Can National Shut Down a Chapter Because of it's Racial Breakdown?

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by Achilles87

For the fraternities that clearly identify themselves as being for a particular race or religion, could the National Office legally shut down a chapter for having too many members who do not identify with the given race/religion?

What if the national constitution does not include anything regarding a Chapter being required to have a certain racial/religious breakdown in order to maintain its charter?

I really and truly believe that this is the flaw in the question.... I believe that even if the fraternity is "for" a particular culture or religion, I don't think any have discrimination clauses.

That said, I think that a chapter could be shut down not for having the "wrong" color or religion, but if that factor contributed to the chapter straying too far from the ideals of the fraternity.

If there was a mostly non-Black chapter of APhiA, I think our people would be fine with it. If they stopped having voter registration drives and refused to teach the history of the organization (which in itself is black history), then there would be a problem.

[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

I really and truly believe that this is the flaw in the question.... I believe that even if the fraternity is "for" a particular culture or religion, I don't think any have discrimination clauses.

That said, I think that a chapter could be shut down not for having the "wrong" color or religion, but if that factor contributed to the chapter straying too far from the ideals of the fraternity.

Agreed. I remember this specifically in discussing someone of the NIC fraternities that still explicitly identify themselves as Christian or as being for only those who believe in a higher power. It was never clear to me if these kinds of broad group identifications actually authorized chapters to reject atheists on the basis of being atheists. Even so, if that were a problem, it's something I would think the group would deal with on an individual basis with that member or chapter rather than just up and dechartering the chapter. Now, if the chapter were distributing atheistic literature or holding black sabbaths or something (lol), maybe then it would be a case for dechartering.

[AKA_Monet]

General question overall: Why would someone WANT (meaning truly desire) to be a part of group that has historically had institutionalized racism and bigotry as a part of its chapters... I'd be scared to attend a picnic and BBQ... What kind of "games" would they play?

At least with an NPHC org, someone will be playing dominoes or Bid Whist or spades and there might be an egg toss or potato sack race. But nothing involving hurting other people simply because they are of a different creed, race, ethnic group, whatever... I mean, I truly dislike egg tosses because I always get the crashed egg... LOL...

[PANTHERTEKE]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

General question overall: Why would someone WANT (meaning truly desire) to be a part of group that has historically had institutionalized racism and bigotry as a part of its chapters... I'd be scared to attend a picnic and BBQ... What kind of "games" would they play?

At least with an NPHC org, someone will be playing dominoes or Bid Whist or spades and there might be an egg toss or potato sack race. But nothing involving hurting other people simply because they are of a different creed, race, ethnic group, whatever... I mean, I truly dislike egg tosses because I always get the crashed egg... LOL...

Wait... what?

I don't understand. Am I missing something?

Or do you think NIC fraternities go around beating up people because they're Black/Muslim/Jewish/Atheist/etc?

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by PANTHERTEKE

Wait... what?

I don't understand. Am I missing something?

Or do you think NIC fraternities go around beating up people because they're Black/Muslim/Jewish/Atheist/etc?

Hey, if the shoe fits... It's happened in the past, what makes you think it won't happen again? Don't be like the kids at Jena 6 having to deal with the nooses...

It may NOT be the entire organization, but "rogue chapters or members" who allow this craziness to continue.

The same can be said about the NPHC underground pledging. What else can be done? A whole slew of people being expelled from the organization because they cannot follow the National HQ agreed upon rules?

What is it that our International organization's espouse? Then why would we want to select members who seem to have a psychosis?

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

General question overall: Why would someone WANT (meaning truly desire) to be a part of group that has historically had institutionalized racism and bigotry as a part of its chapters... I'd be scared to attend a picnic and BBQ... What kind of "games" would they play?

At least with an NPHC org, someone will be playing dominoes or Bid Whist or spades and there might be an egg toss or potato sack race. But nothing involving hurting other people simply because they are of a different creed, race, ethnic group, whatever... I mean, I truly dislike egg tosses because I always get the crashed egg... LOL...

youz crazy

[fantASTic]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

General question overall: Why would someone WANT (meaning truly desire) to be a part of group that has historically had institutionalized racism and bigotry as a part of its chapters... I'd be scared to attend a picnic and BBQ... What kind of "games" would they play?

At least with an NPHC org, someone will be playing dominoes or Bid Whist or spades and there might be an egg toss or potato sack race. But nothing involving hurting other people simply because they are of a different creed, race, ethnic group, whatever... I mean, I truly dislike egg tosses because I always get the crashed egg... LOL...

Wow.

Thank you, very much, for showing us your true side. You clearly have great disdain for NPC/NIC organizations. I can't believe you are okay with putting this on the internet and representing AKA like that.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by fantASTic

Wow.

Thank you, very much, for showing us your true side. You clearly have great disdain for NPC/NIC organizations. I can't believe you are okay with putting this on the internet and representing AKA like that.

Aren't we quite judgmental today? Who are you to tell me how to be a member of my Sorority? Like, I love to tell you how to be a member of yours.

And for the record, it is NOT about any disdain for NPC/NIC organizations as I have helped numerous fraternities and sororities procure funds to support their activities at all my universities. And several greeks would specifically take my classes because I only judged them by their class performance and NOT by their letters... That's for real, just so you know a little about me.

So, please, work on your fabricated story on me a tad bit better, because really, what you truly know about me is bullshit! Okay, thanks.

[PANTHERTEKE]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Aren't we quite judgmental today? Who are you to tell me how to be a member of my Sorority? Like, I love to tell you how to be a member of yours.

And for the record, it is NOT about any disdain for NPC/NIC organizations as I have helped numerous fraternities and sororities procure funds to support their activities at all my universities. And several greeks would specifically take my classes because I only judged them by their class performance and NOT by their letters... That's for real, just so you know a little about me.

So, please, work on your fabricated story on me a tad bit better, because really, what you truly know about me is bullshit! Okay, thanks.

You are aware that there are some NIC fraternities founded as early as the late 1800s that never had a discriminatory clause, right?

And although I don't technically agree with AST[rest of username, sorry too lazy to check back], you do show a lot of negative bias towards NIC/NPC organizations in almost all your posts dealing with it.

Which I could care less about... but there is not denying you have a problem with, particularly, non-Whites joining NIC/NPC organizations.

[Taualumna]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

General question overall: Why would someone WANT (meaning truly desire) to be a part of group that has historically had institutionalized racism and bigotry as a part of its chapters... I'd be scared to attend a picnic and BBQ... What kind of "games" would they play?

Would you apply this to organizations that historically banned women from joining? If so, then that's A LOT of universities! Or is it different when it comes to sexism?

Just wondering.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by PANTHERTEKE

You are aware that there are some NIC fraternities founded as early as the late 1800s that never had a discriminatory clause, right?

And although I don't technically agree with AST[rest of username, sorry too lazy to check back], you do show a lot of negative bias towards NIC/NPC organizations in almost all your posts dealing with it.

Which I could care less about... but there is not denying you have a problem with, particularly, non-Whites joining NIC/NPC organizations.

Whether or not there are clauses in these organization is not the point I was making and missing it, totally.

I harbor no ill-will toward NIC/NPC as I speak to several members on a constant, consistent daily basis. That is YOUR perception, you are taking it too personally and CHOOSE to have that view of me, which is unfortunate because that is not who I am with what I do. And I can attempt to justify (LOL) my thoughts to you on this medium until I am "pink and green" (LOL ) in the face, but that is a prejudice on your part and you need to take ownership of projecting your opinions upon me...

As far as non-Caucasians joining NIC/NPC organizations, um no, I don't have a problem with that. If that is there thing, more power to them. What I have a problem with is someone who joins these organizations and then wonders why there are no other [insert your favorite ethnic/sex/race/etc here] and the debasement of NPHC organization we all have discussed ad nauseum here. I personally think that discussion is stupid, silly, juvenile and asinine. Then, the minute my Sorority is included in the discussion, my personal opinion is the thread must be squashed. Because really, we as members of GLO's have way too many other issues to deal with than why does AKA's wear pink vs. green on some days and don't talk to Delta Gamma Sorority, Inc. .

Originally Posted by Taualumna

Would you apply this to organizations that historically banned women from joining? If so, then that's A LOT of universities! Or is it different when it comes to sexism?

Just wondering.

I think that's an apples vs. oranges question and I cannot and frankly, don't care to comment beyond what do you do when said organization decide to go to a "tittie bar"? LOL...

[Chan815]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

I harbor no ill-will toward NIC/NPC as I speak to several members on a constant, consistent daily basis. That is YOUR perception, you are taking it too personally and CHOOSE to have that view of me, which is unfortunate because that is not who I am with what I do.

Then can you explain this post to me? Because from what I inferred it seems that your trash-talking NPC/NIC GLO's...

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

General question overall: Why would someone WANT (meaning truly desire) to be a part of group that has historically had institutionalized racism and bigotry as a part of its chapters... I'd be scared to attend a picnic and BBQ... What kind of "games" would they play?

At least with an NPHC org, someone will be playing dominoes or Bid Whist or spades and there might be an egg toss or potato sack race. But nothing involving hurting other people simply because they are of a different creed, race, ethnic group, whatever... I mean, I truly dislike egg tosses because I always get the crashed egg... LOL...

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by Chan815

Then can you explain this post to me? Because from what I inferred it seems that your trash-talking NPC/NIC GLO's...

I don't understand the OP... Are there quotas to NIC/NPC for representation? like NIC/NPC has to have "affirmative action" programs--LOL. Rather than asking that question, I chose an inside joke that I guess DSTChaos got... Meaning that that kind of question can be searched on GC and it sounds silly to me.

Why would a kid who is from {insert your favorite group here} have a problem joining any NIC/NPC chapter on his/her respective campus if the chapter shows a favorable vote?

If that is the case, then with the example of wanting only "redheads" in the chapter, well, I can bleach my hair and naturally, I will look like "Bozo the Clown", so do I still get to join? LOL.

I think anyone's membership should NOT be based solely on looks. Not everyone is a supermodel or athlete. However, charisma and diplomacy are attributes that can be honed and developed. If that is the kind of membership you want walking into the door and hit the ground running, then I think transparency and full disclosure are in place and a fair expectation.

I was a former Graduate Advisor for my Sorority's undergraduate chapter and I have taught several undergraduate courses. I know how to best relay information to PNM in a tactful way to get the best results...

[PANTHERTEKE]

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

Whether or not there are clauses in these organization is not the point I was making and missing it, totally.

That whole thing was brought up because you kept saying "why would someone want to join an organization that originally barred people like them?"

Maybe you're missing the point.

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

I harbor no ill-will toward NIC/NPC as I speak to several members on a constant, consistent daily basis. That is YOUR perception, you are taking it too personally and CHOOSE to have that view of me, which is unfortunate because that is not who I am with what I do. And I can attempt to justify (LOL) my thoughts to you on this medium until I am "pink and green" (LOL ) in the face, but that is a prejudice on your part and you need to take ownership of projecting your opinions upon me...

That's fine. I don't have a prejudice toward you, but my opinion stands.

Originally Posted by AKA_Monet

As far as non-Caucasians joining NIC/NPC organizations, um no, I don't have a problem with that. If that is there thing, more power to them.

Ok, if you say so lol.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by PANTHERTEKE

That whole thing was brought up because you kept saying "why would someone want to join an organization that originally barred people like them?"

Maybe you're missing the point.



That's fine. I don't have a prejudice toward you, but my opinion stands.



Ok, if you say so lol.

So your point is what, here? Let's wrap this up before I have to take my Vici..