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11-02-2006, 11:42 PM
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GreekChat Member
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Yeah, the guy accusing him refuses to turn over the evidence he has...a little sketchy. That being said, I hate these pompous "evangelical leaders" who represent very little of American evangelical Christians
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11-03-2006, 01:30 AM
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Why would he resign if the allegations are false?
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11-03-2006, 01:33 AM
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Because he probably realizes that despite the truth of the matter, he won't be able to effectively lead the church.
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11-03-2006, 01:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shinerbock
Yeah, the guy accusing him refuses to turn over the evidence he has...a little sketchy. That being said, I hate these pompous "evangelical leaders" who represent very little of American evangelical Christians
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As an update, the accuser turned over some voice mail recordings to KUSA-TV who hired a nationally known voice analysis expert who was supposed to release his findings by this evening, and the early findings seem to support the charges. This guy, although in Denver, has been used in several very high profile cases as an expert.
More as it becomes available.
It does seem like the timing may be part of a personal agenda, though.
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11-03-2006, 01:47 AM
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Here's the update:
http://www.9news.com/acm_news.aspx?O...181LX9ARbPg%3D
The nationally recognized voice recognition expert believes the Haggard DID contact accusor in the case.
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11-03-2006, 01:53 AM
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I wouldnt be surprised if it was him. I just hate when people act like these people represent conservatives, or even evangelical Christians. Believe it or not, most Southern Baptists don't like Jerry Falwell, and don't condone bombing abortion clinics. The media and others have done a good job equating "evangelical" with "fundamentalist" (in the radical sense). A more realistic portrayal of a evangelical leader, and one who is more conservative than the average evangelical Christian, is Dr. James Dobson.
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11-03-2006, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shinerbock
The media and others have done a good job equating "evangelical" with "fundamentalist" (in the radical sense).
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The public in general (and many Christians, for that matter), have forgotten what fundamentalism originally meant, I think. It's another word that has become so amorphous, and sometimes coded, that one has to be careful with it.
Of course, a similar observation could be made about "evangelical," which originally simply meant Protestant, especially Lutheran Protestants as opposed to Reformed (Calvinist) Protestants or Anabaptists.
Quote:
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A more realistic portrayal of a evangelical leader, and one who is more conservative than the average evangelical Christian, is Dr. James Dobson.
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Though I wouldn't be classified as an "evangelical Christian" as that term is usually used (and as I understand you to be using it), I think you're right.
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11-03-2006, 12:07 PM
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This from AP:
"The acting senior pastor at New Life, Ross Parsley, told KKTV-TV of Colorado Springs that Haggard admitted that some of the accusations were true.
"I just know that there has been some admission of indiscretion, not admission to all of the material that has been discussed but there is an admission of some guilt," Parsley told the station."
Here is a DeltAlum opinion -- for whatever anything may think it's worth.
To coin a phrase, "Power Corrupts."
That's true of some politicians, many chief executives and other high ranking officials, and even powerful religious leaders.
As people become more powerful and influential, they begin to believe that they are not subject to the same standards as we simple mortals -- some even believe they are above the law.
The fact that Haggard is a minister/spiritual leader, and even more, leader of a huge organization certainly makes it more shocking. In reality, misdeeds are not uncommon -- even among people at this level. Look at some of the recent (and past) political scandals.
A final comment on the man who brought the situation to light. It has been said above (by me among others) that he might have a political agenda, given the timing of these charges. To his credit, he admits it. He heard that Rev. Haggard was leading efforts in several states against gay marriage and other gay rights bills/amendments.
Again, this is an opinion, but it seems to me that the difference here is that the guy has little to gain personally, with the exception of what he feels is right for the gay community. He isn't running for office or supporting any candidate.
To me, that seems to make a difference.
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11-03-2006, 12:09 PM
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I really don't care whether its political or not, if he did it, he did it. However, I don't think this guy who got paid to have sex with him is advancing any noble cause here. He's filth too.
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11-05-2006, 03:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeltAlum
Here is a DeltAlum opinion -- for whatever anything may think it's worth.
To coin a phrase, "Power Corrupts."
That's true of some politicians, many chief executives and other high ranking officials, and even powerful religious leaders.
As people become more powerful and influential, they begin to believe that they are not subject to the same standards as we simple mortals -- some even believe they are above the law.
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The following is a link to a story in this mornings Rocky Mountain News...
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drm...118233,00.html
Interesting.
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The above is the opinion of the poster which may or may not be based in known facts and does not necessarily reflect the views of Delta Tau Delta or Greek Chat -- but it might.
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11-03-2006, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shinerbock
I wouldnt be surprised if it was him. I just hate when people act like these people represent conservatives, or even evangelical Christians. Believe it or not, most Southern Baptists don't like Jerry Falwell, and don't condone bombing abortion clinics. The media and others have done a good job equating "evangelical" with "fundamentalist" (in the radical sense). A more realistic portrayal of a evangelical leader, and one who is more conservative than the average evangelical Christian, is Dr. James Dobson.
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The biggest problem is, these people (Falwell, Dobson, Haggard, et al.) say that they represent the Christian conservatives. And very few people stand up to them to say "No, you don't." So, when they get caught doing something hypocritical, it ends up making all evangelicals and fundamentalists look bad.
And, not to harp on you, but your earlier comment: "Despite the truth of the matter, he won't be able to effectively lead the church." I believe going back to my Bible studies, the big JC led his group pretty effectively when he was being accused of all kinds of things. I think if I were a preacher, falsely accused of something, I would go to the "WWJD" question and follow his lead.
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11-03-2006, 12:33 PM
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Don't group those people in with Dobson. He's a little too strong for my tastes sometimes, but he's not a "God hates fags" type of person. I'm an evangelical Christian, and I don't know anybody who respects Falwell on any level.
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11-03-2006, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shinerbock
Don't group those people in with Dobson. He's a little too strong for my tastes sometimes, but he's not a "God hates fags" type of person.
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He's not? In my opinion, Dobson is pretty hateful.
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