Why do multicultural GLOs/organizations exist?

[bows&toes]

Originally Posted by jubilance1922

So its only the non-wealthy Black people who you don't like cause they cause all the crimes?

Yeah.....sure....

Not all, but you should check some statistics, it will probably surprise you. Here is one for you:

Of the approximately 1,700,000 interracial crimes of violence involving blacks and whites, 90 percent are committed by blacks against whites. Blacks are 50 times more likely than whites to commit individual acts of interracial violence. They are up to 250 times more likely than whites to engage in multiple-offender or group interracial violence.

There are MANY more equally as shocking statistics out there, these things may not be pleasant to recognize but it's these pesky things we call facts.

[jubilance1922]

Originally Posted by bows&toes

Not all, but you should check some statistics, it will probably surprise you. Here is one for you:

Of the approximately 1,700,000 interracial crimes of violence involving blacks and whites, 90 percent are committed by blacks against whites. Blacks are 50 times more likely than whites to commit individual acts of interracial violence. They are up to 250 times more likely than whites to engage in multiple-offender or group interracial violence.

There are MANY more equally as shocking statistics out there, these things may not be pleasant to recognize but it's these pesky things we call facts.

I'd like to see the actual numbers, because the beauty of "statistics" is that they can be skewed to support whatever argument you want.

As for white collar crime not hurting anyone, I bet all those folks who lost their retirement funds due to Enron would disagree. On some level, crime hurts someone, even though it may not be you.

[shinerbock]

I'm not sure if you're trying to change the subject, but white collar crime has nothing to do with what we were talking about. I really could care less if I live close to someone who does insider trading. However, if theres a rapist or murderer in my neighborhood, I would.

[Taualumna]

Originally Posted by shinerbock

I'm not sure if you're trying to change the subject, but white collar crime has nothing to do with what we were talking about. I really could care less if I live close to someone who does insider trading. However, if theres a rapist or murderer in my neighborhood, I would.

Rapists and murders can be of all races and classes.

[shinerbock]

Are you people serious? Holy crap, really, of all races AND classes! Amazing. Of course they can be anything. But the FACT is that they're more common in certain areas, and by certain races and classes.

[macallan25]

What the hell is wrong with you people. Take the damn bags off your heads and smell the coffee. Go to the US Department of Justice, a governmental agency that I really don't think you can refute. The statistics are compiled from arrests and convictions. The tables don't lie. The facts don't lie.

[PhDiva]

Okay, what does crime statistics have to do with the fact that MCGLO's should have the right to exist or not? Nothing. It's just some BS that Shinerbock threw out there to justify his/her attitudes toward lower class minorities and poor folks. The reality is that most MCGLO's or BGLO's or AGLO's, etc are composed of members who are educated (or in the process of becoming educated) and professional. Folks who are either striving to be or have achieved some degree of upward mobility.

The fact of the matter is that in the U.S. race is a volatile issue (as demonstrated by this thread) and that minorities and mixed-raced or multiculturally minded people have to deal with close-minded idiots who want to argue about crime statistics rather than deal with the fact that their organizations often do not promote dialogue, cohension or interaction with people of color, etc. Whether it is an official policy or a form of dejure segregation, BGLO's, MCGLOs and other non-historically white GLO's came into existence b/c of an unwillingness for folks to deal with their racial prejudice and a sense of entitlement where any minority person that does join their organization is expected to assimilate such that they downplay their racial/cultural heritage in order to make other folks feel comfortable. I have plenty of friends and students of mine who are black and joined these groups and when confronted with some serious racial discrimination from members of their organization, they were told to just let it go. Now, I'm not saying that all historically white organizations allow for blatant discrimination to occur within their groups but let's be real - we have a long way to go in the area of race relations in this country to think that all people of color are going to be readily embraced by historically white GLOs. Discussions about race often make white folks uncomfortable b/c they have to face the reality (often unwillingly) of their unearned skin privilege. So, I sincerely doubt every historically white GLO has members who are mature enough and willing to find out why people of color are not willing to join their organizations.

Save the crime statistics drivel for a more appropriate topic. MCGLO's exist because America has a long way to go in the race relations department.

PhDiva

[macallan25]

Originally Posted by PhDiva

Discussions about race often make white folks uncomfortable b/c they have to face the reality (often unwillingly) of their unearned skin privilege. So, I sincerely doubt every historically white GLO has members who are mature enough and willing to find out why people of color are not willing to join their organizations.

Save the crime statistics drivel for a more appropriate topic. MCGLO's exist because America has a long way to go in the race relations department.

PhDiva

Explain to me your thoughts on my "unearned skin privelege." Seeing as how I am white, I would like to know why you feel I havent earned the right to well, be an affluent white person. I think you are pretty much full of shit on this point.

You say that people of color aren't "willing" to join our organizations like we are throwing bids at them and they are declining them. Rather ignorant if you ask me. You speak like MCGLOs being put into place is a bad thing? I don't see how. Its a good place for people of like minded culture and traditions to be together and form relationships.

I am sorry, but I just don't see, especially in the South, blacks and minorities lined up at prominent white top fraternites wanting to receive a bid. I mean, show me a black guy that likes Huey Lewis and the News, Steve Winwood, Texas Music, Widespread Panic, wearing loafers and croakies, and is educated in fine Scotch and cigars......and i'd probobly think he was pretty badass........I have yet to see it......anywhere......period.

Why do you feel that historically white, prominent chapters have to embrace minorities and diversify? It is their right to be selective.

[shinerbock]

Welcome to reality. Sometimes, in the course of conversation, new subjects come up. Get over it, its a message board.

Once again, we don't really discriminate on race. We don't feel black people will fit in our fraternity, so we don't actively recruit them. They're not banging down our door for a bid.

Also, my discrimination is based on how a person acts, not their skin color.

[bows&toes]

Originally Posted by PhDiva

Okay, what does crime statistics have to do with the fact that MCGLO's should have the right to exist or not?

Nothing I was just commenting on previous posts by jubulance(sp?) vs shinerbock.

I think MCGLO's have every right to exist. As long as traditional IFC orgs don't get pressured to become more multi-cultural and inclusive I don't see a problem.

[bows&toes]

Originally Posted by jubilance1922

I'd like to see the actual numbers, because the beauty of "statistics" is that they can be skewed to support whatever argument you want.

As for white collar crime not hurting anyone, I bet all those folks who lost their retirement funds due to Enron would disagree. On some level, crime hurts someone, even though it may not be you.

The source for my statement was taken from:
www.amren.com/colorofcrime/color.pdf
The New Century Foundation, 2717 Clarkes Landing, Oakton, VA 22124
Tel. (703) 716-0900, Fax. (703) 716-0932

If that is not convincing enough I can show a few more:

Characteristics of State Prison inmates.
"Based on current rates of first incarceration, an estimated 28% of black
males will enter State or Federal prison during their lifetime, compared to
16% of Hispanic males and 4.4% of white males."
source: http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/crimoff.htm

U.S. Department of Justice
Bureau of Justice Statistics
Homicide trends in the U.S.
Trends by race
-Blacks were 7 times more likely than whites to commit homicide in 1999
(25% Blacks, 4% Whites)
source: http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/race.htm

There is a ton more.

My point here is not to rub this in anyones face, I am validating shinerbocks posts on the subject. I share a similar view, my parents live in the "richest county in Texas". They moved here 8 years ago when most of the neighborhood was white, and crime was almost non-existent. The only crime to report was underage drinking by high school students.
Now that I come home from college everything has changed. I see minorities everywhere, my parents house value is dropping like lead because of it. I also notice the crime rate skyrocketed. My cousin just recently got mugged and held up by gunpoint, beat up, pistol whipped in his head, etc for his wallet. It was on his birthday and him and his gf were taking a walk in the park (July 4th). These kids ended up being 11th grade football players at the local high school apparently trying to emulate rap culture by being "gangsta". This type of thing NEVER happened when I went to school here, but now is getting to be very common.
-Minorities heard of the nice area.
-The rich ones started moving in.
-Produced the demand for affordable housing in the area for other minorities to follow.
-Apartment complexes start popping up.
-There goes the neighborhood.

[SOPi_Jawbreaker]

The statistics still may not tell the whole story. There's iniquity in who is being watched/targeted by law enforcement and also iniquity in the sentencing of white criminals and the sentencing of minority criminals.

African American Youth Are Treated Differently By the Juvenile Justice System
Drugs. According to the National Survey on Drug Use and Health, among youths aged 12 to 17, the rate of current illicit drug use was 11.1 % among whites, and 9.3% among African Americans.[4] In a previous year, the same survey found that white youth aged 12 to17 are more than a third more likely to have sold drugs than African American youth.[5] The Monitoring the Future Survey of high school seniors shows that white students annually use cocaine at 4.6 times the rate of African Americans students, use crack cocaine at 1.5 times the rate of African Americans students, and use heroin at the same rate of African Americans students, and that white youth report annual use of marijuana at a rate 46% higher than African American youth.[6] However African American youth are arrested for drug offenses at about twice the rate (African American 314 per 100,000, white 175 per 100,000) times that of whites,[7] and African American youth represent nearly half (48%) of all the youth incarcerated for a drug offense in the juvenile justice system.[8]

Weapons. According to the Center on Disease Control’s annual Youth Risk Behavior Survey, in 2001 whites and African Americans reported similar rates of carrying a weapon (whites 17.9%, African Americans 15.2%), and similar rates of carrying a gun (whites 5.5%, and African Americans, 6.5%).[9] African American youth represent 32% of all weapons arrests, and were arrested for weapons offenses at a rate twice that of whites (69 per 100,000, versus 30 per 100,000).[10]

Assault. According to the Center on Disease Control’s annual Youth Risk Behavior Survey, African Americans report being in a physical fight at a similar rate (36.5%, versus 32.5% for whites), but were arrested for aggravated assault at a rate nearly three times that of whites (137 per 100,000, versus 48 per 100,000).

“The existence of much larger racial and ethnic differences in arrest rates than in self-reported violence is a matter of great concern. On the one hand, there is no reason to expect similar distributions, because these measures were designed to assess different aspects of violence. But if both measures are valid and reliable, the discrepancy suggests that the probability of being arrested for a violent offense varies with race/ethnicity.”—Youth Violent: A Report of the Surgeon General, January, 2001.[11]

Justice Policy Factsheet

[bows&toes]

Originally Posted by SOPi_Jawbreaker

The statistics still may not tell the whole story. There's iniquity in who is being watched/targeted by law enforcement and also iniquity in the sentencing of white criminals and the sentencing of minority criminals.

African American Youth Are Treated Differently By the Juvenile Justice System
Drugs. According to the National Survey on Drug Use and Health, among youths aged 12 to 17, the rate of current illicit drug use was 11.1 % among whites, and 9.3% among African Americans.[4] In a previous year, the same survey found that white youth aged 12 to17 are more than a third more likely to have sold drugs than African American youth.[5] The Monitoring the Future Survey of high school seniors shows that white students annually use cocaine at 4.6 times the rate of African Americans students, use crack cocaine at 1.5 times the rate of African Americans students, and use heroin at the same rate of African Americans students, and that white youth report annual use of marijuana at a rate 46% higher than African American youth.[6] However African American youth are arrested for drug offenses at about twice the rate (African American 314 per 100,000, white 175 per 100,000) times that of whites,[7] and African American youth represent nearly half (48%) of all the youth incarcerated for a drug offense in the juvenile justice system.[8]

Weapons. According to the Center on Disease Control’s annual Youth Risk Behavior Survey, in 2001 whites and African Americans reported similar rates of carrying a weapon (whites 17.9%, African Americans 15.2%), and similar rates of carrying a gun (whites 5.5%, and African Americans, 6.5%).[9] African American youth represent 32% of all weapons arrests, and were arrested for weapons offenses at a rate twice that of whites (69 per 100,000, versus 30 per 100,000).[10]

Assault. According to the Center on Disease Control’s annual Youth Risk Behavior Survey, African Americans report being in a physical fight at a similar rate (36.5%, versus 32.5% for whites), but were arrested for aggravated assault at a rate nearly three times that of whites (137 per 100,000, versus 48 per 100,000).

“The existence of much larger racial and ethnic differences in arrest rates than in self-reported violence is a matter of great concern. On the one hand, there is no reason to expect similar distributions, because these measures were designed to assess different aspects of violence. But if both measures are valid and reliable, the discrepancy suggests that the probability of being arrested for a violent offense varies with race/ethnicity.”—Youth Violent: A Report of the Surgeon General, January, 2001.[11]

Justice Policy Factsheet

Statistics on drug use are based on surveys which are FAR from accurate. I used to work for a company that compiled surveys of such a sort.

As far as the statistics on gun ownership, lots of older white men like to collect guns, go hunting, etc. I havent met too many black gun owners that go hunting, maybe thats just me though.

[shinerbock]

Also, the last 2 don't really make any point. Carrying a weapon has little to do with a weapon arrest. Black people probably carry unregistered weapons more, leading to more arrests.

Also, getting in fights is different from aggravated assault. Aggravated assault is often with a weapon, with the intent to rape, etc...Thus, getting beat up by a gang is aggravated assault, while a fight between two fraternity boys usually would not be. Aggravated assault occurs with some sort of intent to harm, while fighting is usually simply a rage thing, not a true intent to kill or seriously harm another person.