The Right to die.

[kstar]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

How will human euthanasia be done? Like lethal injection as a capital crime punishment? Is that the "Humane way" to kill a human being? Will drug overdose be enough?

Killing a steer or pig for its meat is done humanely, yet provides decent cuts of meat. But we are NOT euthanizing humans for meat--we are basically putting a person out of their misery or cost to the healthcare system.

Maybe I just don't trust people enough to do the right thing by people without violating "humane euthanasia guidelines and actions" with agreed procedures... Maybe I have more belief in the research scientists and workers trying to cure human ailments.

Also the United States signed the Geneva Conventions which state that we just cannot euthanize people who are deemed not needed.

To me, dying is hardly EVER dignified, and mental sanity during a chronic illness inherently does not allow for a caring from a physician who actually meant their oaths. Some people would say: "NEVER AGAIN"... We, humans think we can justify killing all kinds of people, but that still does not make it right, ethical or moral for that matter.

And yes, I have seen the slow debilitation of 2 loved ones and the pain they suffered. But the finality killing someone because of ANY reason, it is just not me. That just means hospices will become slaughterhouses and I do not want my country to get involved with that fascism...

For setting up standards for human euthanasia, we should look to Belgium and the Netherlands, where they have legalized human euthanasia (including physician assisted), or even Oregon's Death with Dignity Act (which is death by overdose.) There were no cases found with a cursory search that indicated that there are major problems with these policies.

When it comes to the Geneva Conventions:
1) The Geneva Conventions are speaking of people that are euthanized against their will, but the people we are talking about are asking for the right to die.
2) The US didn't have a problem breaking the Geneva Convention when it comes to the rights of the "detainees" (really prisoners of war) in Gitmo.
3) Other Geneva Convention signers have legalized euthanasia, Belgium and the Netherlands.

My grandmother survived the Holocaust at Dachau, then Bikenau, she survived fascism. It still didn't stop her from asking to die with dignity. There is a huge difference between murder and euthanasia. It seems that you can't separate the two.

You also can't seem to see that while you don't want it for yourself, that doesn't mean that it shouldn't be available to others. Hospices would NOT become slaughterhouses because those that choose to deteriorate and lose what little dignity they have will be allowed to do so, and those that want to retain their dignity and die would also be allowed as they wish. No, dying isn't dignified, but to allow people to die with what dignity they have left is the ultimate in humane, "do no harm" treatment. People shouldn't have to live in pain.

Maybe you do have faith in medical research, but until that research is in action and people DON'T suffer, then human euthanasia should be an option.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by kstar

For setting up standards for human euthanasia, we should look to Belgium and the Netherlands, where they have legalized human euthanasia (including physician assisted), or even Oregon's Death with Dignity Act (which is death by overdose.) There were no cases found with a cursory search that indicated that there are major problems with these policies.

When it comes to the Geneva Conventions:
1) The Geneva Conventions are speaking of people that are euthanized against their will, but the people we are talking about are asking for the right to die.
2) The US didn't have a problem breaking the Geneva Convention when it comes to the rights of the "detainees" (really prisoners of war) in Gitmo.
3) Other Geneva Convention signers have legalized euthanasia, Belgium and the Netherlands.

My grandmother survived the Holocaust at Dachau, then Bikenau, she survived fascism. It still didn't stop her from asking to die with dignity. There is a huge difference between murder and euthanasia. It seems that you can't separate the two.

You also can't seem to see that while you don't want it for yourself, that doesn't mean that it shouldn't be available to others. Hospices would NOT become slaughterhouses because those that choose to deteriorate and lose what little dignity they have will be allowed to do so, and those that want to retain their dignity and die would also be allowed as they wish. No, dying isn't dignified, but to allow people to die with what dignity they have left is the ultimate in humane, "do no harm" treatment. People shouldn't have to live in pain.

Maybe you do have faith in medical research, but until that research is in action and people DON'T suffer, then human euthanasia should be an option.

But given my ancestors who were brought over here in slave ships, I am sorry, but I just do not trust this government system enough to enact any kind of law fairly and equitably.

People can be coerced to agree to anything and make it sound like it is what they want given the circumstances. A free people who are informed to make those choices would choose differently. A wise people would know that it is in their living that makes all the difference in the world.

Beloved,

I am asking you to walk along a path of serenity when you seek these ideas. My life has been fraught already with indignation. Institutionalized racism did that to me.

I have also done unsavory acts against my own life and I know what feels like when one is helpless, alienated, and forsaken. And I am here today to tell anyone willing to listen, to request dying with dignity--assisted or otherwise--is still suicide, which makes it a mental health issue at its core.

And because it is well known in the scientific literature that most chronic illnesses and some treatment actually do cause major clinical depression which is seen in rodents--meaning the molecular pathways have evolved similarly--that allowing someone to come to the conclusion that death is their only option, then I would say, wait something new and better, because one's death is not going to solve these ailments of humanity.

In the very near future, it is already predicted that those people who have HIV and full course of treatment will reach drug failure. The cocktails will not work anymore. And the disease will progress. Some people, those who are ignorant, would say that is the moral price one pays for contracting HIV. However, we as humans have to get beyond that level of thinking.

Beloved,

We will not get a second chance at this--our humanity. If we do not solve these major health care issues with humanity, is death with dignity an evolved option--given the breadth and depth of all our human knowledge?

I am sorry, but I have to do an invocation, because I believe in a higher power and spirit that I call my God in The Universe, I cannot agree to those terms... I would not want to be a part of a government that condones it. To me, that is not a freedom but a curse and trying to buy a way to get out of the costs of using Carbon--especially, when there is so much poverty in this world, so much hunger and strife--folks who have a very good life here in the States would think it is okay to die?

Also, we, in the US will have to pay a price for the infractions at Gitmo. It has already started in the courts.