oh DAYUM!!! Bush almost got clocked by a SHOE

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

They beat him until he cried, according to the news reports.

That's really unfortunate. I think the fact that this man was beaten like this (assuming that's a fact) shows how little progress we've made vis-a-vis changing Iraqi culture. I'm hoping this isn't a "meet the new boss, same as the old boss" sort of situation developing over there, but I fear it is.

4,000+ American lives and countless Iraqi lives have been spent and we still have a government which beats people before affording them a trial or any sort of due process. I don't care what side of the partisan divide you come down on, but that is complete bullshit.

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by Kevin

That's really unfortunate. I think the fact that this man was beaten like this (assuming that's a fact) shows how little progress we've made vis-a-vis changing Iraqi culture. I'm hoping this isn't a "meet the new boss, same as the old boss" sort of situation developing over there, but I fear it is.

4,000+ American lives and countless Iraqi lives have been spent and we still have a government which beats people before affording them a trial or any sort of due process. I don't care what side of the partisan divide you come down on, but that is complete bullshit.

I agree with this statement 99.9999% of the time... but put yourself in their (the security force's) shoes. Your one job is to ensure the safety of the two men at the podium and somebody gets up and begins throwing things at them while yelling. What would your reaction be? I'm not sure that I wouldn't have shot the guy if I thought for a second that the President's life was in danger.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

I agree with this statement 99.9999% of the time... but put yourself in their (the security force's) shoes. Your one job is to ensure the safety of the two men at the podium and somebody gets up and begins throwing things at them while yelling. What would your reaction be? I'm not sure that I wouldn't have shot the guy if I thought for a second that the President's life was in danger.

If they thought for a second that the President's life was in danger, they would have been within their rights to shoot the man. Since they didn't do that, they didn't think he was that much of a threat anymore.

There is no possible justification for that sort of beating, IMHO.

I'll bet that under Islamic Law, (Iraq is some sort of quasi-civil/quasi-Islamic legal system, right?) there will be some sort of awful punishment for this man. Let him have his trial, then let justice be done.

[DolphinChicaDDD]

Originally Posted by Kevin

I'll bet that under Islamic Law, (Iraq is some sort of quasi-civil/quasi-Islamic legal system, right?) there will be some sort of awful punishment for this man. Let him have his trial, then let justice be done.

Sharia Law is what you are probably thinking about. It covers pretty much everything, so I'm sure there is something in there about assaulting world leaders. And if there isn't, I'm sure there will be a meeting of a group of scholars who will debate and determine an appropriate outcome. And usually, that outcome is not a very nice one.

Just to bring it up, I'm not sure if anyone on here realizes the seriousness of shoes, particularly throwing them, in Islamic cultures. Shoes, and feet in general, are considered dirty and distasteful particularly the soles. Based on that fact alone, I am sure he will be punished accordingly.

[nittanyalum]

Originally Posted by DolphinChicaDDD

Just to bring it up, I'm not sure if anyone on here realizes the seriousness of shoes, particularly throwing them, in Islamic cultures. Shoes, and feet in general, are considered dirty and distasteful particularly the soles. Based on that fact alone, I am sure he will be punished accordingly.

This and the 'dog' comment -- dogs are also considered unclean so the combination of throwing the shoes and calling him a dog were serious insults. And from what I've read, sentiment is pretty split, there are as many people holding rallies in his honor and calling for his release as there are saying it was embarrassing and he should apologize, so it will be interesting to see how he's dealt with.

[epchick]

Originally Posted by DolphinChicaDDD

Just to bring it up, I'm not sure if anyone on here realizes the seriousness of shoes, particularly throwing them, in Islamic cultures. Shoes, and feet in general, are considered dirty and distasteful particularly the soles. Based on that fact alone, I am sure he will be punished accordingly.

Yes! I was gonna post something about that. It is offensive to an Arab if you show them the soles of your feet/shoes (like if you cross your legs or what not). I can just imagine how much more offensive it is to throw a shoe.

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by Kevin

If they thought for a second that the President's life was in danger, they would have been within their rights to shoot the man. Since they didn't do that, they didn't think he was that much of a threat anymore.

There is no possible justification for that sort of beating, IMHO.

I'll bet that under Islamic Law, (Iraq is some sort of quasi-civil/quasi-Islamic legal system, right?) there will be some sort of awful punishment for this man. Let him have his trial, then let justice be done.

If an American did this to another world leader then I think that they would be put in jail for a pretty long time.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

If an American did this to another world leader then I think that they would be put in jail for a pretty long time.

Can you say "Singapore caning"?

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

If an American did this to another world leader then I think that they would be put in jail for a pretty long time.

But probably not worked over by the police.

-- unless the incident happened in New York or L.A., in which case, may God have mercy on his soul.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by nittanyalum

Yeah, I'll admit that my husband and I had a quick giggle as he dodged the second shoe after we gasped after the first one was launched, but we both sobered up about it quickly. Regardless of who is in office, when the President is out of country visiting other nations he *IS* the US. So as Americans, we should feel some protective reaction about anybody taking a pot shot at our Commander in Chief. Again, regardless of the man in the seat, that's the US Presidency. Its like that old adage about how I can bitch and moan all I want about my family but don't you dare say something against them because they're MY family.

Pretty much matches our reactions as well.

And yeah, DS, you're certainly free to have an opinion. That doesn't mean the rest of us have to act like it's a reasonable opinion when it isn't.