Randolph-Macon Woman's going co-ed...Many Students and Alumnae not happy

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by alum

I do find it interesting that some of the remaining women's colleges are among the strongest LACs in the country (Wellesley, Smith, Mt. Holyoke...) while the 2 remaining male colleges (Hampden-Sydney (also in that south-central area of VA) and Wabash (IN) are not attracting the same caliber of young men.

I know nothing about Wabash other than the name, but I wouldn't agree with that characterization about Hampden-Sydney.

[ForeverRoses]

I know a little about Wabash- two gentlemen that I work with attended college there. Wabash is a HUGE greek school. It is almost assumed that all freshman will join a fraternity. The one thing about Wabash that struck me as funny is that ALL freshmen are required to wear little freshmen beanie-cap things. If a particular fraternity would require that, it would be hazing, but since it is the entire school that requires it, apparently it is okay.

Wabash is also located about 45 minutes from DePauw so there are females in close proximity to the school.

[lovelyivy84]

Originally Posted by ForeverRoses

I know a little about Wabash- two gentlemen that I work with attended college there. Wabash is a HUGE greek school. It is almost assumed that all freshman will join a fraternity. The one thing about Wabash that struck me as funny is that ALL freshmen are required to wear little freshmen beanie-cap things. If a particular fraternity would require that, it would be hazing, but since it is the entire school that requires it, apparently it is okay.

Wabash is also located about 45 minutes from DePauw so there are females in close proximity to the school.

beanies? seriously? LOL

How 1950

[ISUKappa]

Originally Posted by lovelyivy84

beanies? seriously? LOL

How 1950

To be fair, they just reinstated the tradition after a nearly 40-year hiatus.

Article about the beanie at Wabash

The husband's alma mater was all-male until 1995. They voted to become co-ed in 1991, with the first class of freshmen allowing women in 1995. I don't know exactly why they decided to go co-ed; it's an extremely selective, small private school that is well-known for its engineering degrees. I don't think lack of academic talent was an issue, nor was recruiting students. Plus, with Indiana State and St Mary's of the Woods also in Terre Haute, there was not a shortage of women in the area. Most likely, as MysticCat said, the school voted to do so due to increasing societal pressure.

Wabash is also their sworn enemy. I'm assuming it's a carryover from the all-male days...

[TSteven]

Originally Posted by ISUKappa

The husband's alma mater was all-male until 1995. They voted to become co-ed in 1991, with the first class of freshmen allowing women in 1995. I don't know exactly why they decided to go co-ed; it's an extremely selective, small private school that is well-known for its engineering degrees. I don't think lack of academic talent was an issue, nor was recruiting students. Plus, with Indiana State and St Mary's of the Woods also in Terre Haute, there was not a shortage of women in the area. Most likely, as MysticCat said, the school voted to do so due to increasing societal pressure.

Wabash is also their sworn enemy. I'm assuming it's a carryover from the all-male days...

Rose-Hulman?

[ISUKappa]

Originally Posted by TSteven

Rose-Hulman?

Yes. He really enjoyed it there.

[alum]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I know nothing about Wabash other than the name, but I wouldn't agree with that characterization about Hampden-Sydney.

Unfortunately it's even harder to persuade smart young men to see the benefits of a single-sex education than it is to persuade smart young women to go to a women's college. That's why there are so few all-male colleges and why they are not terribly selective. The majority have gone co-ed.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by alum

Unfortunately it's even harder to persuade smart young men to see the benefits of a single-sex education than it is to persuade smart young women to go to a women's college. That's why there are so few all-male colleges and why they are not terribly selective. The majority have gone co-ed.

I'd say that's one reason that there are so few all male colleges, but I don't think its the main reason.

25 years ago, there were fewer than 10 all male schools in the country, and at least two of them were state military academies (VMA and The Citadel). Most all male schools, public and private, went co-ed in the 60s and 70s, and they did so not because it was that hard to persuade smart young men to go to an all male school but because society as a whole was demanding that the advantages of these schools be available to women as well as men. I'm not saying that going co-ed was a bad thing altogether, although I can wish that more of the all-male private schools had stayed that way. But the reality is that there was never the societal pressure on all-female schools to go co-ed that there was on all-male schools.

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I'd say that's one reason that there are so few all male colleges, but I don't think its the main reason.

25 years ago, there were fewer than 10 all male schools in the country, and at least two of them were state military academies (VMA and The Citadel). Most all male schools, public and private, went co-ed in the 60s and 70s, and they did so not because it was that hard to persuade smart young men to go to an all male school but because society as a whole was demanding that the advantages of these schools be available to women as well as men. I'm not saying that going co-ed was a bad thing altogether, although I can wish that more of the all-male private schools had stayed that way. But the reality is that there was never the societal pressure on all-female schools to go co-ed that there was on all-male schools.

In the case then there should be nothing going the other way around.

Male schools being forced to go Co-Ed and Female schools going Co-Ed?

It cannot be just a one way street and in many cases it is do, die, or survive.

[alum]

The federal and state service academies as well as state schools were pretty much forced to go co-ed because of anti-discrimination laws AND the fact that they are public institutions funded in part through the public coffers. W&L and other privates have Boards of Trustees that vote on this decision. In the Amherst, Williams, W&L cases, the Board voted to go co-ed. H-SC actually took a vote sometime in the 90s and opted to remain all-male.

[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I'd say that's one reason that there are so few all male colleges, but I don't think its the main reason.

25 years ago, there were fewer than 10 all male schools in the country, and at least two of them were state military academies (VMA and The Citadel). Most all male schools, public and private, went co-ed in the 60s and 70s, and they did so not because it was that hard to persuade smart young men to go to an all male school but because society as a whole was demanding that the advantages of these schools be available to women as well as men. I'm not saying that going co-ed was a bad thing altogether, although I can wish that more of the all-male private schools had stayed that way. But the reality is that there was never the societal pressure on all-female schools to go co-ed that there was on all-male schools.

I agree with you about the societal pressure of the 1960s and 1970s. But I'm suggesting that evidence from the mid-1970s on, men's schools have trouble attracting the same caliber students they once did. That is quite explicitly the reason W&L went co-ed and even some of the most vehement oppoents of the switch now admit that it saved the school academically, because the number of applications and the level of SAT and academic achievement in the incoming classes were dropping.

There are a few insitutions that escaped this problem: Morehouse, because of its location in Atlanta and the proximity of Spelman, and the military institutions, some (all?) of which are still predominantly male, because of their special missions.

It's VMI, not VMA.

[breathesgelatin]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I know nothing about Wabash other than the name, but I wouldn't agree with that characterization about Hampden-Sydney.

You wouldn't? This amuses me.

I'm not saying Hampden-Sydney isn't a good school, but to compare it with other similar schools that once attracted the same population it did and made late-in-the-game decisions to go co-ed, it's clear that H-S doesn't attract the level of students that comparable institutions did and I'm guessing its student body isn't as high-caliber as it was in the past. As comparable institutions, I'm thinking Washington and Lee and Davidson, which are both traditionally conservative southern LACs who decided to go co-ed long after many other major institutions did.

It also amuses me as someone who knows a little bit about H-S student life, but that's a whole 'nother thing.

For what it's worth, Washington and Lee required freshmen to wear beanies as well, up until maybe the 1940s.