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  #1  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:31 PM
valkyrie valkyrie is offline
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Barbaro is a miracle sent from God. I think we should clone him so we could create 90,000 Barbaros.
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  #2  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:37 PM
DeltAlum DeltAlum is offline
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/\/\/\Doesn't know who Barbaro is.
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  #3  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:47 PM
KSigkid KSigkid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltAlum View Post
/\/\/\Doesn't know who Barbaro is.
Barbaro is the horse that won the Kentucky Derby and was a heavy favorite for the Triple Crown. However, in the Preakness, Barbaro broke his leg (foot?) and almost had to be euthanized at the track. He's recovered, and has been the subject of a whole lot of media coverage following the accident.

It was scary to watch when it happened, but there has been a bit of obsession in some corners with the story.
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  #4  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:48 PM
OtterXO OtterXO is offline
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Back to cloning....I was under the impression (albeit, possibly mistakenly) that cloning would be beneficial to the dairy/meat industry b/c they could genetically engineer the perfect dairy or beef cow and then clone it to maximize profits. So for example, Bessy (Super Cow), produces the maximum amount of milk ever seen from a cow and all the Bessy clones will now produce the same amazing amount of milk. It theoretically would take the "guesswork" out of breeding. Right? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Personally, I will laugh the day I see "Clone-free" on pints of Ben & Jerrys. It sounds so sci-fi.
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  #5  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:55 PM
AlphaFrog AlphaFrog is offline
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Originally Posted by OtterXO View Post
So for example, Bessy (Super Cow), produces the maximum amount of milk ever seen from a cow and all the Bessy clones will now produce the same amazing amount of milk. It theoretically would take the "guesswork" out of breeding. Right? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
I guess I can see the benefit. However, that's assuming that milk production is a genetic, not an environmental/circumstantial thing. Not trying to TMI, but I produced HUGE amounts of milk when I had my first baby, but with this one, I've been just barely producing enough.
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  #6  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:58 PM
Drolefille Drolefille is offline
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Originally Posted by AlphaFrog View Post
I guess I can see the benefit. However, that's assuming that milk production is a genetic, not an environmental/circumstantial thing. Not trying to TMI, but I produced HUGE amounts of milk when I had my first baby, but with this one, I've been just barely producing enough.
ew ew ew ew ew ew ew

/yeah I'm 12 okay?
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  #7  
Old 12-29-2006, 05:03 PM
AlexMack AlexMack is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaFrog View Post
I guess I can see the benefit. However, that's assuming that milk production is a genetic, not an environmental/circumstantial thing. Not trying to TMI, but I produced HUGE amounts of milk when I had my first baby, but with this one, I've been just barely producing enough.
That's where rBGH comes in. This hormone, given to cows, allows them to produce a lot of milk. The hormone doesn't show up in the milk and it's safe to cows.
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  #8  
Old 12-29-2006, 09:32 PM
blueangel blueangel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by centaur532 View Post
That's where rBGH comes in. This hormone, given to cows, allows them to produce a lot of milk. The hormone doesn't show up in the milk and it's safe to cows.
Again, you are mistaken on both counts. The safety has been questioned by numerous agencies, scientists and doctors.

Samuel S. Epstein, M.D. Chairman of the international Cancer Prevention Coalition maintains that the link between rBGH and cancer is "indisputable." He has written a whole book on it, as well as presenting evidence of "the corporate wrecklessness of Monsanto" (who, by the way, is behind this current cloning push) and "the complicity of the FDA."

In this news release, he talks of the difference between natural milk and Genetically engineered (GE) through rBGH:

"GE milk is entirely different from natural milk: nutritionally; biochemically; pharmacologically; and immunologicaly. It is also contaminated with: pus and antibiotics used to treat mastitis; high levels of the GE hormone; and high levels of the naturally occurring growth factor IGF-1. Elevated levels of IGF-1 in GE milk have been strongly associated with high risks of colon, breast and prostate cancers, besides promoting their invasiveness."

http://www.preventcancer.com/publica...ilkRelease.htm

Regarding safety to cows... Monsanto has been forced to label Posilac (Posilac is the Monsanto brand name for the rBGH) as follows:

Mastitis.
Cows injected with POSILAC are at an increased risk for clinical mastitis
(visibly abnormal milk). The number of cows affected with clinical
mastitis and the number of cases per cow may increase.

In addition, the risk of subclinical mastitis (milk not visibly abnormal)
is increased. In some herds, use of POSILAC has been associated with
increases in somatic cell counts. Mastitis management practices should be
thoroughly evaluated prior to initiating use of POSILAC.

General Health.
Use of POSILAC is associated with increased frequency of use of medication
in cows for mastitis and other health problems.

Cows injected with POSILAC may experience periods of increased body
temperature unrelated to illness. To minimize this effect, take
appropriate measures during periods of high environmental temperature to
reduce heat stress. Care should be taken to differentiate increased body
temperature due to use of POSILAC from an increased body temperature that may occur due to illness.

Use of POSILAC may result in an increase in digestive disorders such as
indigestion, bloat, and diarrhea.

There may be an increase in the number of cows experiencing periods of
"off-feed" (reduced feed intake) during use of POSILAC.

Studies indicated that cows injected with POSILAC had increased numbers of enlarged hocks and lesions (e.g. lacerations, enlargements, calluses) of
the knee (carpal region), and second lactation or older cows had more
disorders of the foot region. However, results of these studies did not
indicate that use of POSILAC increased lameness.

Injection Site Reactions.
A mild transient swelling of 3-5 cm (1-2 inches) in diameter may occur at
the injection site beginning about 3 days after injection and may persist
up to 6 weeks following injection.

Some cows may experience swellings up to 10 cm (4 inches) in diameter that remain permanent but are not associated with animal health problems.

However, if permanent blemishes are objectionlble to the user,
administration of the product to the particular animal should be
discontinued. Use of POSILAC in cows in which injection site swellings
repeatedly open and drain should be discontinued.

Additional Veterinary Information:
Care should be taken to differentiate increased body temperature due to
use of POSILAC from an increased body temperature that may occur due to
illness.

Use of POSILAC has been associated with reductions in hemoglobin and
hematocrit values during treatment.

Additional Information:
Milk production response during each 14-day injection period is cyclic and
will be greatest during the middle of each period.

No milk discard or preslaughter withdrawal period is required.
-------
Going back to Dr. Epstein-- he says:

"By 1989, analysis of available industry information showed clear evidence of adverse veterinary effects, especially reproductive and a high incidence of mastitis. Additionally, Monsanto files, leaked to me from the FDA in October 1989, showed clear evidence of other serious pathology in cows injected with the GE hormone. Review of these documents by Cong. John Conyers, Chairman of the House Committee on Government Operations, led to the serious accusation that "Monsanto and FDA have chosen to suppress and manipulate animal health test data," besides data on contamination of GE milk with high levels of the GE hormone."

http://www.preventcancer.com/press/r...s/nov18_99.htm
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  #9  
Old 12-29-2006, 09:33 PM
valkyrie valkyrie is offline
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So don't eat cows. Win/win!
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  #10  
Old 12-29-2006, 05:16 PM
OtterXO OtterXO is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaFrog View Post
I guess I can see the benefit. However, that's assuming that milk production is a genetic, not an environmental/circumstantial thing. Not trying to TMI, but I produced HUGE amounts of milk when I had my first baby, but with this one, I've been just barely producing enough.
HAHA. That's totally TMI but I see your point. I think it could also be used for beef cattle so that they can clone the cattle that produce the best beef. It makes sense to me, but I'd like to know the effects it has on humans before consuming it.
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  #11  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:49 PM
valkyrie valkyrie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltAlum View Post
/\/\/\Doesn't know who Barbaro is.
OH MAN. For a start, here's his Myspace. You can rest easy that all information provided there is accurate, as this is not a biased .org website.
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  #12  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:53 PM
DeltAlum DeltAlum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valkyrie View Post
OH MAN. For a start, here's his Myspace. You can rest easy that all information provided there is accurate, as this is not a biased .org website.
Oh, that Barbaro.

I wasn't thinking horses...duh!

I thought he might have been some kind of cartoon character...

Or a Doc on Grey's Anatomy.

(the Elmer's Glue pop up on the Myspace page is funny)
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  #13  
Old 12-29-2006, 04:50 PM
AlexMack AlexMack is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by valkyrie View Post
Barbaro is a miracle sent from God. I think we should clone him so we could create 90,000 Barbaros.
I agree. But we can't eat them because the meat will make us mutate.
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