Meet the US Army's 1st 4 star Female General

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

not really in the mood to go down that road with you...

Too late.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by pbear19

I understand the concept, but I think the logical fallacy is the assumption that anyone will make such a huge leap. One could surmise that this will make people look more favorably on the military in general, but to extrapolate that out to a political candidate with no concrete connection is taking it too far. (It's not like she has any personal connection to McCain that we know of, or that he had anything to do with her promotion.) This isn't that slow of a news cycle. I also think that fewer people than you might believe automatically connect McCain with all things military, but that's a personal opinion that I do not have stats to back up. Yes, he was a war hero, but it was a long time ago and doesn't mean he has immediate ties to all current military goings-on. If we were discussing someone recently removed from military experience the logic might work better. I agree that there is a chance this is political, but just because it is political doesn't mean it has anything to do with McCain.

Why is this any more fallacious than, say, you thinking that because you don't make the leap, no one will?

Or that the (perceived, or even relative) efficacy of the action has any bearing on whether or not the concept is possible?

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

POOR SAVE.

Stop recommending ways to say it better when others got his point. Just admit you didn't understand, and went on a tangent, and be done with it.

Thank you darling

[pbear19]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

Why is this any more fallacious than, say, you thinking that because you don't make the leap, no one will?

Or that the (perceived, or even relative) efficacy of the action has any bearing on whether or not the concept is possible?

To answer the second point, I never said it wasn't possible, I said it is illogical. All kinds of illogical things are possible, but their possibility does not make them logical.

As to the first point, you are more than welcome to say that you disagree with my position, or that you find it to be illogical. I am not trying to prove the original point, I am merely stating my own opinion. My single opinion in some part disproves the original point, as did the opinion of the other people in this thread who disagreed with it. The person making the initial point has the onus of backing it up in some logical fashion, and I believe that was not done. Hence I consider the premise to be illogical. PhiGam didn't say maybe a couple of people will buy into it, and I didn't say that maybe a couple of people wouldn't. My interpretation of the original point was that PhiGam believes this to be an intentional political ploy with the possibility that a good number of people will make what I consider to be an illogical leap, and I am challenging that premise.

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by pbear19

To answer the second point, I never said it wasn't possible, I said it is illogical. All kinds of illogical things are possible, but their possibility does not make them logical.

As to the first point, you are more than welcome to say that you disagree with my position, or that you find it to be illogical. I am not trying to prove the original point, I am merely stating my own opinion. My single opinion in some part disproves the original point, as did the opinion of the other people in this thread who disagreed with it. The person making the initial point has the onus of backing it up in some logical fashion, and I believe that was not done. Hence I consider the premise to be illogical. PhiGam didn't say maybe a couple of people will buy into it, and I didn't say that maybe a couple of people wouldn't. My interpretation of the original point was that PhiGam believes this to be an intentional political ploy with the possibility that a good number of people will make what I consider to be an illogical leap, and I am challenging that premise.

That's fair but obviously I don't have the resources to prove that this would have a significant effect or to prove the Army's motive behind the promotion. Perhaps it was just a coincidence that she is promoted during the slow news cycle that leads up to the first election since 2000 with a republican running without incumbent status. I, however, feel that it is entirely possible that this move was a political move by the military.

[pbear19]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

I, however, feel that it is entirely possible that this move was a political move by the military.

Fair enough. I disagree, obviously. There is also the question of whether the 'military' (which is such an ambiguous term, in many ways) is without question in favor of McCain, and would thus work in specific action to support him. While 'the military' is probably more likely to support McCain, the individuals who were responsible for promoting this deserving woman may or may not be pro-McCain. Again, I think it far more plausible that the political move had nothing to do with him, if it was indeed a political move at all. I think it is fair to surmise that 'the military' can do things for its own purpose without the need to turn it to presidential politics. But, I think I'm repeating myself now.

[Leslie Anne]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

Its a subconscious thing, people's minds naturally seek association. If they start to associate the military with things that they view as positive (female accomplishment for example) and they associate the military with a certain presidential candidate (a war hero) then they ARE more likely to vote for that certain candidate then they were before. Admittedly, it does take pretty abstract logic to grasp the concept.
Basically
If Military= good and McCain=military then McCain=good.
Its a classic logical fallacy that political experts (which the military has plenty of) know how to exploit.

Just to throw something else out there...

Isn't it somewhat likely that at least one person might look at this and think:

Woman = Good
Not just a white male world anymore
Women and Minorities = Good
Obama = Good

Personally, I don't think it was a political move because the result is so flimsy. None of us will ever know though.

ETA: Just to clarify, I don't actually believe it was done to help Obama.

[PhiGam]

Originally Posted by Leslie Anne

Just to throw something else out there...

Isn't it somewhat likely that at least one person might look at this and think:

Woman = Good
Not just a white male world anymore
Women and Minorities = Good
Obama = Good

Personally, I don't think it was a political move because the result is so flimsy. None of us will ever know though.

ETA: Just to clarify, I don't actually believe it was done to help Obama.

Thats a solid argument. I can almost guarantee that military leaders support McCain more than they would support Obama. I haven't met too many career military people who are democrats, even if their views are liberal.

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by PhiGam

Thank you darling

yerah...like you needed saving...you are a grown boy...sometimes you should know better than debate me because you know how all these will end....but you keep coming back.....


finish it.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

yerah...like you needed saving...you are a grown boy...sometimes you should know better than debate me because you know how all these will end....but you keep coming back.....


finish it.

How did this end in your mind?

( @ PhiGam...only today will I not fuss about being called "darling")

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

How did this end in your mind?

I'm guessing





In reality,

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

I'm guessing





In reality,

wrong...that's not what I am even thinking....

These debates never end nicely, they end up messy on both ends.

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

I'm guessing





In reality,

Exactly.

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

wrong...that's not what I am even thinking....

These debates never end nicely, they end up messy on both ends.

Dramatic, much?

Your post to him was rather Roy Jones Jr. "ya'll musta forgot"-ish.


(for the win: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWIqZKhNY90)

[DaemonSeid]

Originally Posted by DSTCHAOS

Exactly.



Dramatic, much?

Your post to him was rather Roy Jones Jr. "ya'll musta forgot"-ish.


(for the win: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWIqZKhNY90)

and you care...because?

[DSTCHAOS]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

and you care...because?

Awww...him sensitive.

When all else fails, ask why usernames "care."

This was a funny thread and Roy Jones Jr. is funny. If you didn't chuckle, boooo to you.