Line Caps

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

The local NPC, based on "Green Book" guidelines and campus history.

I don't know if a PUBLIC university can force a cap - due to freedom of association rules, but I think a private university can do whatever it wants in that regard.

Interesting.

As a slight tangent..... I know that Title IX affects just about all universities, public and private, because the great majority have students on some kind of federal financial aid program.

I wonder if freedom of association could be applied to private universities for the same reason/loophole.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

Interesting.

As a slight tangent..... I know that Title IX affects just about all universities, public and private, because the great majority have students on some kind of federal financial aid program.

I wonder if freedom of association could be applied to private universities for the same reason/loophole.

A private u doesn't have to recognize GLOs (or any organization). However, if they deny their students the right to belong to an organization that meets off campus, that's where they get into Freedom of Association trouble.

[aopirose]

Originally Posted by 33girl

A private u doesn't have to recognize GLOs (or any organization). However, if they deny their students the right to belong to an organization that meets off campus, that's where they get into Freedom of Association trouble.

It's funny that you mention this. I was looking at Bowdoin yesterday and they actually have a Social Code dealing with membership in exlusionary organizations. Since 1997, Bowdoin students cannot join fraternities, sororities, or any group that excludes on the basis of gender, gender identity, sexual orientation, national origin, etc. (Student memberships were completely phased out by 2000.) I wonder of any student has joined any such organization and been brought up to a judicial committee.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by Senusret I

As a slight tangent..... I know that Title IX affects just about all universities, public and private, because the great majority have students on some kind of federal financial aid program.

I wonder if freedom of association could be applied to private universities for the same reason/loophole.

Short answer -- no.

[jadis96]

To begin with, I am NOT a lawyer (nor would I want too be, too complicated) but I have taken a few educational law classes dealing with campus and school issues.

Originally Posted by Senusret I

Interesting.

As a slight tangent..... I know that Title IX affects just about all universities, public and private, because the great majority have students on some kind of federal financial aid program.

I wonder if freedom of association could be applied to private universities for the same reason/loophole.

Based on my ed law class you're right Senusret. If a school (public or private) takes federal money, they gotta follow federal law. The only difference is privates do not HAVE to take federal money, but if they choose to then they have to follow federal law.

Originally Posted by 33girl

A private u doesn't have to recognize GLOs (or any organization). However, if they deny their students the right to belong to an organization that meets off campus, that's where they get into Freedom of Association trouble.

Part of the issue of freedom of association also deals with if you are secluding a segment of the population. For example, if there are 10 NPC's on a campus and the school does not allow a 11th NPC to get oncampus it's okay, because that segment is being covered legally. The issue would be if the uni has 10 NPC's on campus but does not allow a NPHC sorority. That is a segment of society you are not covering, yet you are not allowing them on campus.

I also believe that freedom of association is mainly used in cases dealing with religious groups. Having a campus crusade, but not allowing a jewish student union for example.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by jadis96

Based on my ed law class you're right Senusret. If a school (public or private) takes federal money, they gotta follow federal law. The only difference is privates do not HAVE to take federal money, but if they choose to then they have to follow federal law.

No, that's really a little too broad. Laws like Title IX specifically state that compliance with them is a prerequisite to receipt of federal funds. So, if a school violates the provisions of Title IX, that school risks forfeiting federal money.

Freedom of Association however is a constitutional right that applies only to the government. The rights guaranteed in the Bill of Rights have been construed to include a right of association, which the federal government cannot infringe upon. The Fourteenth Amendment extends that to the state governments, including state (public) schools.

But AlphaFrog is right -- there is a difference between prohibiting association in Greek groups and recognizing GLOs. A public university cannot tell you what organizations you can or can't belong to. But a public university can decide not to recognize Greek life on campus, as long as it does do across the board.

Part of the issue of freedom of association also deals with if you are secluding a segment of the population. For example, if there are 10 NPC's on a campus and the school does not allow a 11th NPC to get oncampus it's okay, because that segment is being covered legally. The issue would be if the uni has 10 NPC's on campus but does not allow a NPHC sorority. That is a segment of society you are not covering, yet you are not allowing them on campus.

I also believe that freedom of association is mainly used in cases dealing with religious groups. Having a campus crusade, but not allowing a jewish student union for example.

Both of examples issues deal more with equal protection of the laws than freedom of association. I've seen freedom of association arise most frequently in a political context -- association with people of similar political philosophies.

[1908Revelations]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

I'm sure I've read that at a public uni. they can't deny your right to be there, but they can make it as difficult as possible to get recognition, etc...

From my understanding we (not just AKA, but most campus orgs) are at the university as a privilege and they can give us the boot at any time at their discretion no questions asked. That doesent mean we won't exist, but not to the university. We can still attend school there just not hold functions on campus or identify with the university.