FDA poised to OK food from cloned animals

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

I don't care about any of your "facts" and I'm not trying to "retort" them. I leave that to people like AKAMonet, who has established her expertise and credibility in the subject and whose opinion, unlike your's, I respect. I just get very, very tired of what you seem to think passes as intelligent discussion.

I would have to take your posts seriously in order to try and "retort your facts."

Originally Posted by blueangel

Still waiting.. are you going to contribute to this discussion on cloning?

Why in the world are you still waiting? What part of "I would have to take your posts seriously in order to try and 'retort your facts'" was too complicated for you to understand?

Originally Posted by Drolefille

KSig_RC rocks my socks.

Seriously. But just wait. He "retorted" her "facts," so according to what seems to pass for logic, he must be wrong. There'll be a five gazzillion-word post full of links to "sources" telling him he doesn't know what he's talking about. It is inevitable.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

Thanks for answering. That's kind of what I thought.

I realize there are better place to find this information than GreekChat, but what is the biology of Mad Cow?

I really thought it was viral. I don't know why.

I know that it ends up making holes in brain tissue and that prions, I think, are involved, but what kind of pathogen is it?

From wiki

The infectious agent in BSE is believed to be a specific type of misfolded protein called prion. Misfolded prion proteins carry the disease between individuals and cause deterioration of the brain. BSE is a type of transmissible spongiform encephalopathy (TSE)[citation needed]. TSEs can arise in animals that carry an allele which causes normal prions to contort by themselves into the disease-causing shape. Transmission can occur when healthy animals come in contact with tainted tissues from others with the disease. In the brain these proteins cause native cellular prion protein to deform into the infectious state, which then goes on to deform further prion protein in an exponential cascade. This results in protein aggregates, which then form dense plaque fibers, leading to the microscopic appearance of "holes" in the brain, degeneration of physical and mental abilities, and ultimately death.

That's really rather dense, and sorry, but I'm not sure I can actually simplify it.
But yeah, they get it when they're fed cow nervous tissue. Sheep get a similar disease.

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Seriously. But just wait. He "retorted" her "facts," so according to what seems to pass for logic, he must be wrong. There'll be a five gazzillion-word post full of links to "sources" telling him he doesn't know what he's talking about. It is inevitable.

I can't even read those posts.

[GeekyPenguin]

Originally Posted by MysticCat

Why in the world are you still waiting? What part of "I would have to take your posts seriously in order to try and 'retort your facts'" was too complicated for you to understand?

Seriously. But just wait. He "retorted" her "facts," so according to what seems to pass for logic, he must be wrong. There'll be a five gazzillion-word post full of links to "sources" telling him he doesn't know what he's talking about. It is inevitable.

Can you imagine doing discovery with her? She'd bury you in take-out menus.

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by GeekyPenguin

Can you imagine doing discovery with her? She'd bury you in take-out menus.

ROTFL! That's the best laugh I've had all day, as well as the most horrifying thought I've had all day. A 2-fer!

[UGAalum94]

Thanks, I appreciate the info. Just so you all don't think I've been living in a cave, I want to say that I too knew that consuming the tissue was the way it was transmitted, even for cows, sheep, some game (there's an Elk form, I'm pretty sure), so I understood the "canniblism" element.

I just mistakenly believed that you could classify a prion transmitted illness, like I wanted to say "it's a virus" or "it's a bacteria," or "it's congential" (which weirdly, I think it can be with at least the human version). But I think prion disease is actually the classification.

I tend to think it's probably less likely to actually occur in cloned meat than bred meat, but I really don't know anything about it.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

I tend to think it's probably less likely to actually occur in cloned meat than bred meat, but I really don't know anything about it.

I think it's an identical chance, since it's based entirely on feed, AFAIK.

[UGAalum94]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

I think it's an identical chance, since it's based entirely on feed, AFAIK.

Well, except that I'd expect cloned animals to be better screened and fed. It seems unlikely that you'd take the trouble to genetically engineer a cow and then use tissue from an infected cow or implant it into an infected cow. Or once the cow was born, feed it tainted food.

But maybe not.

[AKA_Monet]

Originally Posted by Alphagamuga

Thanks, I appreciate the info. Just so you all don't think I've been living in a cave, I want to say that I too knew that consuming the tissue was the way it was transmitted, even for cows, sheep, some game (there's an Elk form, I'm pretty sure), so I understood the "canniblism" element.

I just mistakenly believed that you could classify a prion transmitted illness, like I wanted to say "it's a virus" or "it's a bacteria," or "it's congential" (which weirdly, I think it can be with at least the human version). But I think prion disease is actually the classification.

I tend to think it's probably less likely to actually occur in cloned meat than bred meat, but I really don't know anything about it.

A close collegue of mine studies encephalopathies and prions in Deer. He is a vet.

As I understand it, the research is unclear about "vertical transmission" of animal prions to humans, i.e. CJD (Cruzfeldt Jakob Disease). Molecularly, it is easy to understand, disease research is showing that misfolded proteins muck up a cellular system in a lot of diseases that ranges from cancer to heart disease. But that is is cellular or in vitro assays.

Within 10 years or our lifetimes, these kinds of diseases and treatment options will be solved... Newer kinds of drugs will be used to treat these factors. They will emmanate from the HAART treatments from HIV/AIDS.

As far as cloning, one could introduce various meat enhancing genes or substances to boost meat quality for superior meat cuts. If you can purchase a low to non-fat tenderloin or filet mignon that melts in your mouth, would you buy it even if it cost $100 per lb?

Or animals that had a superior immune system that did not require adding excessive amounts of antibiotics that they eventually become antibiotic resistant?

Or improved overall fitness with minimal amounts of movements because of the lack of feeding range or increased output of milk that would not require further processing because it is healthy right from the cow?

The ability to clone would be limitless.

Alas, others fear what little they know. When was the last acceleration of animal vet care, husbandry and food processing science in this country? 1940's? That is too long of a time to not have barely any new innovations with all the bioinformatics that we know now...

[UGAalum94]

Thank you for your answer.