McCain's Black Relatives

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

No. Very few people owned slaves...

According to this data: http://www.civil-war.net/census.asp?census=Total

8% did.

Furthermore, what does it matter whether or not his family owned slaves? He's not his ancestors. No one is.

Edit: I know my ancestors did, the German side came over in the late 1880's and the English side were Quakers (vehemently opposed to slavery)

I don't care what the percentage is...I am still stuck on the fact that millions were hauled here in the first place and God only knows how many died from those shores to these shores...this is why I even hate discussing this type of stuff because it's always someone trying to minimalize the impact that the Slave trade had...I don't care if it was 1% ...there are still issues that have gone on for 400+ years we still haven't resolved yet.

For instance....James Byrd wasn't that long ago and THIS just happened again in TEXAS

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...0,977683.story

Some behaviors just won't die...just people.

[KSigkid]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

I don't care what the percentage is...I am still stuck on the fact that millions were hauled here in the first place and God only knows how many died from those shores to these shores...this is why I even hate discussing this type of stuff because it's always someone trying to minimalize the impact that the Slave trade had...I don't care if it was 1% ...there are still issues that have gone on for 400+ years we still haven't resolved yet.

For instance....James Byrd wasn't that long ago and THIS just happened again in TEXAS

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...0,977683.story

Some behaviors just won't die...just people.

I don't know that anyone here is trying to minimalize the effect of the slave trade. Even the people who say that a low percentage of whites owned slaves would admit (I would hope) that some of these whites owned large numbers of slaves. Plus, 8% is still 8% too many...

Racism is still rampant today, absolutely. When I was asking my questions, I wasn't making a judgment on the slavery, or excusing anyone's conduct, I was asking it more as a general question about whether the actions of a person's ancestors would affect the perception of that person today.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by KSigkid

I was asking it more as a general question about whether the actions of a person's ancestors would affect the perception of that person today.

This is off-topic, but I was reading an article a few weeks ago about how the great-niece of Heimrich Himmler fell in love with an Israeli Jew who lost family in the Holocaust. She waited for almost a year to tell her BF who her family was; eventually their marriage couldn't survive the various problems something like that brings up. We're obviously a few more generations removed from slavery than the Holocaust, but I thought I'd just throw that out there.

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by Munchkin03

This is off-topic, but I was reading an article a few weeks ago about how the great-niece of Heimrich Himmler fell in love with an Israeli Jew who lost family in the Holocaust. She waited for almost a year to tell her BF who her family was; eventually their marriage couldn't survive the various problems something like that brings up. We're obviously a few more generations removed from slavery than the Holocaust, but I thought I'd just throw that out there.

Thank you for bringing this up. African Americans aren't the only ones in the world who have been tortured and killed, but you don't see these other races and nationalities constantly up in arms that someone somewhere owes them something.

And we should remember, many people in this country came here after in the 1900s. They didn't own slaves.

[Phrozen1ne]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

Thank you for bringing this up. African Americans aren't the only ones in the world who have been tortured and killed, but you don't see these other races and nationalities constantly up in arms that someone somewhere owes them something.

And we should remember, many people in this country came here after in the 1900s. They didn't own slaves.

Whoa-
O.k. who the hell said someone owed them anything? I don't look for handouts. Since you want to take it there, how about SOME, not all in this country, like to sweep slavery under the rug like it is something that happened one day and ended the next. I would never compare the enslavement of African Americans to the Holocaust. One doesn't trump the other.

[XSK_Diamond]

You are so wrong on so many levels for writing this... stuff.

Nobody HERE said anything about being owed anything, first of all. Secondly, just because SOME black Americans call for reparations, and other things, doesn't mean that we ALL do! We are not the doggone Borg! We do not share a collective conscious and we do not all do ANYTHING alike.

And, for the record, YES these other ethnic groups DO speak up loudly when they feel they are being disrespected. A prime example is I never see/hear/read anyone saying the same thing about the Anti-Defamation League, or other Jewish groups, when they get their britches in a knot about something.

Freudian slips really aren't slips.

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

Thank you for bringing this up. African Americans aren't the only ones in the world who have been tortured and killed, but you don't see these other races and nationalities constantly up in arms that someone somewhere owes them something.

And we should remember, many people in this country came here after in the 1900s. They didn't own slaves.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

Thank you for bringing this up. African Americans aren't the only ones in the world who have been tortured and killed, but you don't see these other races and nationalities constantly up in arms that someone somewhere owes them something.

And we should remember, many people in this country came here after in the 1900s. They didn't own slaves.

Huh? The article, that was in this month's Marie Claire, was actually about how the relationship couldn't last because of the tension.

[Phrozen1ne]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

I don't care what the percentage is...I am still stuck on the fact that millions were hauled here in the first place and God only knows how many died from those shores to these shores...this is why I even hate discussing this type of stuff because it's always someone trying to minimalize the impact that the Slave trade had...I don't care if it was 1% ...there are still issues that have gone on for 400+ years we still haven't resolved yet.

For instance....James Byrd wasn't that long ago and THIS just happened again in TEXAS

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...0,977683.story

Some behaviors just won't die...just people.

Exactly my point DS. People.....f#$k the stats, I never stated that all whites owned slaves. To say a small percentage did is bull too. I am just not shocked if I ran into someone whose ancestors did have slaves, whether they be Black, White, American Indian, etc. I never said that made McCain or Obama a bad person. If Nat Turner was related to me, does that mean I am a bad person, no.

[Elephant Walk]

Originally Posted by Phrozen1ne

Exactly my point DS. People.....f#$k the stats, I never stated that all whites owned slaves. To say a small percentage did is bull too. I am just not shocked if I ran into someone whose ancestors did have slaves, whether they be Black, White, American Indian, etc. I never said that made McCain or Obama a bad person. If Nat Turner was related to me, does that mean I am a bad person, no.

You do realize that your very own ancestors owned slaves, correct?

Very few of the slaves were simply caught by white folks with net or something, most were enslaved by rival tribes and then sold to the white folks.

It may be your own family.

[XSK_Diamond]

Slavery has almost always existed. That cannot be disputed. But, to toss out that Africans owned slaves in an attempt to diminish the impact of American slavery is fallacious. West African slavery was not anything like American slavery. America took slavery, and the slave trade, to a level of barbarity that was unprecedented. You should do some research, because you're way off the mark on this.

Originally Posted by Elephant Walk

You do realize that your very own ancestors owned slaves, correct?

Very few of the slaves were simply caught by white folks with net or something, most were enslaved by rival tribes and then sold to the white folks.

It may be your own family.

[CrackerBarrel]

Originally Posted by XSK_Diamond

Slavery has almost always existed. That cannot be disputed. But, to toss out that Africans owned slaves in an attempt to diminish the impact of American slavery is fallacious. West African slavery was not anything like American slavery. America took slavery, and the slave trade, to a level of barbarity that was unprecedented. You should do some research, because you're way off the mark on this.

You're arguing with him about a point he isn't making. He isn't talking about African tribes owning slaves, he is saying that's how the American slaves got here. There wasn't much in the way of white slave catchers in Africa. African tribes would go to war with a neighboring tribe, and then the winner would trade the other tribe to slave-ship owners for goods.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by CrackerBarrel

You're arguing with him about a point he isn't making. He isn't talking about African tribes owning slaves, he is saying that's how the American slaves got here. There wasn't much in the way of white slave catchers in Africa. African tribes would go to war with a neighboring tribe, and then the winner would trade the other tribe to slave-ship owners for goods.

thus that is why you need to do your homework...slavery as it was known in Africa back in the olden days was nowhere near as brutal and dehumanizing as chattel slavery was in US.

In some cases, being a slave among some African tribes gave you a better lot in life than if you stayed free amongst your kinsmen.

And I state again, altho that period is over with, there is still the issue of some of the deeply seeded behavior that still exists among blacks and whites in our country.

[XSK_Diamond]

Right on!

Makes you wanna holla sometimes, doesn't it?

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

thus that is why you need to do your homework...slavery as it was known in Africa back in the olden days was nowhere near as brutal and dehumanizing as chattel slavery was in US.

In some cases, being a slave among some African tribes gave you a better lot in life than if you stayed free amongst your kinsmen.

And I state again, altho that period is over with, there is still the issue of some of the deeply seeded behavior that still exists among blacks and whites in our country.

[CrackerBarrel]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

thus that is why you need to do your homework...slavery as it was known in Africa back in the olden days was nowhere near as brutal and dehumanizing as chattel slavery was in US.

In some cases, being a slave among some African tribes gave you a better lot in life than if you stayed free amongst your kinsmen.

And I state again, altho that period is over with, there is still the issue of some of the deeply seeded behavior that still exists among blacks and whites in our country.

And now you're arguing with me about a point I wasn't making either. I don't give a rats ass what slavery in Africa was like, it doesn't change the fact that it was other Africans who sold them onto the damn boats.



Some people just don't get it. And it makes you want to holler sometimes, doesn't it.

[Phrozen1ne]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

And I state again, altho that period is over with, there is still the issue of some of the deeply seeded behavior that still exists among blacks and whites in our country.

Which is apparent in this thread.