Alabama Recruitment

[Nacre]

Originally Posted by KSUViolet06

Do you feel that the Bama Panhellenic does a good job of communicating to PNMs that THEY need to be securing recs?

I know that there are sometimes issues with some SEC schools continuing to perpetuate the myth that "it's the CHAPTER'S JOB to get recs for PNMs."

Note: not saying that the chapters NEVER do this, but the sororities generally aren't going to do it.

I also know that there's a resolution stating that they HAVE TO say that, but I really think that that needs to be changed.

My daughter was in this boat. She quit rush this year after her one preference party. She felt like it wasn't right for her.

She has a 3.5 GPA, good activities and was a competitive dancer on a national level. Her down side - she is from out-of-state and doesn't know a single person at Bama. We had a very hard time getting recs.

In April, she went to an LSU Panhellenic tea. She was told the group couldn't write her recs because she was going to an out-of-state school. So we asked friends, teachers and neighbors. (Hours of work!!!) I was told by everyone I asked that it is the Chapter's responsibility to secure recs for the PNMs. I was informed over and over that if a house likes a girl and they don't have a rec of file, during rush they will put the girl in a room to meet an alumna. The alumna will interview the girl and then write a rec. Impression is that this is the best way to get a rec. Most friends and neighbors felt like it was a waste of time to write her one.

I'm a Kappa and this spring's issue of The Key had an article about membership. The article stressed that it is the Kappa's responsibility to secure a reference of a girl. Foolish me, I figured Kappa's philosophy was probably the norm.

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by Nacre

My daughter was in this boat. She quit rush this year after her one preference party. She felt like it wasn't right for her.

In April, she went to an LSU Panhellenic tea. She was told the group couldn't write her recs because she was going to an out-of-state school. So we asked friends, teachers and neighbors. (Hours of work!!!) I was told by everyone I asked that it is the Chapter's responsibility to secure recs for the PNMs. I was informed over and over that if a house likes a girl and they don't have a rec of file, during rush they will put the girl in a room to meet an alumna. The alumna will interview the girl and then write a rec. Impression is that this is the best way to get a rec. Most friends and neighbors felt like it was a waste of time to write her one.

I'm a Kappa and this spring's issue of The Key had an article about membership. The article stressed that it is the Kappa's responsibility to secure a reference of a girl. Foolish me, I figured Kappa's philosophy was probably the norm.

See, and that's unfortunate. Also, that "put in a room with alumnae" scenario sounds a bit farfetched.

Also, I'm not saying that they will NEVER secure a rec for a PNM, but it doesn't happen alot. There are too many PNMs for them to do it.

I'm sorry things didn't work out, but perhaps she should have continued with recruitment and given her one chapter a chance? I mean, she did still have one option...

[DoctorD]

Originally Posted by Nacre

My daughter was in this boat. She quit rush this year after her one preference party. She felt like it wasn't right for her.

She has a 3.5 GPA, good activities and was a competitive dancer on a national level. Her down side - she is from out-of-state and doesn't know a single person at Bama. We had a very hard time getting recs.

In April, she went to an LSU Panhellenic tea. She was told the group couldn't write her recs because she was going to an out-of-state school. So we asked friends, teachers and neighbors. (Hours of work!!!) I was told by everyone I asked that it is the Chapter's responsibility to secure recs for the PNMs. I was informed over and over that if a house likes a girl and they don't have a rec of file, during rush they will put the girl in a room to meet an alumna. The alumna will interview the girl and then write a rec. Impression is that this is the best way to get a rec. Most friends and neighbors felt like it was a waste of time to write her one.

I'm a Kappa and this spring's issue of The Key had an article about membership. The article stressed that it is the Kappa's responsibility to secure a reference of a girl. Foolish me, I figured Kappa's philosophy was probably the norm.

FWIW, I can speak to what my home chapter does that is obvious to anyone who is an alum - I can't speak for what they do during recruitment (and, fwiw, this is at another SEC school). Prior to recruitment, all alums that they have email address for are sent a list of women going through recruitment so that if anyone knows anyone, they can submit a recommendation.

If one thinks about the sheer volume of women going through recruitment at these flagship state schools, plus the work that the collegiate women go through putting on recruitment.... the work that goes into securing recommendations has to go elsewhere. I think that many NPC groups have the same stance as what you say with Kappa above, but when push comes to shove - this is a much easier task for a collegiate chapter when there are 150 women or less going through recruitment compared to 1200+.

And with the way recruitment is structured, what is most important in my mind is that the PNMs are meeting current collegiate women, not alumnae. I can't imagine the scenario you suggested above being the case where PNMs are put in a room with alumnae to get the recommendation. But that's just me.

I personally have never had that experience with an alumnae panhellenic group - I seem to remember that the group I was affiliated with when I lived south of Atlanta wrote recs for lots of women who were going to lots of schools, not just those in state. GPhBLtColonel can speak to that better than I.

Hugs to you and your daughter.

[catfan]

I've been following this tread since the beginning, and am wondering if Alabama Panhellenic is really telling the PNMs what the process is truly like. Grades, alumni recs, and friends in houses do play a part in the bid process, but sounds like luck has as much a part. My daughter plans on attending Bama as an oos student next year and is a DG and AGD legacy. Other family members are KD, KAT, DZ, DDD, so recs aren't an issue for most houses. Although none of us attended Alabama. She would prefer to wait until her sophomore year to rush, but that might not be a good idea at Bama. Looks like upperclass women don't have as great an opportunity. I'm starting to worry about the OOS issue, she too doesn't know anyone at Bama.

[Zillini]

Please forgive me if this comes across as snippy, but I get a bit frustrated by the continual claims that it's all Panhellenic's fault for not educating PNMs. Now granted there are a lot campuses that do not do a good job and keep giving out bad info year after year, but IMO UA's Panhellenic has been doing a very good job of trying to inform PNMs about the process or at least getting the info out there. It is up to the PNMs to look for the information and attend the different functions where information is available.

I also get frustrated by PNMs and/or parents who rely on information from an alumna who graduated 10-20 years ago and hasn't been active helping with Recruitment since. Or worse, those who attended other schools who think they know how Bama or for that matter how any other campus Recruitment operates. Times change. NPC Rules have changed. I/natl policies have changed. Campus Panhellenic policies change. Numbers of women participating in Recruitment change (higher or lower) which forces structural changes. Chapter policies change. Competitive standings change. Need I go on?

I assume most HS seniors researched the different colleges before deciding where to apply to and/or attend. I assume they did not rely on word of mouth about how competitve the school admissions process was or whether it provided a quality education. Why don't more PNMs research Recruitment?

Just to prove my point, please check out the UA Greek Life Webpage about sorority recruitment. On the right hand side you will find additional links to webpages and Powerpoint presentations with loads of information including:

- "Sorority Life at the Capstone" presentation featured at Bama Boundthat includes 17 pages of info

- Parent's Presentation featured at Panhellenic Preview Weekend with 29 pages of info

- Information regarding letters of recommendation with a link to a separate webpage that includes info and links to all the I/natl sorority websites and NPC's Alumnae Panhellenic list

- 2009 Sorority Recruitment Guide (aka Rush Book) with tons of info

In addition, the Alabama Panhellenic Association has its own website loaded with info.

Spring Panhellenic Preview Weekend is probably the most informative pre-recruitment time. Not only are there general overview presentations, but also each sorority has a table with representatives to answer questions. Also there are tours of all the Chapter houses with members present to answer questions and meet pre-PNMs there as well. On top of that, Chapters have Meet 'n Greet type functions on the Friday evening beforehand, though they do require an invitation.

As for the continual claims that out-of-state PNMs have little chance of getting a bid at UA, well we don't have stats yet for this year however according to PowerPoint from this past Bama Bound (aka Freshmen orientation) presentation:

In 2008 over 50% of the fraternity and sorority new members were from out-of-state.

/rant

[Txborn]

I just want to say out of state girls can and do get good rushes and pledged good houses. My daughter from Texas - and her friend from her school both rushed a couple of years ago. She and I worked hard to have both recs and letters for each sorority. I even went online to the national website for a sorority we don't really have in Texas and got someone from this area to write her a rec. Before she started, I encouraged her to keep an open mind and look around. Every round she had the houses she wanted to go back to and pledged what people consider a good house. Her friend did as well.

She did have a friend who did not do as well, but she did not have all the recs and really concentrated on one house. BIG MISTAKE. I know this year there were a lot of Texas girls and I heard that alot had great rushes.

[Wipledale]

I am going to chime in as well...My daughter is Gamma Phi and rushed last year. We came to preview weekend in April of last year and we did our homework, basically from asking alot of questions of the parents of the ONLY person my daughter knew who is Alpha Chi...Trust me, we asked tons of questions and really studied the web site(s). She secured recs and they were from all different sororities. She also was a legacy in Gamma Phi, which we did not realized until she questioned her great grandmother! Now mind you, her grandmother did not write a rec (she is 96), so the only place that was mentioned was on the questionnaire she filled out. I remember last year during rush how hard it was...knowing only one person at Bama and being out of state...She stuck with it and after bid day on Sunday (thinking she did not get the one she was supposed to be in) she absolutely fell in love with her sisters, a sorority who stuck with her until the very end....That is how the system is supposed to work..I cannot tell you how many times our friend emphasized that to us before Rush...my daughter found that out the Sunday night after rush.....you just can't drop out or quit just because you came in contact with a few of the reps from the sorority...
If you trust the system it will work....

[kk_bama]

Originally Posted by Wipledale

I am going to chime in as well...My daughter is Gamma Phi and rushed last year. We came to preview weekend in April of last year and we did our homework, basically from asking alot of questions of the parents of the ONLY person my daughter knew who is Alpha Chi...Trust me, we asked tons of questions and really studied the web site(s). She secured recs and they were from all different sororities. She also was a legacy in Gamma Phi, which we did not realized until she questioned her great grandmother! Now mind you, her grandmother did not write a rec (she is 96), so the only place that was mentioned was on the questionnaire she filled out. I remember last year during rush how hard it was...knowing only one person at Bama and being out of state...She stuck with it and after bid day on Sunday (thinking she did not get the one she was supposed to be in) she absolutely fell in love with her sisters, a sorority who stuck with her until the very end....That is how the system is supposed to work..I cannot tell you how many times our friend emphasized that to us before Rush...my daughter found that out the Sunday night after rush.....you just can't drop out or quit just because you came in contact with a few of the reps from the sorority...
If you trust the system it will work....

This is so right. Being open-minded is really the key. Wipledale, I'm so glad your daughter is having a great time. She looked beautiful this week by the way!

That's so funny that she did not know she was a leg until she asked her great-grandmother!

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by Zillini

Please forgive me if this comes across as snippy, but I get a bit frustrated by the continual claims that it's all Panhellenic's fault for not educating PNMs. Now granted there are a lot campuses that do not do a good job and keep giving out bad info year after year, but IMO UA's Panhellenic has been doing a very good job of trying to inform PNMs about the process or at least getting the info out there. It is up to the PNMs to look for the information and attend the different functions where information is available.

I also get frustrated by PNMs and/or parents who rely on information from an alumna who graduated 10-20 years ago and hasn't been active helping with Recruitment since. Or worse, those who attended other schools who think they know how Bama or for that matter how any other campus Recruitment operates. Times change. NPC Rules have changed. I/natl policies have changed. Campus Panhellenic policies change. Numbers of women participating in Recruitment change (higher or lower) which forces structural changes. Chapter policies change. Competitive standings change. Need I go on?

I assume most HS seniors researched the different colleges before deciding where to apply to and/or attend. I assume they did not rely on word of mouth about how competitve the school admissions process was or whether it provided a quality education. Why don't more PNMs research Recruitment?

Just to prove my point, please check out the UA Greek Life Webpage about sorority recruitment. On the right hand side you will find additional links to webpages and Powerpoint presentations with loads of information including:

- "Sorority Life at the Capstone" presentation featured at Bama Boundthat includes 17 pages of info

- Parent's Presentation featured at Panhellenic Preview Weekend with 29 pages of info

- Information regarding letters of recommendation with a link to a separate webpage that includes info and links to all the I/natl sorority websites and NPC's Alumnae Panhellenic list

- 2009 Sorority Recruitment Guide (aka Rush Book) with tons of info

In addition, the Alabama Panhellenic Association has its own website loaded with info.

Spring Panhellenic Preview Weekend is probably the most informative pre-recruitment time. Not only are there general overview presentations, but also each sorority has a table with representatives to answer questions. Also there are tours of all the Chapter houses with members present to answer questions and meet pre-PNMs there as well. On top of that, Chapters have Meet 'n Greet type functions on the Friday evening beforehand, though they do require an invitation.

As for the continual claims that out-of-state PNMs have little chance of getting a bid at UA, well we don't have stats yet for this year however according to PowerPoint from this past Bama Bound (aka Freshmen orientation) presentation:

/rant

I think feeling that if you'd had more information, things would have worked out differently is a way for super-type-A-achievers to feel in control of what just happened to them or their daughters. It certainly comes off as criticism or blaming the wrong people, but if you're facing the darkest, and likely completely irrational, fear that your rejection was the inevitable outcome of your own defects or faults, (or your daughter's defects or faults), blaming panhellenic seems like a swell idea.

What more could Alabama do systematically? Nothing.

Don't let it bother you.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by catfan

She would prefer to wait until her sophomore year to rush, but that might not be a good idea at Bama. Looks like upperclass women don't have as great an opportunity. I'm starting to worry about the OOS issue, she too doesn't know anyone at Bama.

No. This is a v. v. bad idea. As much as I hate saying this, she should rush as a freshman. Start getting her name out to alumnae now - and I believe there are pre-rush events that she can attend.

[catfan]

Originally Posted by 33girl

No. This is a v. v. bad idea. As much as I hate saying this, she should rush as a freshman. Start getting her name out to alumnae now - and I believe there are pre-rush events that she can attend.

33 girl, My daughter was also interested in auditioning for color guard, and band camp is the same time as rush. That is why she thought Sophomore year might be a good time for recruitment. Is it possible to be in band and a GLO?

[33girl]

Originally Posted by catfan

33 girl, My daughter was also interested in auditioning for color guard, and band camp is the same time as rush. That is why she thought Sophomore year might be a good time for recruitment. Is it possible to be in band and a GLO?

I'm not from Bama - just have learned over time on GC that anyone going there who wants to rush has a better chance if they're a first semester freshman. Deferring to someone from there who knows more about the band issue.

And yeah, as OTW said, if she has band camp one year, she'll have it every year, no matter when she rushes. That does sound like both groups are pretty much saying "pick one."

[KSUViolet06]

At Bama, I think most would say that your BEST chance at recruitment is freshman year.

[catfan]

Thanks for your help. She has a few months to decide which route to take before spring events. I already know alumae in all but 3 GLOs, so we can get the recs for most. Also as she is a DG legacy, she could always take a shot at the colony if DG does decide to recolonize in 2011 or beyond. Looks like Alpha Phi was successful in colonizing, and hopefully DG will be as well.

[Loyally Kappa]

I think that when you're hearing "it is the Chapter's responsibility to secure recs for the PNMs" that it means that under no circumstance is the chapter to invite a girl to the last round of pref parties UNLESS they have a rec from a Panhellenic alum. I think this is the norm for other sororities too.

Case in point. I used to teach at a small, rural school where very few of the girls went to college, much less through sorority rush. About ten years ago, on a Thursday in August, a alum friend (Chi O) called me late at night to ask me about a girl I had taught when she was in 7th grade! They liked her and apparently had no rec. She was a great girl from a nice family. I think the point is that no one will be offered a bid at some sororites with absolutely no alum rec at all.

But I may be wrong.

Personally, I was proactive with my girls years ago. When each of them was entering 9th grade (high school) I told her that I could not personally get her in a sorority, that they had to be nice, keep their grades up and impress the alum local ladies.

Originally Posted by Nacre

My daughter was in this boat. She quit rush this year after her one preference party. She felt like it wasn't right for her.

She has a 3.5 GPA, good activities and was a competitive dancer on a national level. Her down side - she is from out-of-state and doesn't know a single person at Bama. We had a very hard time getting recs.

In April, she went to an LSU Panhellenic tea. She was told the group couldn't write her recs because she was going to an out-of-state school. So we asked friends, teachers and neighbors. (Hours of work!!!) I was told by everyone I asked that it is the Chapter's responsibility to secure recs for the PNMs. I was informed over and over that if a house likes a girl and they don't have a rec of file, during rush they will put the girl in a room to meet an alumna. The alumna will interview the girl and then write a rec. Impression is that this is the best way to get a rec. Most friends and neighbors felt like it was a waste of time to write her one.

I'm a Kappa and this spring's issue of The Key had an article about membership. The article stressed that it is the Kappa's responsibility to secure a reference of a girl. Foolish me, I figured Kappa's philosophy was probably the norm.