Harry Potter & the Order of the Phoenix (film)

[Marie]

Ok, so I watched the movie yesterday, and I was pretty much disappointed with some of the same areas.

In regards to Cho and Harry splitting up...I assumed that they were introducing that when Cho was expressing regret over Cedric's death & Hermione spoke on how conflicted she must be. It seemed like a natural and smoother progression to let their relationship falter off in that way rather than as the 'DA outter'.

I also agree with those who noted that a 'random student' other than Cho could have blown the whistle on them. There were lots of 'no name' students that had a line or two during the inital meeting and practices. It could have just as easily been one of them. Plus it would have been fun to see Hermione's spell in action.

Also...I though that Neville was able to see the 'invisible horses'. Maybe I'm remembering wrong, but I thought that was going to be a nice lead in for him to speak on his parents. I'm not really mad at that plot change, but I just thought that it could have worked as well.

I felt that there was stuff missing just from a movie standpoint. If I had never read the books I would have been confused. For instance, none of the previous movies have mentioned centaurs in the forest (that I can remember). If I saw them now...I would be like "who the hell are they?" Also, I don't remember them deciding on the name Dumbledore's Army. If I hadn't read the book, then that would have confused me as well.

No complaints about Sirius's death. I honestly thought that it was pretty lack luster and confusing in the book as well, so it seemed to be appropriately done.

I hated the introduction of Hagrid's brother both in the book and the movie. I hope that he plays a major part in the next book b/c otherwise I will still be shaking my head at that dead end storyline.

Agree with those who missed the lack of a real convo btwn Dumbledore and Harry at the end. Sometimes those conversations tie the whole movie together and provide inspiration going forward.

Loved Luna Lovegood and Prof. Umbridge. They were both excellent. Bellatrix Lestrange was cool, but I wasn't blown away by her.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Marie

For instance, none of the previous movies have mentioned centaurs in the forest (that I can remember). If I saw them now...I would be like "who the hell are they?"

Firenze was in the first movie, when Hagrid took Harry and the others into the forest for their detention.

[CutiePie2000]

I saw it and I quite liked it. I read the book when it first came out & haven't touched it since, so I forgot a lot of what happened & I think that helped me to enjoy the movie, rather than feeling like, "Hey, the book wasn't like that".

Oh, and Snape basically absolved Cho Chang of responsibility for outting Dumbledore's army, because he said that the last of the truth serum had been used up on Cho Chang, in front of everyone, when Umbridge was giving Harry the gears.

Question: how come Harry wasn't able to see the nestrals before that year at Hogwarts? Even if you've witnessed death (and he did, in infancy), do you have to be a certain age of maturity too? I'm sure JKR explained, but I can't remember.

[lyrelyre]

Originally Posted by CutiePie2000

Question: how come Harry wasn't able to see the nestrals before that year at Hogwarts? Even if you've witnessed death (and he did, in infancy), do you have to be a certain age of maturity too? I'm sure JKR explained, but I can't remember.

J.K Rowling says on her site that Harry didn't actually witness the death of his parents. He was in his "cot" and only saw the flash of green light. He did not actually witness death until Cedric was killed. Further, he didn't see them on the way back to the Hogwarts Express during his fourth year because he didn't fully appreciate Cedric’s death. Thus, he couldn’t see them until OotP.

[CutiePie2000]

Thanks for clarifying that...that makes a lot of sense.

[polarpi]

Originally Posted by lyrelyre

Further, he didn't see them on the way back to the Hogwarts Express during his fifth year because he didn't fully appreciate Cedric’s death. Thus, he couldn’t see them until HBP.

Wait - didn't he see them fifth year? (Cedric was killed in the fourth year) That's the discussion going on with the current movie, too (OotP)

[lyrelyre]

Originally Posted by polarpi

Wait - didn't he see them fifth year? (Cedric was killed in the fourth year) That's the discussion going on with the current movie, too (OotP)

Yes, that is what I meant. I will edit.

[christiangirl]

Originally Posted by Marie

I hated the introduction of Hagrid's brother both in the book and the movie. I hope that he plays a major part in the next book b/c otherwise I will still be shaking my head at that dead end storyline.

I believe he will be. But Hermione was supposed to be hysterical about Grawp, not talk to him like a stern babysitter. I really don't see the point in changing that. It's just like Neville not being able to see thestrals--it didn't cut down on movie time and help the plot along, so what was the point?

Originally Posted by CutiePie2000

Oh, and Snape basically absolved Cho Chang of responsibility for outting Dumbledore's army, because he said that the last of the truth serum had been used up on Cho Chang, in front of everyone, when Umbridge was giving Harry the gears.

I'm not talking to you, CP2000, but I needed to quote that to bring up a oiint---why do people keep repeating this, like we missed it? We know that happened, we just didn't like it. It still seems like a pointless change to the story, as it creates more plot problems than it fixes. Their relationship could have ended a number of ways (including with the blame off Marietta) without the movie running too long--if we could come up with time-saving options that stayed true to the book, the director should have been able to do so as well!

[polarpi]

Originally Posted by lyrelyre

Yes, that is what I meant. I will edit.

No problem - I just had to read it and then re-read it to make sure I was understanding

[Marie]

Originally Posted by lyrelyre

J.K Rowling says on her site that Harry didn't actually witness the death of his parents. He was in his "cot" and only saw the flash of green light. He did not actually witness death until Cedric was killed. Further, he didn't see them on the way back to the Hogwarts Express during his fourth year because he didn't fully appreciate Cedric’s death. Thus, he couldn’t see them until OotP.

As a side note...I feel like we give J. K. Rowling too much credit. I mean it has again and again been repeated that he remembers the flash of light and heard his mom screen. Luna can see them (and I don't believe that she witnessed her mother's death), and Neville can see them when his parents aren't even dead. J. K. just slipped up a little on this one. That's cool, but it surprises me that she can pull any explanation out of her azz, and folks are like "Oh ok...genius how you planned it that way."

**This is not directed at you, lyrelyre or CutiePie2000**

[Glitter650]

I kinda wish they would've had a couple of scenes at St. Mungos... in the film... I feel like they kinda worked really hard to make it less dark than the book, because the book was really the darkest, and saddest of them all IMO...

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Marie

As a side note...I feel like we give J. K. Rowling too much credit. I mean it has again and again been repeated that he remembers the flash of light and heard his mom screen. Luna can see them (and I don't believe that she witnessed her mother's death), and Neville can see them when his parents aren't even dead. J. K. just slipped up a little on this one. That's cool, but it surprises me that she can pull any explanation out of her azz, and folks are like "Oh ok...genius how you planned it that way."

Umm, no, she's assuming you actually read the books and can reason a little.

Seeing a flash of green light and hearing his mom scream =/= seeing her die.

Luna never says one way or the other whether she actually saw her mother die, although her comment that "it was rather horrible" can give rise to the inference she saw it. Since that scene in the book comes after the scene where it's explained that "the only people who can see thestrals are people who have seen death" (p. 446, US hardback edition), you're reaching to find some inconsistency and afterthought explanation.

As for Neville:

Order of the Phoenix, Chapter 21 ("The Eye of the Snake") (p. 449, US hardback edition):

"You can see the thestrals, Longbotton, can you?" [Umbridge] said.

Neville nodded.

"Whom did you see die?" she asked, her tone indifferent.

"My . . . grandad," said Neville.

Maybe she's giving some readers too much credit.

[christiangirl]

Hmm...now that I've reread OotP, I realize that Luna never really did say she saw her mother die...Harry merely asked, "Who did you know that died?" and that's quite different, isn't it? Hmmm....in any case, I still feel that Harry should've been able to see them at the end of GoF, even if Cedric's death hadn't processed yet. That's not one of the conditions, is it? You've got to have seen death to see thestrals, not have seen it and come to grips with it as well. That was definitely a shoddy job of smoothing over, but she's done too much genius writing for me to really hold that one against her.

Alright, I'm peacing y'all out! I'm boycotting the net until Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows is properly read!

[Lady Pi Phi]

Originally Posted by CutiePie2000

...Question: how come Harry wasn't able to see the nestrals before that year at Hogwarts? Even if you've witnessed death (and he did, in infancy), do you have to be a certain age of maturity too? I'm sure JKR explained, but I can't remember.

I've always wondered that too and I don't recall JKR ever explaining it. He would have seen his mother die when he was a baby. So in second year, he should have been able to see the Thestrals.

Never mind, I posted before I read the following posts. Thanks for clearing it up.

[polarpi]

Originally Posted by Marie

Also...I though that Neville was able to see the 'invisible horses'. Maybe I'm remembering wrong, but I thought that was going to be a nice lead in for him to speak on his parents. I'm not really mad at that plot change, but I just thought that it could have worked as well.

That bothered me as well - it made it look stupid when he was just staring blankly (for those who know that he is *supposed* to be able to see them) at the thestrals (but then it did allow for the parents to be mentioned without having to actually go into everything from St. Mungo's )