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04-25-2010, 03:36 PM
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I'm not calling the child a wrong, I'm calling the act that lead to the conception of the child as a "wrong"
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04-25-2010, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinniBug
I'm not calling the child a wrong, I'm calling the act that lead to the conception of the child as a "wrong"
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Exactly.
Whereas I see the child as part of the wrongful act, and should be recified accordingly.
Listen, I won't knock your right to believing in God's intent in bringing life into His earth, but mathematically, the Lord has roughly 600 more times over the next 50ish years to bring life via this young girl. I'd hope that the Lord will not want to bring another life into this suffering.
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Do you know people? Have you interacted with them? Because this is pretty standard no-brainer stuff. -33girl
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04-25-2010, 04:43 PM
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So, y'all are saying that it is OK to abort the pregnancy because, "welp, the pregnancy and labor are going to suck for this girl so lets just murder the baby so she doesn't have to suffer." You can't justify murder. The girl's body will heal. The baby will bless an adoptive family. The girl will heal from giving birth. But will her heart heal from murdering her baby?
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the sun will always shine, our love will never end
as long as we are sisters, we'll always be true friends
alpha sigma alpha is always the one
wherever there is fun, there's ALWAYS ALPHA SIGMA!
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04-25-2010, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinniBug
So, y'all are saying that it is OK to abort the pregnancy because, "welp, the pregnancy and labor are going to suck for this girl so lets just murder the baby so she doesn't have to suffer." You can't justify murder. The girl's body will heal. The baby will bless an adoptive family. The girl will heal from giving birth. But will her heart heal from murdering her baby?
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I'm not only concerned with the effects of labor on the 10 year old but the potential of a child being born and raised without the proper care and attention needed. We should be setting children up for success, and being born out of rape/incest, out of wedlock/to an unfit mother with its custodial care TBD doesn't exactly do that. It surely doesn't sit well with me.
Agai, difference of opinion, but this is not murder, "the unlawful killing of another human being without justification or excuse." Abortion is lawful and this situation, in my opinion, is very justified.
You use a lot of strong language in your defense-probably reflective of your strong faith. You can have that. This girl's heart won't heal any faster from "murdering her little baby" than from being forced upon by an adult she shouldve been able to trust. You really think her heart will heal just the same from giving birth to "her little baby" then have it taken away for someone else's possession?
Children can't even handle when you take their toys away for a short period. Take a child away from a 10 year old after 9 months and see how that goes.
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Do you know people? Have you interacted with them? Because this is pretty standard no-brainer stuff. -33girl
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04-25-2010, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinniBug
You can't justify murder
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I understand what you are saying, but not everyone considers it murder. I'm against abortion for myself, but who am I to tell someone else they can't?
Furthermore, you don't know whether this child will 'heal', either physically or psychologically...abortion or not.
It's a crappy situation all-around.
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04-25-2010, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinniBug
So, y'all are saying that it is OK to abort the pregnancy because, "welp, the pregnancy and labor are going to suck for this girl so lets just murder the baby so she doesn't have to suffer." You can't justify murder. The girl's body will heal. The baby will bless an adoptive family. The girl will heal from giving birth. But will her heart heal from murdering her baby?
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And what you are saying is that a 10 year old being raped by her stepfather resulting in a pregnancy is a "gift from God?" Please tell me that your version of God would have some compassion for this poor girl.
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04-25-2010, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AOII Angel
And what you are saying is that a 10 year old being raped by her stepfather resulting in a pregnancy is a "gift from God?" Please tell me that your version of God would have some compassion for this poor girl.
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I think every life is a gift from God.
If you had been conceived as the result of a rape, I would say that you would still be a gift from Him.
__________________
the sun will always shine, our love will never end
as long as we are sisters, we'll always be true friends
alpha sigma alpha is always the one
wherever there is fun, there's ALWAYS ALPHA SIGMA!
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04-25-2010, 05:57 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,733
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinniBug
I think every life is a gift from God.
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That ideology, along with notions of "muder," is part of what sparked the debate over when does life begin many years ago.
We obviously disagree on when life begins, especially when it is unwanted.
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04-25-2010, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinniBug
So, y'all are saying that it is OK to abort the pregnancy for any reason
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Fixed that for you. And that's EXACTLY what I'm saying.
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04-25-2010, 06:59 PM
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GreekChat Member
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Michigan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WinniBug
So, y'all are saying that it is OK to abort the pregnancy because, "welp, the pregnancy and labor are going to suck for this girl so lets just murder the baby so she doesn't have to suffer." You can't justify murder. The girl's body will heal. The baby will bless an adoptive family. The girl will heal from giving birth. But will her heart heal from murdering her baby?
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The girl's body may NOT heal. The girl could die in child birth. The child is not fully developed and therefore could retain permanent damage from having a child.
For those saying that it is "common" for children to have babies at this age in other cultures, I beg to differ. The average age of menarche is 12 in the US and slightly lower in some other countries, but higher in most (as high as 17 in China). It really isn't biologically possible for it to be "common", although "more accepted" may be true.
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04-25-2010, 07:19 PM
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I'm not an expert on the laws of Mexico, let alone incest laws anywhere, but in many places, it does include relatives who are not blood related, specifically step relatives. Regardless this is child abuse/rape.
If this is a gift from God, I wish that there could be a replacement gift of a miscarriage that leaves this little girl's body healthy so she can receive a new gift later when in a loving and stable relationship. Yeah, I'm blashmephous, and I own it.
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04-26-2010, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by christiangirl
That's really sad. There are so many horrifying circumstances that can happen before/during our lives that therapy can't heal. It is ALWAYS tragic and heartbreaking. Yet somehow, we do heal (to the best of our ability) and most learn to survive, some of us even find it in ourselves to thrive. We can spout these statements here, but I doubt any of you walk up to any one of these incredibly resilient survivors, look into his or her eyes and say "it would have been better if you hadn't been born."
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I'm just saying that I would wish I hadn't been born if I found out I were the product of incest. Of course I wouldn't walk up to someone, look them in the eyes, and say that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by WinniBug
But will her heart heal from murdering her baby?
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Who says it would be wounded in the first place? I truly believe any guilt associated with abortion is because anti-choice people say people who have had (an) abortion(s) should feel guilty. I don't think she would feel the guilt if people didn't try to make her feel guilty.
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04-26-2010, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by violetpretty
I'm just saying that I would wish I hadn't been born if I found out I were the product of incest. Of course I wouldn't walk up to someone, look them in the eyes, and say that.
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That's different. You said "Imagine if you had been," which does not imply that you were talking about yourself. In any case, I'm sorry, I misunderstood you.
hijack
Those terms pro-life and pro-choice are stupid. A person being pro-life does not mean they are anti-choice anymore than someone pro-choice is anti-life. Under that guise, the terms may as well be "pro-oppression" and "pro-murder," which is how both sides have come to treat each other.
/hijack
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04-26-2010, 07:45 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Nov 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by christiangirl
Those terms pro-life and pro-choice are stupid. A person being pro-life does not mean they are anti-choice anymore than someone pro-choice is anti-life. Under that guise, the terms may as well be "pro-oppression" and "pro-murder," which is how both sides have come to treat each other.
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That's why I said "pro-abortion." 
When it comes to pregnancy, I believe that people have a right to control what's happening to their body to the best of their ability and they DON'T have to justify it to anyone as long as they are terminating the pregnancy during a legal period. That's related to when I think "life" and "gifts from God" begin and its variance based on whether it's wanted or unwanted.
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04-26-2010, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrPhil
That's why I said "pro-abortion." |
LOL I don't like that term either but you were, indeed, excluded from the rant, doc.
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"We have letters. You have dreams." ~Senusret I
"My dreams have become letters." ~christiangirl
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