Sean Bell's Killers (NYC Cops) Walk

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by jon1856

I do agree with you on this point; something is not right.
Anyone notice when this became more about Rev Al than Sean Bell?
Everyone I deal with (family, friends, co-workers,business associates et al) all say that this is now all about Rev Al. Perhaps has been so for awhile now.

Think about the comments reported the other day.
"We are doing this to get the attention of the Federal officials"

Now since when does Rev Al not have anyone's phone number to arrange a meeting?

Since when does he not have to ability to have a press conference at the drop of a quarter?

This is all about his face time.

He gets his face in the cameras.

So the Civil Right section of the Dept of Justice has to say, in public that they are meeting.

And Rev Al gets to make sure that he gets face time with all the politicians.

And remember, we have an election coming up. Who ever the two are, they will be coming to his court for face time.

And Sean and his family and friends are just now tools to be used.

I find that a shame.

And remember, even if the DoJ does start a file, nothing is going to happen for awhile.

This thread will have to be dug up.

Just MVHO.
P.S.: Rev Al said that he will shut down the NYC again in 7-10 days.
Next Wednesday looks good.

it's only about AL if you LET IT be about Bell.

I am not sure how old you are Jon, but this is the same tactics that Civil Rights Marchers used back in the 60's when there was injustice, people marched and protested to make sure that they were not forgotten. Altho I disagree with some of what Rev Al does, I feel that this time he is on point. Why? Because Sean Bell and co. could so easliy become back page news especially and unfortunately with their background. And if that happens, it could happen again and frankly, people are tired...liek I said earlier, 5 in 10 and something is NOT right and the only thing that happens is the city awards the family millions....those milliosn aint gonna bring that loved one back...if anything, that money is hush money which allows it to happen again and again. And it's time for some accountability...remember what I said awhile back, out of all these cases...only ONE cop was ever convicted. My co workers and I were talking about this today at work and some of them are still pissed and we keep coming back to teh basic question: How can some men get gunned down by 50 bullets and no one is punished?

We don't like the answer that is given and the more people continue to be silent the more it will keep happening...Al is doing the smart thing similar like what he did in Jena...using a non violent form of keeping Bell in the news until something is done to correct this atrocity

[shinerbock]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

How can some men get gunned down by 50 bullets and no one is punished?

Because they were tried in a court, rather than in a "what sounds right/wrong" tribunal. I have no idea if what they did was justified, but there aren't any laws against shooting too much, that I know of. Thus, if they were justified in shooting initially, and there is no evidence that the situation, in their minds, changed, what can be said? I think it is a questionable situation, but I don't necessarily think it is a miscarriage of justice.

[DSTCHAOS]

Eh...if the ruling won't be overturned, this is why there are civil cases or whatever avenue they choose.

This is far from over and how far this goes is not based on "what sounds right/wrong," either.

[KSig RC]

Seriously, guys - in a city of 8.2 million people and with a relatively high crime rate (compared to national averages), we can't use 5 to show any kind of endemic or systematic problem with law enforcement.

We'd likely be much better off focusing on each individual case on its own (de-)merits - work forward, instead of backward from a conclusion, as it seems much stronger in this sort of situation.

[DaemonSeid]

It's not about stats or averages...it's about that after the first time, incidents like these were not supposed to happen again.....8.2 million or 820,000...

Still something wrong with just 5...only FIVE in the same part of the country who dies in the same manner after facing off with cops!!

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

It's not about stats or averages...it's about that after the first time, incidents like these were not supposed to happen again.....8.2 million or 820,000...

Still something wrong with just 5...only FIVE in the same part of the country who dies in the same manner after facing off with cops!!

This mantra of "ONE IS TOO MANY!" is kind of a strawman, though, isn't it?

The main issue is either:

1 - every person should be treated with dignity by police, including following standard and fair established police practices; or

2 - there is an endemic/systemic problem with the NYPD.

The "ONE IS TOO MANY!" mantra ONLY applies to number one, because in order to prove number two, you cannot ignore the "stats and averages" you've so derisively shooed away.

We don't know, for instance, whether police in Mobile, AL or DC or Vail, CO have the same problems, or whether this is random variation, or the same two dudes causing problems - instead, we should focus on issue number one.

To do otherwise invites those "stats and averages" into the discussion - and, as you've (indirectly) noted, those numbers do not bode well for change to issue number one.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

This mantra of "ONE IS TOO MANY!" is kind of a strawman, though, isn't it?

The main issue is either:

1 - every person should be treated with dignity by police, including following standard and fair established police practices; or

2 - there is an endemic/systemic problem with the NYPD.

The "ONE IS TOO MANY!" mantra ONLY applies to number one, because in order to prove number two, you cannot ignore the "stats and averages" you've so derisively shooed away.

We don't know, for instance, whether police in Mobile, AL or DC or Vail, CO have the same problems, or whether this is random variation, or the same two dudes causing problems - instead, we should focus on issue number one.

To do otherwise invites those "stats and averages" into the discussion - and, as you've (indirectly) noted, those numbers do not bode well for change to issue number one.

Not strawman at all...you get the stats on how many UNARMED people have died in a 10 year period in a hail of bullets by cops and let's compare notes....but all one has to do is use common sense to know this is not something that happens 'yearly' and we definently do not hear about this in the news...often enough were we can say....oh this is a regular occurance that goes on in other large metropolises...don't confuse that with people who get shot by cops either...we are talking about 5 circumstances that happened that for some God forsaken reason keeps happening in the SAME city...

At least 4 of the victims had no criminal records!!!

Damn I hate repeating myself....

[DSTCHAOS]

Unless this is entertaining you, Daemonseid, why waste your time explaining this stuff?

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

Unless this is entertaining you, Daemonseid, why waste your time explaining this stuff?

I just realized today I was repeating myself....hehehe...besides I was bored at work....heh

[DSTCHAOS]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080509/...arpton_s_money

[jon1856]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080509/...arpton_s_money

This is just about his "canned/standard quote when ever he is caught up in something:

"Whatever retaliation they do on me, we never stop," he told the AP. "I think that that is why they try to intimidate us."

"Sharpton's reputation has undergone a remarkable renaissance since the Tawana Brawley days in 1987, when he was accused of helping create a hoax in which the 15-year-old girl claimed she had been kidnapped and raped by a gang of whites that included a police officer and a prosecutor. A grand jury concluded that Brawley made the story up."
He never paid the fines for this either. And he is the only one of the four men invloved who somehow walked out of that mess with a life and a career.

[DSTCHAOS]

The timing is no coincidence.

[jon1856]

Officers Face Departmental Charges in Bell Killing .
Seven New York City police officers involved in the fatal shooting of Sean Bell, including three detectives who were acquitted in a criminal trial, were formally accused on Tuesday of breaking Police Department rules in the case.
The department said that the officers violated the internal policy manual — its Patrol Guide — in a variety of ways, including improperly firing their guns and failing to process the crime scene after Mr. Bell was killed and his two friends injured in a storm of 50 bullets...
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/21/ny...ss&oref=slogin

[nittanyalum]

Good. At least it's something. Interested to see if federal charges ever come down.