991...new_york_times

No Lake Havasu this year!

[PeppyGPhiB]

Forget the Mexicans...I want to know when Washington is going to do something about those dirty, white Canadians! They buy our cheap gas and take up all the parking at the premium outlet mall on the indian reservation!