Race & Sororities

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by agzg

Does it really matter that the OP is biracial? Does having one white parent entitle you to NPC membership? Does having one black parent entitle you to NPHC membership?

No.

This entire thread is dumb.

[ThetaDancer]

Originally Posted by deepimpact2

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...,58980,00.html

GEORGIA[FONT=Arial]
Athens 2000 A member of the Alpha Gamma Delta sorority filed a racial discrimination complaint when other members insisted on rejecting a black freshman applicant. The University of Georgia temporarily suspended the sorority during an investigation.
These are just a few incidents involving predominately white sororities and fraternities. It's not just hearsay or instinct or gossip, and for the record I have never read Pledged so you need to stop even bringing that up.

I read the Georgia article first because I was curious about what research you were using to make you such an expert on NPC membership selection. I haven't read the rest of your articles, but will when I have time.

The Georgia example you cite is pretty weak. Aside from the fact that you're using a decade-old magazine article as a reference for what you're calling a current event, the entire case was based around a "she-said she-said" argument, with nothing substantiating the claims. The statement of a single disgruntled member who has no evidence, nothing at all except her own version of the story, to support what she's alleging, will rarely be considered sufficient evidence to support a claim. After a thorough examination, investigators could find "not one hint" of racism. I'm sure you have some personal theory about why that's the case, and that's fine because I'm really not trying to get into a debate about NPC membership selection with you, but your research is sloppy, at best.

I don't doubt you've "heard" lots of examples. But when you use such an insufficient example to back up your claim, it really undermines your credibility.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by ThetaDancer

I don't doubt you've "heard" lots of examples. But when you use such an insufficient example to back up your claim, it really undermines your credibility.

I agree and this goes back to what Munchkin was saying.

[deepimpact2]

Originally Posted by ThetaDancer

I read the Georgia article first because I was curious about what research you were using to make you such an expert on NPC membership selection. I haven't read the rest of your articles, but will when I have time.

The Georgia example you cite is pretty weak. Aside from the fact that you're using a decade-old magazine article as a reference for what you're calling a current event, the entire case was based around a "she-said she-said" argument, with nothing substantiating the claims. The statement of a single disgruntled member who has no evidence, nothing at all except her own version of the story, to support what she's alleging, will rarely be considered sufficient evidence to support a claim. After a thorough examination, investigators could find "not one hint" of racism. I'm sure you have some personal theory about why that's the case, and that's fine because I'm really not trying to get into a debate about NPC membership selection with you, but your research is sloppy, at best.

I don't doubt you've "heard" lots of examples. But when you use such an insufficient example to back up your claim, it really undermines your credibility.

The point was to show examples that racism IS a problem. You might think the article was weak. Others may disagree. Your opinion doesn't necessarily serve for all of mankind in that regard. Besides, as I said, these are just a few examples. I can and probably will post more.

[SWTXBelle]

Originally Posted by UMryanne13

Hi
I'm a bi-racial (black/white) female attending Ole Miss in the fall. I want to rush, but I don't want to limit myself to historically black sororities. Is race a deciding factor in most sororities? Are any of you members of sororities with members of a race other than the majority?

Any advice or information will be greatly appreciated.

I'll try and make it simple for you, deepimpact2. The OP asked if race was a deciding factor - YOU chose to take off on a tangent about racially insensitive acts by GLOs when you couldn't come up with anything to support your assertion other than one old accusation. That, MC, is the tangent. Of course race will be discussed in this thread, but it is supposed to be about race and membership selection. When DP3 was called out on her use of heresay and her own opinion, she started throwing anything that could be construed as racist at the thread.

DP3 couldn't provide anything relevent other than that one 9 year old lawsuit - and didn't even provide evidence that the group in question was found guilty. I'm "done" because you won't stick to the topic in the thread or deal with any issues brought up by other posters. St. Augustine tells us that we need not try to convince those who are willfully stubborn - so I am quite content with the information I have provided ON TOPIC and in support of any pnm who wishes to do her research and chose between any and all of the sororities at her campus.

[deepimpact2]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

I'll try and make it simple for you, deepimpact2. The OP asked if race was a deciding factor - YOU chose to take off on a tangent about racially insensitive acts by GLOs when you couldn't come up with anything to support your assertion other than one old accusation. That, MC, is the tangent. Of course race will be discussed in this thread, but it is supposed to be about race and membership selection. When DP3 was called out on her use of heresay and her own opinion, she started throwing anything that could be construed as racist at the thread.

DP3 couldn't provide anything relevent other than that one 9 year old lawsuit - and didn't even provide evidence that the group in question was found guilty. I'm "done" because you won't stick to the topic in the thread or deal with any issues brought up by other posters. St. Augustine tells us that we need not try to convince those who are willfully stubborn - so I am quite content with the information I have provided ON TOPIC and in support of any pnm who wishes to do her research and chose between any and all of the sororities at her campus.

I provided information for more than one incident. If you originally felt that my accusations were baseless, then you should have been happy that I actually started pulling information as evidence of what I was talking about. Your response suggests otherwise and raises questions in my mind. My information IS on topic. It shows that in some cases race is still a problem and the OP may find herself being faced with race issues.

[SWTXBelle]

Originally Posted by deepimpact2

I provided information for more than one incident. If you originally felt that my accusations were baseless, then you should have been happy that I actually started pulling information as evidence of what I was talking about. Your response suggests otherwise and raises questions in my mind. My information IS on topic. It shows that in some cases race is still a problem and the OP may find herself being faced with race issues.

Race in MEMBERSHIP SELECTION is the topic - only ONE of your articles deals with race and membership selection, and it is hardly convincing evidence of a system-wide problem.

No one has said race isn't a "problem" on college campuses or elsewhere. The issue is NPC membership selection, and I guess NPHC membership selection, too.

Maybe I can simplify it further:

Race in membership selection - on topic.
Racially insensitive actions by GLOs - not on topic.

[deepimpact2]

Originally Posted by SWTXBelle

Race in MEMBERSHIP SELECTION is the topic - only ONE of your articles deals with race and membership selection, and it is hardly convincing evidence of a system-wide problem.

No one has said race isn't a "problem" on college campuses or elsewhere. The issue is NPC membership selection, and I guess NPHC membership selection, too.

Maybe I can simplify it further:

Race in membership selection - on topic.
Racially insensitive actions by GLOs - not on topic.

Those incidents also show how a tone can be set on a campus that would discourage black women from even trying to be a part of those groups. Furthermore, if members of these groups participate in racist activities, do ou really think they would then vote in someone black? Those activities demonstrate a certain mindset...one that isn't very accepting of blacks.


http://chronicle.com/news/article/1708/sorority-evictions-at-depauw-u-raise-questions-about-bias-and-looks

http://media.www.dakotastudent.com/media/storage/paper970/news/2008/03/28/News/Controversy.Surrounds.November.Sorority.Party-3289876.shtml

[KSUViolet06]

Originally Posted by deepimpact2

http://chronicle.com/news/article/1708/sorority-evictions-at-depauw-u-raise-questions-about-bias-and-looks

What in the world does Depauw have to do with race?

Now you're reaching.

[SWTXBelle]

Originally Posted by deepimpact2

Those incidents also show how a tone can be set on a campus that would discourage black women from even trying to be a part of those groups. Furthermore, if members of these groups participate in racist activities, do ou really think they would then vote in someone black? Those activities demonstrate a certain mindset...one that isn't very accepting of blacks.


http://chronicle.com/news/article/1708/sorority-evictions-at-depauw-u-raise-questions-about-bias-and-looks

http://media.www.dakotastudent.com/m...-3289876.shtml

You mean that perhaps qualified black women, for whatever reason, are not going through recruitment at all? Hmmmm . . . where I have heard that before?

If your take on it were true, we wouldn't see black or minority members of NPC chapters - and yet we do(even in the South!!!). That is the ultimate proof of what I and other NPC members have said - that no NPC group has a racial requirement, and that many blacks and other minorities have found a home in the groups of the NPC. That is not to say that it MIGHT or MIGHT NOT be an issue at Ole Miss - it could. But as I pointed out before and as you ignored, if qualified black women do not go through recruitment it will never change. AND even if the op were not to get a bid, it could be something other than her race.

So - deepimpact2 - what exactly is it you are telling the op? That she shouldn't even try?

[baci]

OMG, there are countless reasons young women do not find a home in an NPC chapter and race may very well just be one of them. All interested and qualified black women should go through recruitment. There are more reasons to go through recruitment than to not go through. To even say this person would not get an invitation is ridiculous. She should try as many young women I know did try ages ago. Did they all pledge - no. Many dropped out just as many young white women dropped. Funny thing, several of the black women I know became little sisters to some amazing " majority white" fraternities and that was way back in the day. Go figure!

[baci]

that made me chuckle just a bit KSUViolet^^

[FSUZeta]

when several people (me, aopiangel, ksuviolet, swtxbelle, zillini, munchkin, et al) read your words and get the understanding that you are condemning ALL, not some, npc sororities of racism, it is more than coincidence-it is YOUR poor choice of words. you don't want us to harp, then edit your statement.