Sweethearts wearing letters?

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

RutgersPIKE - many GLOs allow pledges to wear letters. The idea of "earning" your letters is now seen as an invitation to haze. Wearing letters indicates you are a member (even if a pledge) of that GLO.

My observations may be limited, but it has been my obervation that this is one of those men-and-women-are-different things. My observation has been that many if not most men's GLOs (but certainly not all) do not consider pledges, or whatever other term is used, to be "members," at least not full members.

One of the ways that this is expressed is by reserving the right to wear letters until after initiation. As has been pointed out many times before here at GC, many if not most men's GLOs have a second vote prior to initiation -- meaning that a "pledge' must not only be voted on to get a bid but that he must be voted on a second time at the end of the pledge period for initiation. This is part of the practice underlying the idea of "earning" one's letters.

Originally Posted by ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl

It just has a lot to do with campus culture.

It also has to do with the culture or rules of the specific GLO.

Our National Constitution was amended at our last National Assembly to address this very issue. Our Constitution now specifically states that only brothers in good standing are permitted to wear or display our letters or our coat-of-arms. It also states that probationary members (pledges) "may not wear or otherwise display these symbols at any time prior to initiation," and that brothers "may not authorize or encourage" anyone who is not an initiated brother to wear or display our letters or coat-of-arms. (Which means that chapters are having to come up with lavelier-alternatives for sweethearts and fiancees. Perhaps a national alternative will be provided.)

ETA: It has been a regulation for years that probationary members could not wear the letters. (Like TSteven describes with Sigma Chi, they can wear clothing with the words "Phi Mu Alpha.") The recent constitutional amendment was simply a strengthening of the rule in that regard.

Men and Women are different. Vive la difference.

[RutgersPIKE]

I understand for fraternities letting sweethearts wear letters because sweethearts do some work for the fraternity, but how do you feel about girlfriends or boyfriends wearing letters, I saw some guys giving their girlfriends their hoodies to wear, but I would never do that

[TSteven]

Originally Posted by fantASTic

First of all, not allowing pledges to wear letters is hazing. It's also hazing to call them pledges instead of New Members. [That topic, however, is debatable, and let's not go there.]

Secondly, just because we don't know what IIKA stands for doesn't mean that a sweetheart who has worked for your chapter doesn't appreciate what you do and who you are, and wants to strive for your fraternity to succeed in the highest degree. And you know what? That means something.

Not allowing pledges to wear letters or calling pledges "pledges" is not hazing. For example, if a man chooses to accept a bid from Sigma Chi Fraternity, from that point on he is considered a Sigma Chi pledge and may wear shirts, etc., with the words "Sigma Chi" or "Sigs" but not the Greek letters Sigma Chi. This is a national regulation. I believe that Alpha Epsilon Phi, Kappa Alpha Theta and Pi Beta Phi have something similar in place regarding "new members" wearing letters. As for pledges being called pledges, I'm fairly sure other NIC/IFC fraternities do this as well. However, I am not sure about any NPC organization doing so.

Also, many organizations have strict or specific rules (policy) about non members wearing their letters. With guidelines as to how and why.

[kathykd2005]

Originally Posted by TSteven

Not allowing pledges to wear letters or calling pledges "pledges" is not hazing. For example, if a man chooses to accept a bid from Sigma Chi Fraternity, from that point on he is considered a Sigma Chi pledge and may wear shirts, etc., with the words "Sigma Chi" or "Sigs" but not the Greek letters Sigma Chi. This is a national regulation. I believe that Alpha Epsilon Phi, Kappa Alpha Theta and Pi Beta Phi have something similar in place regarding "new members" wearing letters. As for pledges being called pledges, I'm fairly sure other NIC/IFC fraternities do this as well. However, I am not sure about any NPC organization doing so.

Also, many organizations have strict or specific rules (policy) about non members wearing their letters. With guidelines as to how and why.

The reason we are running into a brick wall with reference to what hazing is, is because NPC has a very distinct definition of what it is. According to NPC, hazing IS not allowing women to wear letters, and calling them pledges instead of new members. Although fraternities and sororities share many likelesses, therein lies the difference between NIC/IFC and NPC organizations.

[RutgersPIKE]

MysticCat-that is exactly what im talking about in earning your letters, as well as the appropriate people on wearing letters, I just feel strongly on who should wear them or not, and I think we both can agree that only initiated members should be the ones wearing the letters, I just feel that more people should feel this way to, I just hope that the other Pike chapters agree with me

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

Originally Posted by RutgersPIKE

I understand for fraternities letting sweethearts wear letters because sweethearts do some work for the fraternity, but how do you feel about girlfriends or boyfriends wearing letters, I saw some guys giving their girlfriends their hoodies to wear, but I would never do that

I know I'm a girl, but I personally think it seems a little out of line. I wouldn't give my jersey to a guy to wear (um...not that he'd want to anyway haha). I think the lavalieres are inconspicuous and are SUPPOSED to have meaning behind them...but it's not something that the fraternity men would be wearing. At least I'm pretty sure. And usually sweetheart shirts are designated as such. And even sweetheart bages are not exactly like a guy's badge. But sewn on letters are. The only time I've worn guy sewn on letters was as a coach for Lip Jam...we usually wear a shirt of theirs to support the team and that's what I was given. But I would personally feel very out of place just casually wearing it in the same way I wear my own.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl

Me personally, I think it's ok for mom to wear it. But it isn't a crime to feel strongly about your letters.

I was ok with giving my mom a set of letters that said "Mom" underneath. I WASN'T ok with her buying letters for herself.

[fantASTic]

Actually, in my state, calling a new member a pledge is against the law because it's hazing. Nationals also condemns it. It is reminiscent of the days in which a new member was required to participate in unfortunate events in order to initiate, aka hazing.

At least in AST, not allowing a new member to wear letters IS hazing, because it's telling them that they can't do certain things unless they're initiated. It's the same thing as requiring them to wear certain clothing all the time, which IS hazing.

Whether a certain org's nationals have strict rules about non members wearing letters is one thing. However, if Nationals does NOT say that it is verboten, then it is left up to the individual chapter, and it shoudln't matter to us.

[kathykd2005]

Hazing is defined as any action or situation with or without consent which recklessly, intentionally or unintentionally endangers the mental or physical health or safety of a student, or creates risk of injury, or causes discomfort, embarrassment, harassment or ridicule or which willfully destroys or removes public or private property for the purpose of initiation or admission into or affiliation with, or as a condition for continued membership in a chapter or colony of an NPC member fraternity. All member groups will affirm their policies denouncing hazing and inform their membership of this NPC position denouncing hazing through mailings and through their inter/national magazines.

http://www.npcwomen.org/policies/p_resolutions.php

Kind of cryptic, but it covers all of the bases, I guess.

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

I was ok with giving my mom a set of letters that said "Mom" underneath. I WASN'T ok with her buying letters for herself.

I think I'd be the same way, but my mom's a KD, so she doesn't really feel the need for that kinda stuff. So no worries for me.

[kathykd2005]

Originally Posted by ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl

I think I'd be the same way, but my mom's a KD, so she doesn't really feel the need for that kinda stuff. So no worries for me.

Awww your mama's a KD?!

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

Originally Posted by kathykd2005

Awww your mama's a KD?!

Yep! Well...everyone in the family (except one wayward cousin who went Phi Mu) was until me.

[KyleMcGuire1983]

Originally Posted by TSteven

Not allowing pledges to wear letters or calling pledges "pledges" is not hazing. For example, if a man chooses to accept a bid from Sigma Chi Fraternity, from that point on he is considered a Sigma Chi pledge and may wear shirts, etc., with the words "Sigma Chi" or "Sigs" but not the Greek letters Sigma Chi. This is a national regulation. I believe that Alpha Epsilon Phi, Kappa Alpha Theta and Pi Beta Phi have something similar in place regarding "new members" wearing letters. As for pledges being called pledges, I'm fairly sure other NIC/IFC fraternities do this as well. However, I am not sure about any NPC organization doing so.

Also, many organizations have strict or specific rules (policy) about non members wearing their letters. With guidelines as to how and why.

Is that really in your Fraternal law or just in your tradition? I recently found out that Sigma Nu has no such rule against pledges wearing letters....we just don't let them do in 99% of our chapters because it's messed up.

[Tom Earp]

I do not really see what the Heck the big deal is.

Sweet Heart of XYZ is showing they are ladies who feel XYZ and the members are special. They are not pronouncing them selves as members are they?

Same things go for Moms or Dads. LOL!

PNM wearing letters show who they are affiliated with, wearing the Coat of Arms is a no, no.

This is a form of Advertising for that GLO!

Goodness, the popcycle unstuck from an oraface!

If Your GLO has rules then do not do it. If it is not spelled out ask!

The problem today is not enough GLOs are proud enough to let others know their affiliation by wearing letters, C of A, or Pins! Is that saying you are not PROUD of Your GLO?

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl

I think I'd be the same way, but my mom's a KD, so she doesn't really feel the need for that kinda stuff. So no worries for me.

My mom is a "I wish I could have gone greek"...so she likes wearing my letters.